Straight in approach, your general procedure in a 172(or equiv)

Discussion in 'Pilot Training' started by exncsurfer, Feb 17, 2017 at 9:40 AM.

  1. exncsurfer

    exncsurfer Cleared for Takeoff

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    the artist formerly known as: jimbilly
    We all fly patterns throughout training and get our groove based on that, so when you're given a straight in by ATC, what do you typically do?

    The reason I ask is because I did this on Monday, and its kinda tricky compared to a pattern approach to landing. I got on the glide slope(lights) at about pattern altitude and it seemed to take forever to get in and required more power than i'd typically carry in a pattern approach. I think an approach more similar to the pattern would be to come in at pattern altitude and keep speed up until I get 3 white, then get slowed down and stabilized.

    I know wind will change all this, I'm just wondering if you have a general process or rule of thumb that you use for straight ins.

    Next time, I will get a bit higher and closer in before pulling power back.
     
  2. jordane93

    jordane93 Final Approach

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    Long, straight in approaches are one of the more difficult things to do. Try configuring a little later if you find yourself dragging it in.
     
  3. eman1200

    eman1200 Final Approach PoA Supporter

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    I wouldn't say I have a 'procedure' other than just flying the plane to the runway, but I DO believe at least one straight in should be standard protocol during training. the "standard pattern" is so ingrained that the first time they throw something atypical your way you're like 'huh?!?'

    otherwise, I just kind of 'roll out' all the normal legs into one straight line. eyeball where u think you'd be on downwind/base/final and do all the things you'd normally do.
     
  4. NJP_MAN

    NJP_MAN Cleared for Takeoff

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    1.Descend to pattern altitude. 2.Proceed to capture the VASI, PAPI or normal visual cues. 3. Set your normal approach power setting for your aircraft, add flaps as necessary. 4. Land the airplane
     
  5. Bill Jennings

    Bill Jennings Final Approach

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    Aim to be at pattern altitude 3mi out, then begin visual descent to runway, follow PAPI/VASI if available.
     
  6. exncsurfer

    exncsurfer Cleared for Takeoff

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    Yea, well that is what I did that seemed too slow. It worked fine, I'm just looking more to replicate the pattern 'feel'.
     
  7. labbadabba

    labbadabba Cleared for Takeoff

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    Typically for me in a 172, losing airspeed isn't an issue so I keep the power in and drop it in once I'm within 2 miles/gliding distance. When I'm starting the approach/descent, I'm usually at 90kias. That's below the white arc so you can throw in flaps at any point. Typically I'm at 1 notch of flaps at 2 miles, 2 notches and 80kts at 1 mile, and then full flaps and decreasing airspeed to 65kias on short final.
     
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  8. 455 Bravo Uniform

    455 Bravo Uniform Pre-takeoff checklist

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    Low time VFR PPL here. Just figuring with math:

    At a 400-500 fpm rate of descent in a 172, and TPA of 1000 ft AGL, it should take 2 minutes to land from the time I'm abeam the numbers and pull power and add flaps in a regular DW-Base-Final pattern.

    If I convert that to ground speed in a no wind situation, on a direct final entry, at 75kts, that 2 minutes = 2.5 nautical miles out (which theoretically should be the linear distance from abeam the numbers to landing).

    Now being able to judge 2.5 miles on long final? Practice or landmarks.
     
  9. Bill Jennings

    Bill Jennings Final Approach

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    • Three miles out at TPA, reduce power, put in 1st notch of flaps.
    • Two miles out, add second notch
    • One mile out, add third if field is made

    In the Mooney, gear comes out at 3mi as well, but I need the drag before I point the nose downhill.
     
    Last edited: Feb 17, 2017 at 10:07 AM
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  10. mscard88

    mscard88 Final Approach

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    I just fly cruise until maybe a mile out and then begin to slow and configure. Flew into ATL a few times in a Bo and was doing 160-170 down the slide (ATC requested it) and whacked it out, I mean reduced the power, slowed, configured, and landed.
     
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  11. Ravioli

    Ravioli Ejection Handle Pulled

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    Don't worry that is seems slow. If they gave you a straight in they won't run a bizjet up your six. Unless as Card says they ASK you to keep your speed up, then you'll be like "it's a 172, this IS fast". ;)

    Use the time to run a couple more GUMPS checks.

    Same thing happens when you're given a base entry, yah?
     
  12. mscard88

    mscard88 Final Approach

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    Or read the paper...
     
  13. exncsurfer

    exncsurfer Cleared for Takeoff

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    Yea, I just used google earth measure tool to try and replicate my normal pattern and stretch it out, that puts me about 1nm out at pattern altitude, which would be a 9deg. glide slope, so all the lights would be white at that point. So I'm thinking next time I get one, i'll keep my speed up and maintain pattern altitude till I get 3 white(possibly 4) then pull the power back to normal descent and set up my normal config. I think this will get me down faster and be a more familiar 'feel'.

    Thanks for the responses everyone, this is what I was looking for.
     
  14. exncsurfer

    exncsurfer Cleared for Takeoff

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    Yea, pretty much, but its more of an eyeball process since you don't have the light info. Another thing the lights can be misleading since they're configured for the 1000 ft markers and I typically land before 500ft.
     
  15. Salty

    Salty Pre-takeoff checklist

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    Fly to threshold using AOA and then pull chute
     
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  16. exncsurfer

    exncsurfer Cleared for Takeoff

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    I was wondering how long it would take for AOA to make an appearance! I actually considered it in the OP, haha.
     
  17. flyingron

    flyingron Touchdown! Greaser!

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    The original FAA guidance still holds. Your visual approach begins at what the FAA calls the "key position." In a rectangular pattern this is right after you turn base leg. On a straight in, just unfold the base leg (about twice the distance you'd have flown the base). From there you decide, "what do I need to get the glidepath I want from here." Hopefully just as when flying downwind, you've reduced power and slowed to an appropriate speed in anticipation of hitting the key point.
     
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  18. somorris

    somorris Pattern Altitude

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    I would suggest going out sometime to a non-towered airport that isn't busy and practicing. Try coming in from 5 or 6 miles, descending the entire way and see how the runway looks. I base my straight in approaches mainly on the appearance of the runway. With a 172, you can make some pretty significant adjustments close in if you need to. Also, if you don't like the way things are going, go around! Then you can fly a regular pattern. You can get the hang of straight in approaches if you practice them a little.
     
  19. ktup-flyer

    ktup-flyer Cleared for Takeoff PoA Supporter

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  20. Ravioli

    Ravioli Ejection Handle Pulled

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    Are you crazy? He only does 24 mile finals in that slick ass bird. What we need is a video of how to do a 45* entry to the downwind in a Cirrus. That would be an A+ stunt!
     
  21. rk911

    rk911 Pre-takeoff checklist

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    this. I get a good mix of pattern and straight in approaches at my home field so to me it's 6 of one/half dozen of the other. with time and practice you'll get the hang of it.
     
  22. EppyGA

    EppyGA Final Approach

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    WOT until 1 mile out, chop the throttle, haul back on the yoke, drop the flaps and slip it like a motha. :D
     
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  23. flyingron

    flyingron Touchdown! Greaser!

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    That's my IAD approach. In the 172 it was fly to the numbers WOT, close the throttle, 10 degrees of flaps at 110, 40 at 85, slip hard. You can make the first turnoff (4500' down the runway). In the Navion, I close the throttle, haul back on the yoke, and then drop full flap and gear when I hit 87.
     
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  24. mscard88

    mscard88 Final Approach

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    IMPOSSIBLE! A Cirrus is above flying a little pilot's traffic pattern. ATC clears out all the rest for a Cirrus arrival. nearly always straight-in to final.
     
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  25. korben88

    korben88 Line Up and Wait

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    This is what I love about my instructor, he dishes out a lot of real world training. He's had me practice a couple straight in approaches, over fly the field at tpa+500 then tear drop to a midfield 45, mountain flying where we chased some sheep, landing and departing class bravo.

    None of these things are required by regulations but he includes them in his curriculum because it's stuff that flying around this area is good to know.
     
  26. mscard88

    mscard88 Final Approach

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    WHAT?! I thought chasing sheep was FAR 91.something. :D
     
  27. Ravioli

    Ravioli Ejection Handle Pulled

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    Is Utah another place where Men are Men and sheep need to watch their six?
     
  28. korben88

    korben88 Line Up and Wait

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    The whole speep thing came about because one of the reasons I wanted ti get my license is the ability to scout deer herds for hunting.
    I asked him how close we could get down to them, he spotted some sheep and ahowed me how close.
    It was much closer than I had thought :eek::eek:

    Naw, that's our neighbors to the north east....

    Well maybe down in the Fillmore Virgin Beaver area :D
     
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  29. Ravioli

    Ravioli Ejection Handle Pulled

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    Did you say Feel more Virgin's beaver area?

    Yet another thread headed for a lock.
     
  30. korben88

    korben88 Line Up and Wait

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    FILL more. But yeah, same thing.
     
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  31. EppyGA

    EppyGA Final Approach

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    I've done it once or twice in the Warrior when the tower asked me to keep my speed up.
     
  32. geneseib

    geneseib Line Up and Wait

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    After forty years it's become a non-issue, but I remember my first one. I remember thinking, "Whoa, how'd that runway end up right there under my nose."