"sterilize the runway"

She's headed out to sterilize the runway. Back in a sec.

698ccf42e24602acaee1461c8c0d4018.jpg
 
Haha. I got that from a Google search and it worries me now that I saw the domain name imprinted on the photo. But it does make it funnier!
 
mscard88 said:
Yep, F-4, F-105, F-104, and F-111 all had one. Current USAF fighters F-15, F-16, F-117 (actually retired), F-22 all have one. Don't know about the F-35.

Here's an F-16 about to engage.

View attachment 47981
Click to expand...

Wow, that looks nothing like a Navy tailhook. Looks it's on cable or something soft instead of a hard shaft?
 
My home airport is the same as the OP.

To answer a previous question, no you can't feel them if you roll over.

I used to think sharing the airport with F16s was cool. Now they're just an annoyance for me. I still think they're awesome, but they're annoying.

I've had the tower mention lowering the cable to me as well, but they never did use the term sterilize. Interesting.
 
fiveoboy01 said:
To answer a previous question, no you can't feel them if you roll over.
Click to expand...

You're saying if you takeoff/land over, or even taxi over the arresting gear you don't feel it? I disagree, and I've done it w/ GA planes and airliners. You feel it whether taking off over or slowing and taxing over it. Doesn't hurt anything but it is a good jolt going across at a good clip. We even had a Beech Skipper get stuck taxing over the cable because a 'donut' (holds the cable off the runway a couple of inches) became wedged between the wheel.
 
Last edited:
mscard88 said:
You're saying if you takeoff/land over, or even taxi over the arresting gear you don't feel it? I disagree, and I've done it w/ GA planes and airliners. You feel it whether taking off over or slowing and taxing over it. Doesn't hurt anything but it is a good jolt going across at a good clip. We even had a Beech Skipper get stuck taxing over the cable because a 'donut' (holds the cable off the runway a couple of inches) became wedged between the wheel.
Click to expand...

The airport the OP is at, most likely uses a BAK14. It's recessed in the runway and tower can raise it. Other systems, like the Navy / Marine E-28 is always raised with doughnuts unless derigged. Yes, rolling over those types would be noticed. I landed on one and it bounced me back into the air. :(
 
Velocity173 said:
The airport the OP is at, most likely uses a BAK14. It's recessed in the runway and tower can raise it. Other systems, like the Navy / Marine E-28 is always raised with doughnuts unless derigged. Yes, rolling over those types would be noticed. I landed on one and it bounced me back into the air. :(
Click to expand...

This is the biggest takeaway in this thread for GA types. The difference between E-28, BAK-12, and BAK-14. E-28 and BAK-12 do not recess into the runway, and the cross deck pendant needs to be stripped. BAK-14 recesses into the surface. I ALWAYS land past the arresting gear until I can confirm that it is de-rigged regardless of what tower says.

And I'm a card carrying member of the Tailhook organization of which you speak. Yes, the military PC-ness makes me not want to get out of bed on some days, but sexual assault is a crime and has no place in a civilized world.
 
NKTFlyer said:
This is the biggest takeaway in this thread for GA types. The difference between E-28, BAK-12, and BAK-14. E-28 and BAK-12 do not recess into the runway, and the cross deck pendant needs to be stripped. BAK-14 recesses into the surface. I ALWAYS land past the arresting gear until I can confirm that it is de-rigged regardless of what tower says.

And I'm a card carrying member of the Tailhook organization of which you speak. Yes, the military PC-ness makes me not want to get out of bed on some days, but sexual assault is a crime and has no place in a civilized world.
Click to expand...

None but the worst avgeeks would ever bother to memorize any of those types unless they regularly operate from a mixed use airport. And the vast majority, don't.

At best it's a briefing item for someone to discuss with them the first time they ever have a need to do so.

At worst, they'll just whack the thing after declaring an emergency and heading for a military airport.

At which point they're probably kissing the ground out of happy feelings, or because there's an M-16 pointed at their head from behind, or both.

But only the tiniest group of active online pilot-geeks will ever know what any of those letter/number combinations mean outside of those who operate at mixed fields.
 
Yes I assumed it was over a raised cable that post 48 was referring to, like you said most likely a BAK 14 as that's what the USAF uses at bases/airports with fighters and post 48 stated his airport had F-16s there. And yes, it can be lowered/raised by either tower or barrier maintenance.
 
arnoha said:
Wow, that looks nothing like a Navy tailhook. Looks it's on cable or something soft instead of a hard shaft?
Click to expand...

Hard shaft! Oh boy! Hehe... alright I'll behave.

I have no idea what the tail hook on Air Force fighters is made of, although I would assume a strong yet lighter metal to save weight. Having been a controller in the Air Force I can assure you it works and stops the jet when engaged. "Evil Eagle" is an Eagle driver and on POA, so maybe he'll fill us in.
 
NKTFlyer said:
This is the biggest takeaway in this thread for GA types. The difference between E-28, BAK-12, and BAK-14. E-28 and BAK-12 do not recess into the runway, and the cross deck pendant needs to be stripped. BAK-14 recesses into the surface. I ALWAYS land past the arresting gear until I can confirm that it is de-rigged regardless of what tower says.

And I'm a card carrying member of the Tailhook organization of which you speak. Yes, the military PC-ness makes me not want to get out of bed on some days, but sexual assault is a crime and has no place in a civilized world.
Click to expand...

No doubt that conduct is unacceptable but the witch hunt that ensued ruined the careers of many fine aviators who had no connection with the incident.
 
denverpilot said:
None but the worst avgeeks would ever bother to memorize any of those types unless they regularly operate from a mixed use airport. And the vast majority, don't.

At best it's a briefing item for someone to discuss with them the first time they ever have a need to do so.

At worst, they'll just whack the thing after declaring an emergency and heading for a military airport.

At which point they're probably kissing the ground out of happy feelings, or because there's an M-16 pointed at their head from behind, or both.

But only the tiniest group of active online pilot-geeks will ever know what any of those letter/number combinations mean outside of those who operate at mixed fields.
Click to expand...

You are right. It IS good enough to know that there is a huge metal wire strung across the runway without knowing exactly what model it is. A young person who is exploring the bounds of their new certificate by flying over to Savannah or Tucson or Atlantic City (none of which are obviously dual use to an outsider) who glosses over the description in the AFD or the airport diagram is going to have an extremely bad day when they rip the nose gear off of their Archer. The point is that they've been exposed to the terms BAK and E-28 now.
 
denverpilot said:
None but the worst avgeeks would ever bother to memorize any of those types unless they regularly operate from a mixed use airport. And the vast majority, don't.

At best it's a briefing item for someone to discuss with them the first time they ever have a need to do so.

At worst, they'll just whack the thing after declaring an emergency and heading for a military airport.

At which point they're probably kissing the ground out of happy feelings, or because there's an M-16 pointed at their head from behind, or both.

But only the tiniest group of active online pilot-geeks will ever know what any of those letter/number combinations mean outside of those who operate at mixed fields.
Click to expand...

No need to memorize. In a normal config, the cable is either recessed or completely removed off the runway. If the cable happens to be raised, ATC is required to inform you of a raised cable status and its position on the runway, unless already published.
 
Last edited:
NKTFlyer said:
You are right. It IS good enough to know that there is a huge metal wire strung across the runway without knowing exactly what model it is. A young person who is exploring the bounds of their new certificate by flying over to Savannah or Tucson or Atlantic City (none of which are obviously dual use to an outsider) who glosses over the description in the AFD or the airport diagram is going to have an extremely bad day when they rip the nose gear off of their Archer. The point is that they've been exposed to the terms BAK and E-28 now.
Click to expand...

If they're internet geek pilots. Most won't see this. ;)

Not a bad thing for CFIs near military fields to bring up on a Flight Review though. (Evil grin...)

"Let's say we had an emergency and had to land at Buckley... what interesting things might we note from the 'chart supplement'?

Next question of course for most would be, "What the hell is a chart supplement?"

"Funny you should ask..."
 
denverpilot said:
If they're internet geek pilots. Most won't see this. ;)

Not a bad thing for CFIs near military fields to bring up on a Flight Review though. (Evil grin...)

"Let's say we had an emergency and had to land at Buckley... what interesting things might we note from the 'chart supplement'?

Next question of course for most would be, "What the hell is a chart supplement?"

"Funny you should ask..."
Click to expand...
Chart supplement, hell, we're gonna see M-16s up close and personal.
 
Clark1961 said:
Chart supplement, hell, we're gonna see M-16s up close and personal.
Click to expand...

A'yup. Haha. That too.

CFI could also help them practice how one holds one's hands in the air and opens a Cessna door at the same time. Hahaha. Elbows man. Elbows.
 
denverpilot said:
A'yup. Haha. That too.

CFI could also help them practice how one holds one's hands in the air and opens a Cessna door at the same time. Hahaha. Elbows man. Elbows.
Click to expand...
I'm thinkin' A2's. I can take a 3 round burst of 0.22. Maybe. A lung shot I've got 10 minutes or so...
 
Another consideration is that landing on, or taking off over raised arresting gear (E-28, BAK-12) will frequently knock the gear out of battery. Not really an issue for slower, smaller GA aircraft, but certainly an issue for any larger jets. Not so bad for you as that aircraft, but bad for anyone else who wants to land or take off. Normally takes the gear folks around 5 mins or so to reset the gear after this happens, which fouls the entire runway until they are clear. Probably not a scenario that 90% of civilian pilots will really need to be aware of, but on the military side, it is a common problem. I've seen the approach end/short field gear at KNFL get knocked out of battery at least a half dozen times this week alone, to include twice in one day while I was taxiing (first) and minutes later while at the hold short (second). Granted fighter aircraft did it each time, but a business jet or even a heavy twin landing right on it would have the same effect. Bigger issue for most of you all is that it can and will snap up and hit the bottom of your aircraft if you are low enough to the ground. For that reason, in the F-16 if carrying a centerline tank, we don't cross raised gear greater than 90 knots (i.e. you takeoff and land past any gear).
 
Clark1961 said:
Chart supplement, hell, we're gonna see M-16s up close and personal.
Click to expand...

Working Eglin AFB tower one day and approach says they have a PA28 that is requesting to taxi to the airline terminal after landing (wanted to drop off a friend catching a flight). I check w/ base ops and they say negative, the PA28 will have to park on the base ramp. Now on these landlines there are other agencies listening also. So the PA28 lands and parks where base ops wants them to. Next to land is a commuter and naturally they will be going to the terminal. So they turn off runway 19 and onto the parallel taxiway for runway 12/30 which is a 12,000' runway so it's a bit of a taxi as the terminal is off the approach end of 12. About halfway down the taxiway the commuter calls and states there's a pickup blocking the taxiway w/ "guards" pointing rifles at them, yelling for them to shut down the engines.

I look out w/ binoculars and sure enough they are. We instruct them to shut down, there's a misunderstanding somewhere, and we will get it straighten out ASAP. Well we find out one of the agencies listening in was Security Police (Air Force PD) and they mistook the conversation I had w/ base ops about the Cherokee and reacted to an "unauthorized" civilian plane taxing to the terminal, which unfortunately was the commuter. Took a few minutes but we got it cleared up.

Years later (5-6) I retire from the Air Force and get on with a regional airline in ATL, the same airline that had the commuter incident. So after a few years there I was telling this same story in the crew lounge and this very senior pilot (#2 or 3) is standing and listening too. He states after I finish "that was me"! Too funny, small world. Sorry this was so long.
 
Aviation is a very small world. Funny story.

To me it sounds like the SP were a bit clueless about airplanes and airport ops and seriously overreacted.
 
SkyDog58 said:
To me it sounds like the SP were a bit clueless about airplanes and airport ops and seriously overreacted.
Click to expand...
If you had been in the Air Force, that wouldn't surprise you.
 
SkyDog58 said:
Aviation is a very small world. Funny story.

To me it sounds like the SP were a bit clueless about airplanes and airport ops and seriously overreacted.
Click to expand...

Well who ever was their guy listening is the one who f'd up. The others were only doing their duty and I would expect them to do what their plan called for them to do. On the other side of runway 12 was a Wing of about 60 F-15s, so that's probably their biggest concern, protecting those assets.
 
I understand all of that but if their command was listening into the conversation and reacting to it without visually verifying what is actually happening in regards to the conversation, then they were in the wrong. Did they not listen to the complete conversation or the radio and look out their window to see what was happening?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top