Simulated instrument hours for PPASEL

[Lindberg]

At some point in time, did the required simulated instrument hours increase from 1 to 3? If so, when?

 

[smv]

Been three for as long as I recall. I had 4.5 hours Sim Inst when I took my first checkride 19 years ago.

 

[brcase]

I can’t tell you what the rule was at the time. But in July of 1988 I took my private pilot Checkride with 0.2 hrs actual and 0.3 hours of Hood time for a total of 0.5 hours of instrument training.

Brian

 

[dtuuri]

At some point in time, did the required simulated instrument hours increase from 1 to 3? If so, when?

I don't believe there was ever a "one hour" requirement. In 1961 there was a requirement for integrated instrument instruction in basic flight maneuvers both before and after solo. Then, by 1965, there was a requirement for instrument instruction to be included in the three hours of flight test preparation after the first solo cross country.

 

[dmspilot]

I'm pretty sure this is the 1978 version...

I'm not expert at the previous regulations, but it appears to me that 1978 was when they started requiring flight by reference to instruments in private pilot training.

Did you find that online or in an old printing?

The historical CFR on the FAA website seems to default to a date of 12/1/1978 if no date is otherwise specified. I don't think that's the actual date. The link to the oldest version of 61.109 despite claiming to be from 1978 denoted amendments from 1997 and 1998.

 

[Lindberg]

I don't believe there was ever a "one hour" requirement. In 1961 there was a requirement for integrated instrument instruction in basic flight maneuvers both before and after solo. Then, by 1965, there was a requirement for instrument instruction to be included in the three hours of flight test preparation after the first solo cross country.

This makes sense. I found a 1997 NPRM that mentions the 3-hour requirement but not what preceded it.

 

[MauleSkinner]

Did you find that online or in an old printing?

The historical CFR on the FAA website seems to default to a date of 12/1/1978 if no date is otherwise specified. I don't think that's the actual date. The link to the oldest version of 61.109 despite claiming to be from 1978 denoted amendments from 1997 and 1998.

I got looking some more and deleted my post...the historical CFR stuff just wasn’t looking right.

 

[Brad Z]

Yep, the three hour requirement came along with the big part 61 re-write that went into effect in 1997. I did my private in 1993 with .8 hour of simulated instrument time. Prior to that, it was a PTS task and required training item, but there was no minimum aeronautical experience requirement for it.

 

[dtuuri]

Yep, the three hour requirement came along with the big part 61 re-write that went into effect in 1997.

Interesting, isn't it, that the fatal weather-related accident rate was declining at a greater rate prior to the added burden of three hours of instrument training for the PPL than afterwards in 1997. See Fig 2 (B) in this study: http://chubasco.niu.edu/pubs/Fultz and Ashley 2016.pdf

Makes one wonder if the FAA shouldn't have performance studies for adopted changes to rules and rescind them when hoped-for objectives don't materialize. I note, though, that the decline in fatal weather-related accidents did continue, although at a slower rate, after the increased requirement. Expensive medical hoops to jump through come more to mind.

 

[MauleSkinner]

Interesting, isn't it, that the fatal weather-related accident rate was declining at a greater rate prior to the added burden of three hours of instrument training for the PPL than afterwards in 1997. See Fig 2 (B) in this study: http://chubasco.niu.edu/pubs/Fultz and Ashley 2016.pdf

Makes one wonder if the FAA shouldn't have performance studies for adopted changes to rules and rescind them when hoped-for objectives don't materialize. I note, though, that the decline in fatal weather-related accidents did continue, although at a slower rate, after the increased requirement. Expensive medical hoops to jump through come more to mind.

I’m sure the FAA performance study would determine that the cause for the change was actually the discontinuation of Frankenberry cereal.