You pointed out the problem of Cirrus exiting the runway. You have to be on the runway to exit it. Aileron will not stop the airplane from yawing into the wind and exiting the runway after touch down. Rudder is required for that. Airplane that exit the runway due to wind exit to the upwind side.
Actually I like to start my student at a 150 ft wide runway with the fewest objects around the runway so the wind as smooth and straight line as possible so they learn the technique seeing what their control inputs are doing to the aircraft vs a narrow runway with trees, hangars ect with shear leaving the student wondering what is happening in the wind shear. Then when the technique is solid we mix in situations with wind shear.
Tools has it right there. I'm kinda surprised by this discussion.
Well yeah, it all requires looking in the right place. Outside. But to quibble back, it's not necessarily the end of the runway.
There seems to be an optimum distance that is neither too close nor too far. Looking at the far end of a 12,000'' runway provides a significantly different picture than a 3000' runway. And in some airplanes, the nose covers the forward view so you have to rely on peripheral vision out the side (what Jason Thomas refers to as the "Lindbergh reference" in his videos).
It goes all the way back to this:
That is a common mistake and good advice for the OP.
Another tip to counter adverse yaw on rollout is that you can slightly increase turning authority by banking the ailerons opposite the rudder, toward the side you are trying to move away from.
Oh, so you don't need any rudder input when rolling, since the ailerons don't produce yaw????
Maybe you should go back and read the original post in this thread which was about direction control of the plane AFTER touch down.Oh, so you don't need any rudder input when rolling, since the ailerons don't produce yaw????
Interesting.
Ailerons and elevator still help with directional control even after touchdown. And if used improperly, they can impair directional control.
Indeed, in most airplanes you can, as I mentioned above. Turn the yoke R and the plane tends L, and vice versa. The adverse yaw has an effect like it does in the air, only weaker. This has more effect on taildraggers but you can still feel it on nose-draggers too.
Buying a taildragger was going to be my suggestion to fix your crosswind technique. But you can work on it a bit in a trike, by doing the same as you would in a taildragger: Keep flying the plane until it’s tied down. It doesn’t stop being an airplane just because it’s close to the ground.
So what happens if, for instance, you have a crosswind from the right and you're drifting to the left. Are you going to use the adverse yaw of left aileron to steer right to get back on centerline? Left aileron in a right crosswind?? Guess what happens next...
I sure don’t teach them that directional control on the ground is accomplished by use of ailerons.
The airplane is not "silly". It is there for you to master. I have never favored the sideslip method for crosswind approaches. If you plan to go on to professional flying in large aircraft, I expect you would be trained in the crab approach method, so IMO you might as well get used to it. The crab approach method, with the subsequent alignment of the longitudinal axis with the runway and lowering of the upwind wing just before touchdown, requires precise timing and proper degree of control input. Any less than optimal timing or application of control input in the 'alignment phase' will potentially compromise the effectiveness of the maneuver. If you are drifting laterally with the wind while waiting for touchdown, you may be aligning the airplane too early or not lowering the upwind wind sufficiently, or both, or maybe the crosswind is simply too strong, but it is the duty of the CFI to help you evaluate it. To 'nail' a crosswind landing takes practice and experience over time, as does the critical decision to go around if necessary. In any case, the CFI should "know what to do". Did the CFI include you in a thorough debriefing after the flight, to include any of the finer points of your crosswind technique? Every flight requires a substantive preflight briefing and post flight briefing. If this is not being done, or you are not satisfied with the amount and quality of knowledge imparted, then you always have the option to find another CFI. It's good that you want "great". Good luck.Hi,
I'm curious as to ideas on how to keep the silly airplane straight down the center line. Not in flight but At and After touch down..?
I did a flight review the other day with landings in a pretty direct 10 knot crosswind. I did ok with the wind but I want great, not ok.
So, what do you do to not sideload the gear and how do you stop the drift?
Lol, no one said that. Not sure if you are arguing just to argue or you really don’t get it but eh, take care.
You are not addressing the problem presented by the OP
The plan is to have ailerons into the wind and be ready to apply rudder for going around.
You might want to read Post 6. I posted it 7 hours before your first post in this thread.
Idle power might have helped.
On the ground, a crosswind from the right won't blow you left. It will weathervane you to the right due to the force of wind on the rudder. In this case L rudder to correct, and R aileron if the rudder doesn't have enough authority. That R aileron, incidentally, is also the correct input to keep the upwind wing down, so you're going to be doing that anyway.
If you keep the airplane perfectly aligned with the runway, it will drift left. There is only the traction of the tires to stop it, and how much traction is there when the airplane is in the early part of the rollout? The lift doesn't magically disappear when the wheels touch down.
You obviously haven’t much experience with very high wind taxi. Yes, the plane will weathervane into the wind, and if the wind is strong enough it will slid the airplane side ways on the tires as the pilot is using full rudder to counteract the weathervane, full aileron to keep the wing down and proper elevator inputs.
Yes, the R xwind blows you to the L while in the air and early in the rollout. At that point the pilot is applying L rudder and R aileron. As the airplane slows down, both before & after wheels touch down, the pilot increases these same inputs as the slower airspeed reduces control authority. When you get to taxi speed the airplane is going to act as a weathervane and try to point into the wind. You need to counter that with opposite rudder, which is the same L rudder you've been applying all along.
Actually I have, in both nose and tail wheel airplanes. You agree that the airplane weathervanes or yaws into the wind on taxi, and on the control inputs of L rudder and R aileron. What exactly are you disputing?
Let’s just say I have never experienced this after touch down. How much adverse yaw do you think you are getting from an aileron at low speed that it is aiding the direction control of tires on the surface in a tricycle gear airplane?
Or at least wait until he has control of the plane before adding full power. Even after he watches it getting away from him he leaves the power in. As I said earlier ... appears he had no plan ...
Maybe, in most tricycle gear airplanes the nose gear is mechanically straightened. I.E. Cessnas have a centering cam that straightens the wheel when the strut is extended. If you watch aircraft on final you will notice the nose wheel is straight. This always true on retractable gear airplanes.
It applies to Cessnas. It doesn't apply to Pipers, which have a solid link between the rudder pedals and nosewheel steering. Cessna builds their system like that to use the nosewheel centering cam as the rudder centering system, to add yaw stability. The steering links are springs inside tubes that give that ubiquitous spongy nosewheel steering.