Slipping or Crabbing in a Crosswind?

RyanB

RyanB

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*about to open a can of worms*

Which is the better method? I prefer to crab it down final and then kick out the crab before touchdown. I’ve never liked the idea of being uncoordinated and low to the ground at the same time.

What about you?
 
whatever works.

If I'm high, I tend to do a slip and then kick it straight. If not, I am more likely to crab until I get close then work it into a slip.
 
Ryanb said:
*about to open a can of worms*

Which is the better method? I prefer to crab it down final and then kick out the crab before touchdown. I’ve never liked the idea of being uncoordinated and low to the ground at the same time.

What about you?
Click to expand...
Should have started a poll. I crab during decent and straight out as I flair to land. Works for me..:)
 
Ryanb said:
*about to open a can of worms*

Which is the better method? I prefer to crab it down final and then kick out the crab before touchdown. I’ve never liked the idea of being uncoordinated and low to the ground at the same time.

What about you?
Click to expand...
How do you kick out the crab without becoming uncoordinated low to the ground?

And what don't you like about the idea of a slip low to the ground?
 
MauleSkinner said:
How do you kick out the crab without becoming uncoordinated low to the ground?

And what don't you like about the idea of a slip low to the ground?
Click to expand...
When you kick out the crab, you’re typically only just a few feet off the ground vs. holding a slip in all the way down final.
 
I prefer slipping in, because fewer things need to suddenly change and be adjusted in those moments before touchdown. You know how much rudder and aileron you'll need, way in advance instead of at the last minute. Just my pref.
 
Ryanb said:
When you kick out the crab, you’re typically only just a few feet off the ground vs. holding a slip in all the way down final.
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if you're holding the slip in all the way down final, either your instructor didn't explain the difference between a training technique and real life, or you didn't understand it. (Honestly, I'd bet on the former.)

But that's a slip NOT low to the ground. What's the problem with a slip low to the ground?
 
MauleSkinner said:
if you're holding the slip in all the way down final, either your instructor didn't explain the difference between a training technique and real life, or you didn't understand it. (Honestly, I'd bet on the former.)
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I figured you’d say just that. I’m not going to start another boxing match. :)
 
Ryanb said:
I figured you’d say just that. I’m not going to start another boxing match. :)
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I'm not getting into a boxing match...I'm just trying to understand why normal procedures make people uncomfortable.
 
Ryanb said:
*about to open a can of worms*

Which is the better method? I prefer to crab it down final and then kick out the crab before touchdown. I’ve never liked the idea of being uncoordinated and low to the ground at the same time.

What about you?
Click to expand...

Hold centerline with crab on final, touch down with slip, nose on and tracking centerline. Not to say I haven’t slipped the whole way down before. I’ve started slips on downwind and held them all the way through base, final and touchdown, comin down like a Bonanza full of Doctors
 
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Cross the threshold, kick from crab to slip and add flaps and reduce power. o_O:eek:
 
Crab then rudder to align with the runway about 50 feet up, which is a slip. Much more comfortable for passengers although I did have one mention he didn't like coming to the runway sideways. I told him he would like being pointed at the runway from up high much less on a day like that.
 
MauleSkinner said:
I'm not getting into a boxing match...I'm just trying to understand why normal procedures make people uncomfortable.
Click to expand...
Because I don’t like being uncoordinated low to the ground. Simple as that. I also like to believe that it’s more comfortable for the passengers in the back seat.
 
Depends on what you're flying. PA28's have the nosewheel attached to the rudder so you be aware of correcting the rudder amidships before the nosewheel touches the ground.
 
MauleSkinner said:
How do you kick out the crab without becoming uncoordinated low to the ground?

And what don't you like about the idea of a slip low to the ground?
Click to expand...

You can do it, get out of the crab and lined up on centerline and do it coordinated. But you be upwind wing up. Not good. If you don’t do that and just ‘kick’ you’re gonna be skidding. So yer probably gonna be uncoordinated either way. I’ll pick slip over skid, upwind wing low, any day.

Edit: hold on, think I’m missing something
 
Although not part of the question, be sure to add the appropriate aileron upon touchdown.
 
Side Slipping is the preferred method over Crabbing
as well as
Coke over Pepsi
Boeing over Airbus (Airbus does not recommend Side Slipping)
Flying over Driving
etc.

In all seriousness, Side Slipping is probably less stressful on retractable airplane landing gear. Sideslip causes one main landing gear to touch down first, followed by the second main gear. By allowing both wheels to be constantly aligned with the runway, thus avoiding any side load at touchdown. Mis-alignment of the wheels might occur with poor technique or misjudgment in the timing with Crabbing and produce more side stress on the landing gear. Probably not as important in fixed gear as with retractable gear but that is theoretical.

The other times Slipping might be advantageous is when there is thin sheet of ice or oil on the windshield, you can sideslip and look out the side window for a little better view or if you need to loose more altitude in a faster manner.

Crabbing is probably more useful in extreme cross wind conditions whereas you have lost rudder authority in the side slipping maneuver, but at that point you might considering landing at a different airport.

Ironically, Side Slipping seems that you have more coordination through the whole landing maneuver even though you are uncoordinated (in an aviation sense) and Crabbing seems like you become uncoordinated (not in an aviation sense) during the change from crabbing to straight flight in the last 3-5 seconds of landing "kick" even though you are coordinated-sort of.

It probably depends on the situation
 
Depends on how lazy my feet are feeling at the time.

Actually, now that I think about it I guess I just move my hands and feet until things look about right and then fine tune it right before flare and touchdown.
 
kath said:
I prefer slipping in, because fewer things need to suddenly change and be adjusted in those moments before touchdown. You know how much rudder and aileron you'll need, way in advance instead of at the last minute. Just my pref.
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What she said. ^^^
Kicking out the crab works for others and that's fine too.
 
Zeldman said:
I will use differential power to help keep aligned with the center line if I run out of rudder.......
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Or just land in the crab and use power to keep yourself on centerline when landing on ice.....

That’s a little more advanced technique though ;)
 
As long as you’re stepping on the high wing, if it works go for it.
 
DavidWhite said:
Or just land in the crab and use power to keep yourself on centerline when landing on ice.....

That’s a little more advanced technique though ;)
Click to expand...

I have done the sliding landing several times in sleds and the 'Ho....sliding takeoffs as well.....:loco: :lol::lol:
 
Zeldman said:
I have done the sliding landing several times in sleds and the 'Ho....sliding takeoffs as well.....:loco: :lol::lol:
Click to expand...

It’s good fun after the fact, not so much fun when you’re wondering if this technique some crusty old bush pilot taught you is a cruel joke that will wind up with you in the tundra.

Second degree fun I called it. Pretty much everything in Western AK fell under the “Second degree” umbrella
 
Greg Bockelman said:
By definition a slip IS uncoordinated flight.
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MauleSkinner said:
Yup...so is the skid that results if all you do is kick out a crab.
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Agree, Greg. While you are in uncoordinated flight momentarily when coming out of the crab over the runway surface, I don’t consider that the same as being uncoordinated as you fly down final.
 
Ryanb said:
*about to open a can of worms*

Which is the better method? I prefer to crab it down final and then kick out the crab before touchdown. I’ve never liked the idea of being uncoordinated and low to the ground at the same time.

What about you?
Click to expand...

Same here, that’s what I was taught and felt better than being uncoordinated at 100 AGL
 
When I learned on the ground, and then flew, my instructor had a heck of a time diagnosing what was wrong with my approaches. I was doing both at the same time, lol! I nailed it on our 3rd flight...

Being uncoordinated is only bad if you don’t have enough air flowing across the airfoils, right? I can side slip with aileron and full opposite rudder and peg my VSI, and as long as I keep 80kts I should be fine, right? What about a forward slip?

I think problems with being uncoordinated arise with the addition of being too slow, then banking for final, and losing the vertical component of lift?
 
There were 2 times I slipped with pax, in both cases they didn’t like it at all since my nose was pointer to the freaking building.
 
Both. You should crab until short final, then side slip for the landing. just kicking the rudder will not keep you in the center of the runway
 
I do the wing low method for cross winds
 
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