Strobes

txflyer

txflyer

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O.k., let's kick this debate off.

Strobes on or off for VFR day taxi?

I got called names (boo-hoo:sad:;)) for saying I leave mine on permanently. Mind you I don't have a beacon, and in another old thread that pointed it out, I thought it was good joo-joo since you will never go home and leave the master on... :dunno:
 
If the plane doesn't have a beacon then they should go on. If the plane has a beacon, strobes don't go on until I'm on or crossing a runway.
 
txflyer said:
Strobes on or off for VFR day taxi?
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Off. Pointless waste of electrons, and very annoying/distracting to any other pilot near you.

I got called names (boo-hoo:sad:;)) for saying I leave mine on permanently. Mind you I don't have a beacon, and in another old thread that pointed it out, I thought it was good joo-joo since you will never go home and leave the master on... :dunno:
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I won't call you names to your face, but I'll curse you under my breath if you stick your flashing wingtip strobe in my face in the run-up area.
 
MauleSkinner said:
Is it legal to turn them off for a VFR day taxi?
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Yes.
(b) Operate an aircraft that is equipped with an anticollision light system, unless it has lighted anticollision lights. However, the anticollision lights need not be lighted when the pilot-in-command determines that, because of operating conditions, it would be in the interest of safety to turn the lights off.
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If you've ever had someone's strobes flashing in your face, you'd have no doubt that it is in the interest of safety to leave them off on the ground in daylight.
 
Ron Levy said:
Off. Pointless waste of electrons, and very annoying/distracting to any other pilot near you.

I won't call you names to your face, but I'll curse you under my breath if you stick your flashing wingtip strobe in my face in the run-up area.
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See, that's the funny thing to me because nobody's strobes have ever bothered me on a clear day. Night yes, cloudy, yes, but sunny? No.

It's like a welder Ron, don't look at it. ;)
 
Ron Levy said:
Yes.
If you've ever had someone's strobes flashing in your face, you'd have no doubt that it is in the interest of safety to leave them off on the ground in daylight.
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He didn't say it was because they were flashing in somebody's face...he said he got called names for having them on.
 
It wasn't me who called you any names, all I did was ask one person why they would automatically turn them on before contacting the tower after the runup.
 
txflyer said:
O.k., let's kick this debate off.

Strobes on or off for VFR day taxi?

I got called names (boo-hoo:sad:;)) for saying I leave mine on permanently. Mind you I don't have a beacon, and in another old thread that pointed it out, I thought it was good joo-joo since you will never go home and leave the master on... :dunno:
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Likewise.
 
MauleSkinner said:
He didn't say it was because they were flashing in somebody's face...he said he got called names for having them on.
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Yes, and I'm deeply hurt. :lol:


Hey, I can adapt.

If the board conglomerate says "HEY! TURN YOUR ****ING STROBES OFF!" I'll start turning them off ...
 
Strobes are installed as recognition lights. Call me names all you want but when my prop's spinning my recognition lights are on as a courtesy to other pilots and airport occupants to alert them of a moving plane/spinning prop. It doesn't bother me to land while a plane on the threshold has strobes going. Anyone who complains about that is just looking for something to complain about.

My beacon is wired to the strobe switch. All or nothing.
 
Mine are on anytime my motor is running.....

Don't like it..:dunno:.......

LOOK the other way.......:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:
 
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I'll have the beacon on anytime the master is on.
Once I line up on the active, I mash the hdg bug and flip on taxi and strobe lights.
 
Mine are rarely on. Night and IFR always, but CAVU VFR... not usually.
 
My are usually on. I would probably shut them off until at the hold short line at night but I haven't flown at night in almost four years.

Gsxrpilot said:
Mine are rarely on. Night and IFR always, but CAVU VFR... not usually.
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I'm based at the non-radar class D airport. The controller says they help immensely in locating us during the day if we have them on. So I have them on. That situation is not typical though. OTOH if it helps the controller that much, wouldn't it stand to reason that it would help other pilots in the air to see us also?
 
Just asked, because more and more the strobes are the plane's only anti-collision light system, and do must be on - with that one exception.

Both my prior plane, a Cirrus, and my current Sky Arrow are like that, and on both the checklists call for strobes on either right before or right after engine start.
 
Mine are always on for taxi, especially in a congested Bravo airport, I dont want to be mistaken for a little bug splat on the wind screen amongst heavy iron and I want people to see my movement.

I also appreciate seeing a strobe of someone back taxing or at the end of a 4000ft-6000ft uncontrolled runway since the plane isnt always crisp and clear with my old man eyeballs....:confused:

Ironically they are off for airborne IFR en-route, dont like the flash in the clouds or fog, and I should be on radar anyway but "ON" for VFR en-route so other bugsmashers can see me closing in at a snails pace from a few miles out. :dunno:
 
Ron, my strobes, H.I.D. wig-wags and LED nachelle and nav lights would blow your mind.

I can instigate epilectic seizure's in people. :lol:
 
I have a rotating beacon, top, and a single white strobe, belly, switched together, which are on any time the master is on.

The remaining strobes (both wing tips and tail, comet-flash zingers) are switched on when cleared for takeoff (or crossing runway), off when clearing runway. Habit, and it avoids blinding others in the night time.
 
txflyer said:
Ron, my strobes, H.I.D. wig-wags and LED nachelle and nav lights would blow your mind.

I can instigate epilectic seizure's in people. :lol:
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HID wig-wag in the wingtips, triple-flash strobes on wingtips and top of fin, LED light in the nose-bowl - I'll take ya on in the seizure inducement category...and for some reason people always wave after I turn most of them off...
 
Clark1961 said:
HID wig-wag in the wingtips, triple-flash strobes on wingtips and top of fin, LED light in the nose-bowl - I'll take ya on in the seizure inducement category...and for some reason people always wave after I turn most of them off...
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They're not waving--they are making sure it's clear in front of them because they can't see anything except the red & green after-flashes ftom your lights . . .

My red/white LED belly flasher is always on, as is my new last year LED landing light. Nav lights only at night, no strobes yet, still waiting on LED to be approved.
 
Strobes go on before engine start.

It's just another way of telling the world that the giant meat cleavers are about to start whirling.
 
I've just started turning them on all the time unless there's a reason to turn them off. Daytime, there's never a reason unless I'm inside a cloud. :)

Story from a friend from long ago when he was flying a certain turboprop airliner...

The airplane had white belly and topside beacons instead of red, and they were pretty bright. But had to be on whenever props were moving of course.

One really dark night where everyone is backed up in multiple conga lines and the ramp is a disaster of airplanes all over the place waiting on weather and departure clearances, a grumpy competing airline guy whines to the Ground Controller, "Could you have XXX turn off their strobes for us, please?"

Friend was a Captain at the time.

And the aircraft wingtip was juuuust about cockpit height on the whining guy's airliner.

And the FO was grumpy that night, too.

Before he could stop him, FO slaps the real strobe switch on exactly as he finishes this sentence on-air:

"Those aren't strobes! THESE are strobes!" BANG... Right in the complainer's face.

LOL.

He flipped them right back off.

Not a word was said by the original complainer or the ground controller. :)
 
Didn't the chief counsel write a letter saying that all lights had to be on whenever the airplane is in motion, even on the ground?

Running strobes on the ground is very rude, and not good practice, but I'd hate to incur the wrath of the chief.
 
JimNtexas said:
Didn't the chief counsel write a letter saying that all lights had to be on whenever the airplane is in motion, even on the ground?

Running strobes on the ground is very rude, and not good practice, but I'd hate to incur the wrath of the chief.
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It's funny -- I see strobes on the ground on every flight, and I've never considered it anything but SOP.

Why would blinking lights be "rude" in the daytime?
 
I only use the strobes when entering or crossing a runway, but that's mainly to keep it consistent with what I'm required to do at work. My puny brain has a hard enough time making the transition from 'work flying' to 'fun flying', so many procedures I carry from one to the other.

That said, people using their strobes during daylight hours while taxiing don't bother me in the slightest.
 
OFF.

Strobes and everything else you got when on a runway, strobes and landing lights off when off the runway.

Same with transponder, shy of somewhere like LAS where they want it on all the time, just set it to STBY or if you have a garmin it'll gomtom GND itself.

Don't be THAT guy.


Jay Honeck said:
Strobes go on before engine start.

It's just another way of telling the world that the giant meat cleavers are about to start whirling.
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With the work plane, when there aren't any marshals around, I'll give one burst on the strobes before I crank it over, but as Sean Connery would say, one Ping only please.
 
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James331 said:
OFF. ..strobes and landing lights off when off the runway.
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"No person may...(b) Operate an aircraft that is equipped with an anticollision light system, unless it has lighted anticollision lights."

I guess we need an interpretation of "operate".

The definition is:

"Operate, with respect to aircraft, means use, cause to use or authorize to use aircraft, for the purpose (except as provided in §91.13 of this chapter) of air navigation including the piloting of aircraft, with or without the right of legal control (as owner, lessee, or otherwise)."

My inclination is that even when taxiing, one is "operating" an aircraft if taxiing "for the purpose of air navigation".

All this still assumes that the strobes are the "anti-collision light" system. If they are just supplemental to a beacon, they could be seen as optional.
 
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FastEddieB said:
All this still assumes that the strobes are the "anti-collision light" system. If they are just supplemental to a beacon, they could be seen as optional.
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Yeah, that's how I justify (legally, at least) not using them while taxiing. Everything I fly has a beacon in addition to the strobes.
 
JimNtexas said:
Didn't the chief counsel write a letter saying that all lights had to be on whenever the airplane is in motion, even on the ground?



Running strobes on the ground is very rude, and not good practice, but I'd hate to incur the wrath of the chief.
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Yes.

Generally I don't let the Counsel fly my airplane, but having them on in daylight isn't threatening anyone's safety, might actually enhance safety, and serves to help find out who the whiners are, if they're brave enough to say something, thus making it much easier to avoid them in life in the future.

Nothing rude about it. They're not bright enough to be rude during the day. Mine aren't anyway. Adjust accordingly for yours.

The point someone made about keeping their procedures consistent, is noted. That person wouldn't be wandering over whining at others later on.

Plenty of aircraft with no beacons that have to use the strobes. It really shouldn't be any surprise to see strobes operating anywhere these days. The majority of aircraft without a beacon are the spiffy "modern" ones where the manufacturer decided to save a hundred bucks on $300K+.

Not really worried about the Counsel letter but that letter has unintended consequences at a trial for a ground impact later when the photo of the switch in the off position is presented as Exhibit 26 in an attempt to make you look more like a bad pilot (you already ran into something, it's a matter of degree and $$ awarded at that point) and the Counsel's letter is Exhibit 25.
 
FastEddieB said:
"No person may...(b) Operate an aircraft that is equipped with an anticollision light system, unless it has lighted anticollision lights."

I guess we need an interpretation of "operate".

The definition is:

"Operate, with respect to aircraft, means use, cause to use or authorize to use aircraft, for the purpose (except as provided in §91.13 of this chapter) of air navigation including the piloting of aircraft, with or without the right of legal control (as owner, lessee, or otherwise)."

My inclination is that even when taxiing, one is "operating" an aircraft if taxiing "for the purpose of air navigation".

All this still assumes that the strobes are the "anti-collision light" system. If they are just supplemental to a beacon, they could be seen as optional.
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Well there the book and there's life.

According to that they would have me taxi by the flight line at 0100 with my strobes blasting away, that ain't going to happen.

I do recall something in there that said "unless the PIC deems it unsafe" or something like that.


Ether way, if I am not on the active I'm just taxi, position and beacon.
 
James331 said:
OFF.

Strobes and everything else you got when on a runway, strobes and landing lights off when off the runway.

Same with transponder, shy of somewhere like LAS where they want it on all the time, just set it to STBY or if you have a garmin it'll gomtom GND itself.

Don't be THAT guy.





With the work plane, when there aren't any marshals around, I'll give one burst on the strobes before I crank it over, but as Sean Connery would say, one Ping only please.
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Except they've updated the AIM:

AIM 4-1-20 said:
Civil and military transponders should be turned to the “on" or normal altitude reporting position prior to moving on the airport surface to ensure the aircraft is visible to ATC surveillance systems.
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4-3-23 also recommends as much light as possible prior to ground movement, but I don't bother with strobes until I cross the hold short unless I know that it's bright enough out that it won't bother anybody. I don't bother with nav lights during the day either since you won't be able to see them unless you're close enough that it wouldn't matter anyways.
 
Last I checked the AIM isn't regulatory.

I've approached fields with multiple targets, just students taxing and sitting around with their xpdr on
 
denverpilot said:
The majority of aircraft without a beacon are the spiffy "modern" ones where the manufacturer decided to save a hundred bucks on $300K+.
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I was surprised when it was pointed out that my new-to-me demo Cirrus had zero lights anywhere on the tail.

The position lights are red or green to the front and white to the rear, taking the place of a tail position light. I did not know that was even legal.

And now my Sky Arrow is identical in that regard, along with no beacon.

From an owner's perspective, at least it is one less thing to worry about!
 
Last I checked I operate my plane on gravel taxiways that are often populated with sight-seeing tourists in their cars, dog walkers, stroller-pushing moms, and my favorite, joggers with earbuds in and the volume up. Your recognition priority is probably different than mine so to assign your environment's conditions to others who operate in very different conditions is misguided. Pick what works for you and do it for your reasons. Respect that others will do the same.
 
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