So I did a bad thing

Discussion in 'Medical Topics' started by John1244, Nov 20, 2020.

  1. bflynn

    bflynn Final Approach

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    I do not know what other conditions you’re talking about. I will not attempt to explain to you the difference between chronic depression and high blood pressure, research it yourself.

    The bottom line is that there are certain conditions which require medicine and for which the pilot becomes unsafe if the medicine is not taken. The FAA has determined that some of those conditions require grounding regardless. They do not owe a potential pilot a “right” to fly, they owe the public a safe airspace.
     
  2. John1244

    John1244 Filing Flight Plan

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    It doesn’t work that way not by a long shot. You’d have to go weeks before you’d notice any difference. It’s not like high blood pressure medication...
     
  3. John1244

    John1244 Filing Flight Plan

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    We don’t “swing” on days. Lol. This is part of the problem is complete lack of understanding.
    I can assure you that’s inaccurate. Skipping a dose doesn’t result in magnitude more severe. Pleas. That’s willfully ignorant saying that taking NyQuil is less of a danger.
     
  4. PaulS

    PaulS Touchdown! Greaser!

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    And that's the problem " See, I feel fine with out that stuff, I'm cured...."
     
  5. bflynn

    bflynn Final Approach

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    So your focus is on the word "day"?
     
  6. Rgbeard

    Rgbeard Pattern Altitude

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    Edited to comply with RoC. Tread carefully.
     
    Last edited: Nov 22, 2020
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  7. Tantalum

    Tantalum Final Approach

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    So true.. even non prescription drugs. Tylenol is "safe" per the FAA and is probably the most ubiquitous pain killer people may take:
    https://www.faa.gov/licenses_certificates/medical_certification/media/OTCMedicationsforPilots.pdf

    But the list of side effects include things like headache, potentially severe dizziness, trouble breathing, unusual tiredness.. etc.

    This is where judgment comes in though.. maybe if you woke up with a raging headache and took 2 tylenol and now you are tired and dizzy you should skip the flight that day. Shouldn't need the FAA to come in and tell you that

    In fact, a huge amount of gov laws are because people lack reasonable, logical, judgment
     
  8. Dana

    Dana Pattern Altitude

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    Actually the Basicmed checklist says, "not including digital examination". So it's basically, "yeah, he's got one." Or perhaps it's "yeah, he is one."
     
  9. Daleandee

    Daleandee Line Up and Wait

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    I was arguing debating discussing with a gentleman at Church this morning about wearing masks. He wants the Governor to mandate mask wearing and that those that won't should be fined. I kindly disagreed asking if we are now going to clog up the court system with people with "refusal to mask-up" tickets. He said there wouldn't be no court as you would just have to pay the fine. I reminded him that we all get our day in court.

    Said that to say ... if people were reasonable, logical, and used proper judgement it would be easier to overcome a lot of life's difficulties. But until we all get over believing that "it's not about you it's all about me" nothing will ever really change. I don't see that happening so we continue to try to legislate morality and common sense ...
     
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  10. Dave Theisen

    Dave Theisen En-Route

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    I was in Frankfurt, Germany earlier this month where my coworker got cited for not wearing a mask in a designated area. Had to pay 50 Euros cash on the spot.
     
    Last edited: Nov 22, 2020
  11. Morgan3820

    Morgan3820 Pattern Altitude

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    ???
     
  12. ProjectInfinity1

    ProjectInfinity1 Pre-Flight

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    Lol look at the side effects of advil, or hell even oral tums https://www.webmd.com/drugs/2/drug-9574/tums-oral/details .

    I personally have Autism Spectrum disorder (was diagnosed with Asperger’s), ADD, and depression with a suicide attempt 3 years ago.

    Guess what? The Feds trust me with Explosives and heavy ordnance and I’m only 21.

    Someone want to explain to me why I can be trusted with a 60mm mortar, but medical approval for a leasure Piper 140 flights is too risky?

    The FAA has there system completely ass backwards and it is a disgrace.
     
  13. PeterNSteinmetz

    PeterNSteinmetz Pattern Altitude PoA Supporter

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    I believe ROC means Rules of conduct.
     
  14. Morgan3820

    Morgan3820 Pattern Altitude

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    What’s that?
     
  15. Half Fast

    Half Fast Final Approach

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  16. Pugs

    Pugs Line Up and Wait

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    My uncle, while "stationed" in Frankfurt with Boeing for three years got fined for both cutting his grass on Sunday and washing his car on Sunday. America is not Europe and we don't want to be. We're contrarian and self-determinant by our nature to our benefit and our detriment.
     
  17. Morgan3820

    Morgan3820 Pattern Altitude

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    I think that I have an answer to your question but I feel that in answering, I would Be perceived as violating the ROC. So I won’t answer your question.
     
    Last edited: Nov 23, 2020
  18. MuseChaser

    MuseChaser Pattern Altitude

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    I would assume the "Feds" trust you to handle those things under direct orders and supervision of commanding officers, or at least that you don't have the freedom to move around and use those explosives, heavy ordnance, and 60mm mortars as you wish. A more apt parallel would be the "Feds" allowing you to own a plane and use it with a CFI in the cockpit (sorry..."flight deck" ) with you, which you can do with or without a medical.
    I understand the frustration and anger voiced by two of the posters on this thread who have been denied or are having great difficulty securing a medical, but to be honest the angry hot-headed approach isn't an attractive quality in an applicant for a pilot certificate, medical or otherwise. Being mad usually works against you...even in an actual physical confrontation, much less a battle with bureaucracy.
     
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  19. Half Fast

    Half Fast Final Approach

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    I believe that, from @ProjectInfinity1 ’s prior postings, he is a civilian with a Federal license to own special weapons. He thinks it’s ridiculous that he can be entrusted with that license but not with a PPL.

    He has a point, but the argument could also be made in the other direction and a case made that he shouldn’t be able to have the weapons.

    In any event, there’s no expectation that the FAA and the BATFE talk to each other. Nothing says their rules have to be similar, nonsensical as it sometimes seems.
     
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  20. MuseChaser

    MuseChaser Pattern Altitude

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    I vaguely recalled something like that, which is why I included "... or at least that you don't have the freedom to move around and use those explosives, heavy ordnance, and 60mm mortars as you wish.... "

    Thanks for making it clearer... I remember that thread now. There certainly seems to be evidence to support questioning of all kinds of things.
     
  21. Half Fast

    Half Fast Final Approach

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    Sometimes it’s best to let lying dogs sleep. Poke too hard at this one, and we’re likely to get a requirement for a medical exam before we can buy a box of shotgun shells.
     
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  22. jstone

    jstone Ejection Handle Pulled

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    Either you can’t read properly or you’re just ignorant, but he didn’t say anything about feeling fine without meds and being cured.
     
  23. PaulS

    PaulS Touchdown! Greaser!

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    I read it properly, you are right, he didn't say it anything about people coming off meds but what was mentioned is how it starts, and it's an issue. I'm definitely not ignorant about it, I've seen it many times in people close to me and it becomes a cluster- F, every, single, time. If you don't understand that then maybe you are the ignorant one.
     
  24. ProjectInfinity1

    ProjectInfinity1 Pre-Flight

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    I am not a member of the US armed services, nor am I an employee with a federal/local law enforcement agency and I’m not an employee of a government contractor of any kind, I’m just a civilian firearms collector.
    I can transport any non High explosive Destructive Devices just like any other firearm in my state, and I have to send in a written form to ATF 4-6 weeks before I plan to take it out of state.

    As for a hot headed approach, you are correct, personally I’m not annoyed with bureaucracy, I’m annoyed of being stonewalled, and I 100% acknowledge venting such frustrations to a FAA examiner who doesn’t have any discretion and has to stick within the confines of the relevant regulations isn’t appropriate as simply it is not their fault.
    Maybe, though deep down, I hope the absurdity of it all could be enough of a attention getter to try for an exemption from a regional flight surgeon after a few more years put between my suicide attempt (3 years ago).


    1. You’re correct.
    2. Lol both answers could be correct depending on one’s point of view! but I’m certainly not advocating the latter of the two!!!
    3. This is also true on both accounts, however the silliness is astounding when one says “heavy weaponry is fine, but we feel you’re too much a danger to it’s to allow you to get a class 3 medical”.

    (The following sentences aren’t directed at you Half Fast, these are just rhetorical, wanted to make that clear as they could be perceived as otherwise condescending).

    My argument being if I had nefarious intention or serious imminent wish of self harm, why would I be here in the first place griping about medical regulations? And also if I was inattentive to the point of carelessness/negligence, how have I not have either accidentally blown my self up or shot myself yet?

    And for the love of god, please no one call the fbi or any other law enforcement agency on me again! :eek:
     
    Last edited: Nov 23, 2020
  25. ProjectInfinity1

    ProjectInfinity1 Pre-Flight

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    That is... equally frustrating that I could see that actually happening :(
     
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  26. MuseChaser

    MuseChaser Pattern Altitude

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    Without sounding glib hopefully, but perhaps you are an unusual case, and past data may indicate that the majority of people with your previous diagnoses and suicidal ideations and attempts are, indeed, a much greater risk to themselves and others in an airplane or with heavy ordnance in their posession? I don't know you, and I don't what past data is, either.. just thinking out loud. It's great that you feel healthy, in control, safe, and that you've come so far from where you were at one time. Given the ongoing push for greater and greater restrictions on citizens' right to bear arms especially of certain types (of arms, not of citizens), it is surprising to me that you were able to get licensed for the types of weapons you've been collecting given your history, but as long as you've done it legally (and I have NO reason to suspect you haven't), I'm glad you've found something enjoy, and I wish you success in your journey going forward to gain access to the sky as a pilot. To be honest, and I always am (which costs me the odd friendship every now and then, sadly), even as a staunch 2nd amendment supporter personally, the idea of a 21 year old private citizen with your mental health background collecting usable working heavy ordnance and other serious military grade weapons is a bit unsettling. I don't know you, and if I did, I may VERY well not have that feeling. Just going from some posts typed on the internet. Not trying to be offensive or put you down in any way.
     
  27. bflynn

    bflynn Final Approach

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    the FAA has a different standard than the Army? Just postulating.
     
  28. ProjectInfinity1

    ProjectInfinity1 Pre-Flight

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    "The idea of a 21 year old private citizen with your mental health background collecting usable working heavy ordnance and other serious military grade weapons is a bit unsettling. I don't know you, and if I did, I may VERY well not have that feeling. Just going from some posts typed on the internet. Not trying to be offensive or put you down in any way.".

    It's good you feel unsettled, you know why? It's means your judgement/intuition is functioning as it should. Any reasonable person, looking from the outside in would express a similar discomfort, (myself included if I was seeing this written by someone else). The sheer amount of red flags I am putting up is off the charts, and I'd be delusional to argue otherwise.

    However when you delve deeper, from someone on the "outside" looking "in", logically, should we be more concerned about the people who are willing to talk about their struggles openly, or is the greater danger from people suffering in silence and end up bottling it up until they can't take it anymore.

    "Not trying to be offensive or put you down in any way." No offense taken! It's a perfectly reasonable response/series of questions to ask.

    And once someone gets to know me, I'm a pretty mellow guy! If you're ever in the RI area and on the off chance you'd want to talk guns, aviation or history, lmk :D
     
    Last edited: Nov 23, 2020
  29. ProjectInfinity1

    ProjectInfinity1 Pre-Flight

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    I am not .mil nor am I LE or work for a government contractor in any sort. Just a regular civilian.
     
  30. bflynn

    bflynn Final Approach

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    Just a regular civilian that the govt trusts with 60mm mortars?

    There is nothing regular about that.
     
  31. ProjectInfinity1

    ProjectInfinity1 Pre-Flight

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    upload_2020-11-23_21-24-6.png

    For obvious reasons I whited out a lot of identifying information such as the S/N, my City, address, last name, ect.

    (Quick aside) Again for the love of god I wasn't lying, if someone feels uncomfortable enough to want to call the police, I already had someone call the FBI on me from this forum a year or two ago which means they already checked me out, I have no desire to hurt myself or others! Please don't call the feds on me again, fun party story two years on, but definitely don't want to deal with it again. :eek:
     
    Last edited: Nov 23, 2020
  32. Matthew Rogers

    Matthew Rogers Line Up and Wait

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    Double check your post, because I think we both agree that NyQuil is both less of a danger than SSRI or SNRI medicines and also still a significant danger for flying. If you have been on SSRIs, then either you were lucky and had no effects, or may not have been in the right kind to understand the effects.

    If it is inaccurate, then how come the person I live with swings and and forth in days when medication is missed? So you don’t have major changes when you miss your specific mental health medicine, but others do. What medicine are you on? What dose? What specific issues do you have? They are all different and specific to a specific person. Since everyone is so different, there are a wide range of effects, precautions, side effects, dangers.

    Some people seems to think that everyone is the same. I think that a limited medical is the best option to be fair - a shorter review process and then a limitation to solo flights. Or the longer review for a fully issued medical.
     
  33. jstone

    jstone Ejection Handle Pulled

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    Sounds like the person you live with has bipolar disorder which is completely different than depression.
     
  34. Matthew Rogers

    Matthew Rogers Line Up and Wait

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    Nope, but thanks for guessing. I prefer not to disclose someone else's diagnosis, but not bipolar. Swings in mood don't have to be "bipolar bad" to still be a cause for concern in terms of flying. Heck, we are all supposed to go over the IMSAFE checklist and plenty of those issues are "relatively minor", yet still cause for concern and self grounding. You got your salary cut, might not want to fly that day. You had a bad night of sleep, might not want to fly that day.
     
  35. Brad Z

    Brad Z Final Approach PoA Supporter

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    Are you required to take a medical/mental health screening in order to register the destructive device?
     
  36. PeterNSteinmetz

    PeterNSteinmetz Pattern Altitude PoA Supporter

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    These normally have to be approved by the local chief LEO, which is normally the Sheriff. I don’t think they do a health screening. Usually a criminal background check if any court ordered mental health treatment.


    In terms of his original thread on that, the FAA medical process is much stricter.
     
  37. ProjectInfinity1

    ProjectInfinity1 Pre-Flight

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    While true, I’d speculate that a non trivial minority of bush pilots in AK don’t follow that guidance.

    Our GA accident rate would be significantly lower if common sense was universal.
     
  38. Brad Z

    Brad Z Final Approach PoA Supporter

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    No doubt. But it's a bit disingenuous to say on one hand feds allow him to play with bombs while disallowing him to fly a Cessna 150. The feds allowing him to play with bombs are likely not aware of his history of depression or suicide. At least he didn't mention disclosing it as part of the process,
     
  39. ProjectInfinity1

    ProjectInfinity1 Pre-Flight

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    No, the only bearing mental health has on it (Federally speaking) is if one was involuntarily admitted to a psychiatric facility, one was declared not guilty by reason of insanity in court, or if you have an addiction problem with drugs or alcohol.
     
  40. Brad Z

    Brad Z Final Approach PoA Supporter

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    Did you voluntarily disclose your mental health history?