Stall/Spin after takeoff caught on video

Just WTF was that guy trying to prove?

See, jcran, just abbreviate them.
 
Read the report. Possible no compression on one head, Pilot unfamiliar with characteristics of the plane, and the CFI who said she did not train on stall techniques for this plane and that he had some issues but "was doing better". Seems like lots of bad things all at once.
 
jallen0 said:
Read the report. Possible no compression on one head, Pilot unfamiliar with characteristics of the plane, and the CFI who said she did not train on stall techniques for this plane and that he had some issues but "was doing better". Seems like lots of bad things all at once.
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How in the hell does a CFI give a checkout to a new pilot without doing stalls???

Sounds like potential grounds for a lawsuit.
 
Fearless Tower said:
How in the hell does a CFI give a checkout to a new pilot without doing stalls???

Sounds like potential grounds for a lawsuit.
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Stall practice is not recommended by LOBO for transition training in the Lancair line. I hear the same is true in other high performance aircraft also, not that a Wittman tailwind would fall into high performance classification...
 
FORANE said:
Stall practice is not recommended by LOBO for transition training in the Lancair line. I hear the same is true in other high performance aircraft also, not that a Wittman tailwind would fall into high performance classification...
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Lancairs are indeed unique, but every high performance aircraft I’ve flown (singles and twins) has stalls in the checkout. The only times I haven’t done stalls in the aircraft were jets where we did the stall routine in the sim.
 
Another reason the CFI's decision seemed off, at least to me:

"According to the AC, most of the pilot's total flight time was in airplanes with flight characteristics that could be defined as "Low-Inertia and/or High-drag." The Wittman Tailwind airplane has flight characteristics that are considered "High-Inertia and/or Low Drag" with "Light control Forces and/or Rapid Airplane Response."
 
Thanks for posting this. Very sad and trajic, and a wake up call
 
From wha
Fearless Tower said:
Lancairs are indeed unique, but every high performance aircraft I’ve flown (singles and twins) has stalls in the checkout. The only times I haven’t done stalls in the aircraft were jets where we did the stall routine in the sim.
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t I’ve heard if you want to practice stalls in those planes you should build a simulator.
 
What the heck? Looked like a zoom climb to slow flight or something?
 
From the quality and camera angle and distance it's hard to tell what's actually happening.
 
Put the nose down, I wonder if it was out of balance to the rear.
 
Mike Smith said:
Hadnt he turned almost 270 degrees?
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Looked like it. A turn as steep as that at an already low airspeed (climb speed) increases the load factor and therefore the stall speed, and in such a high-drag turn even more speed is lost. Maintain that bank for a few seconds while the speed decays to meet the stall...

One of the common shortcomings in pilot training is a good understanding of angle of attack and the effects of airspeed and load factors on it. The air is invisible, like electricity, so some people have a hard time picturing what's going on. And those that have never stalled and spun as a training exercise will almost always do the wrong thing when it starts. They'll pull back harder and use opposite aileron. If they had seen stalls from such scenarios they wouldn't get into that situation in the first place.
 
I’m amazed at how there wasn’t any post crash fire.

Climbout did look a bit on the steep side, but I wouldn’t really say it was *that* much steeper than most climb outs. Looked to me like he started getting into trouble once he made the turn, but than again, the chain began just before that initial turn was made.
 
Tarheelpilot said:
Lancair but I’m not so sure it’s an accurate assessment. I have never flown one but I find it hard to believe it is that bad
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Depends on the lancair. The older ones are a lot less forgiving than the later models
 
Tarheelpilot said:
Lancair but I’m not so sure it’s an accurate assessment. I have never flown one but I find it hard to believe it is that bad
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Have heard the same. From what I understand the stall characteristics of the IV-P are very violent and abrupt. A guy crashed one here a few years back after losing his engine at altitude and it was fatal. Needless to say, they don’t make very good gliders and they’re not for the novice pilot!
 
Is it common to have two different types of ignition systems and plugs on an EAB?
 
Lindberg said:
Is it common to have two different types of ignition systems and plugs on an EAB?
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Yes, some people electronic ignition for one plug and a standard magneto for the other.
 
Sad.

No fire. 270 degree turn back. Maybe it was a low fuel take off? Engine started sputtering, then stopped?

I’ve wanted to try this but haven’t yet, may do so in my BFR next month - at altitude start a climb at Vx, then pull power, see how quickly the speed bleeds down past Vso...will I be surprised at how fast speed drops off at an already steep angle of attack? And how will the plane react in that scenario? I’ll throw the idea at my CFI and see what he thinks.
 
PaulS said:
I wonder if it was out of balance to the rear.
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That was my thought. Or really really out of trim for takeoff? Do those have electric trim that could have runaway on him?

Someone else mentioned seat tracks, that also seems like a good possibility.
 
Lindberg said:
Is it common to have two different types of ignition systems and plugs on an EAB?
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Even some certified planes have them. Some of our pa28s and 172s have them. Runs more efficiently... when they work... Ive had multiple EIS issues in all our eis equiped planes. We CFIs hate them the mechanics hate them. Taking them out of some aircraft and multiple replacements from the manufacturer.

It’s got to the point iexpect them to run wonky and it’s a surprise when they work.
 
A student pilot spun one in at my old home base last week into trees. The airplane came to rest suspended from the trees so he unbuckled the 5 point harness and jumped down then walked out with scratches as the worst injury...
 
Tarheelpilot said:
A student pilot spun one in at my old home base last week into trees. The airplane came to rest suspended from the trees so he unbuckled the 5 point harness and jumped down then walked out with scratches as the worst injury...
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What was he flying?
 
This happend local to me...first time I saw this plane was at a young eagles event doing a low pass and zoom climb...it was fast like an RV and I was clueless as to the type...had to ask...never knew it was a new owner when it crashed. We had a fatal stall spin in a newly aquired Kolb Twinstar at our airfield less than two weeks ago...63 year old pilot and 93 year old family member...I think it was a very recent purchase as well.
 
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Ryanb said:
It really didn’t seem like a zoom climb though. Looked rather standard to me.
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I agree, that's what I thought. Even the turn and bank angle seemed normal. I'll have to watch again and zoom it out. Seemed like something "broke" to depart controlled flight like that. I dunno, could be the plane design.
 
New to him airplane, high angle of attack, cylinder #1 loses compression, quick entry into a stall, wing drops, WTF moment, too late to recover. Or not, I dunno.

Seemed OK until something really did not look right.
 
"Although the airplane is a long way from being a Cessna 210 in the overall handling and ride category, it is noticeably better than the aforementioned American Yankee. When the power is brought back, the stall characteristics are also reminiscent of the Yankee. Again, depending on the air-\plane. as it is crowded into the stall and held there. the break has a very slightly sharp edge and it may roll slightly in one direction or the other depending on how straight this particular builder got his rigging. The stall will happen around 55 mph and is coming down at a pretty fair rate of descent at that point.

Something worth playing with in the airplane is to start yanking and banking, putting some hard corners onto the machine and see what G does to its speed. As with all low-aspect ratio wings, it doesn't take a very hard pull to burn off a fair amount of speed. This is especially true when setting up for an approach. A ham-fisted pilot could burn off more speed than desired through his own negligence." -- http://www.airbum.com/pireps/PirepTailwind.html
 
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