Should I tell the truth or should I lie?

When my nephew was about 6 we were driving him home around 9pm on Christmas Eve in Co Springs. We drove past a construction site, and in the distance a crane was dangling a generator about 50'-100' off the ground. There was either a single light or a string of Christmas light on the generator. That kid (he's about 30 now) saw that and said, "Santa's coming!!! Hurry!!!" He figured he needed to home in bed or he'd miss Santa.
 
When I grew up we did not celebrate Christmas for religious reasons.
To be honest it is was kind of hard when others talked about Santa and what they received. What do you tell other kids? Santa is not real and we do not do Christmas.
There are some Jewish people here what did they so when they were kids?

Now one of my granddaughters is getting to the age where she is questions Santa. Her dad has a good answer. If you believe in him you will get presents from him if you do not believe he will not get you presents.

I was told the truth early on when I asked, but well that's because I'm Jewish and the old guy in the red coat wasn't coming to my house. Folks just told me it was special for my gentile friends and not to spoil it for them, so I didn't it was that simple. That said I host Santa at my office for my client's and friends kids every year because I love seeing the expression of awe on their faces.
 
You will have to help me with this one. I've never heard of a Chanukah Birdie. :confused:
Chanukah is by Jewish religious standards a very minor holiday, whose importance in the United States has been magnified far beyond its historical significance merely because of its proximity to Christmas in the secular calendar. Due to the omnipresence of Santa Claus/Christmas in media, advertising, stores, etc., regarding the giving of presents to children whether they have any idea of what the holiday is really about or not (or even whether they care about that or not), it has become more or less traditional for less orthodox (especially Reformed) Jewish families to exchange gifts at Chanukah (despite the fact that there is absolutely no religious or historical basis for doing so) simply because otherwise Jewish children too young to understand that Christmas is a Christian religious celebration unrelated to our faith would be crushed by their failure to receive gifts in December while their Gentile friends receive a flood of gifts from Santa Claus. The problem arising was the identification of the deliverer of these gifts. Since Santa Claus is a figure associated with the Christian holiday, and thus unsuitable to be identified to Jewish children as the deliverer of the presents to be found under the Chanukah Bush (another modern American Jewish invention without religious or historical basis used in some Jewish homes to provide context to Jewish children too young to understand the situation), the Chanukah Birdie (a close relative, I suspect, of the stork who delivers babies) was invented to fill that imaginary role.

BTW, if you want an explanation of Orthodox, Conservative, Reformed, Liberal, and Reconstructionist Judaism, and the differences between them all (including all the shades of each), you're going to have to get that from my brother, the rabbi. ;)
 
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Meh, Jews could have usurped Santa easy enough, he works for the same God of Abraham.
 
Meh, Jews could have usurped Santa easy enough, he works for the same God of Abraham.
I might question whether Santa works for anyone other than the industries which manufacture toys, fragrances, electric shavers, clothing, etc., and the retailers which sell those products, but I don't want this to go into the Spin Zone as discussion of religion. Plus, in this country, I think a lot of folks whose religions have no connection to the monotheistic beliefs handed down from Abraham (not to mention those with no religion at all) are also all-in on gift-giving in December without regard for their actual religious background. My observation is that in this country, Christmas has devolved into a frenzy of shopping and gift exchange with little connection to the historical religious event it purports to commemorate -- and Chanukah has in many ways become another victim of that transformation.

In any event, Happy Thanksgiving everyone!

Now I need to check on the thawing of my 19-lb Kosher turkey (my brother the rabbi is coming to dinner).
 
I might question whether Santa works for anyone other than the industries which manufacture toys, fragrances, electric shavers, clothing, etc., and the retailers which sell those products, but I don't want this to go into the Spin Zone as discussion of religion. Plus, in this country, I think a lot of folks whose religions have no connection to the monotheistic beliefs handed down from Abraham (not to mention those with no religion at all) are also all-in on gift-giving in December without regard for their actual religious background. My observation is that in this country, Christmas has devolved into a frenzy of shopping and gift exchange with little connection to the historical religious event it purports to commemorate -- and Chanukah has in many ways become another victim of that transformation.

In any event, Happy Thanksgiving everyone!

Now I need to check on the thawing of my 19-lb Kosher turkey (my brother the rabbi is coming to dinner).

:rofl: Yeah, but we're talking about finding a switch off the Reailty track anyway so... As for reality...;)
 
I'm 27 and my parents still put stuff under the tree that says "from santa"

I turned out okay. :crazy:
 
Let him be a kid for goodness sake , there is a lifetime of being an adult ahead of him.
 
in this country, I think a lot of folks whose religions have no connection to the monotheistic beliefs handed down from Abraham (not to mention those with no religion at all) are also all-in on gift-giving in December without regard for their actual religious background. My observation is that in this country, Christmas has devolved into a frenzy of shopping and gift exchange with little connection to the historical religious event it purports to commemorate -- and Chanukah has in many ways become another victim of that transformation.

Thanks Ron for the explaination about the Chanukah Birdie. I totally agree with your comment quoted above.
 
Let him be a kid for goodness sake , there is a lifetime of being an adult ahead of him.

This. The ruse is really adorable when they are young and have zero suspicion. Seems weird and you feel guilty when they are nearer to figuring it out.
 
I just wouldn't bring it up... adults are always talking about "what santa left under the tree" to other adults so just talk like that. Kid will figure it out eventually.... if they ask directly then I'd be honest but I've never heard of anyone thinking it's a big deal one way or the other after they grow up.
 
Chanukah is by Jewish religious standards a very minor holiday, whose importance in the United States has been magnified far beyond its historical significance merely because of its proximity to Christmas in the secular calendar. Due to the omnipresence of Santa Claus/Christmas in media, advertising, stores, etc., regarding the giving of presents to children whether they have any idea of what the holiday is really about or not (or even whether they care about that or not), it has become more or less traditional for less orthodox (especially Reformed) Jewish families to exchange gifts at Chanukah (despite the fact that there is absolutely no religious or historical basis for doing so) simply because otherwise Jewish children too young to understand that Christmas is a Christian religious celebration unrelated to our faith would be crushed by their failure to receive gifts in December while their Gentile friends receive a flood of gifts from Santa Claus. The problem arising was the identification of the deliverer of these gifts. Since Santa Claus is a figure associated with the Christian holiday, and thus unsuitable to be identified to Jewish children as the deliverer of the presents to be found under the Chanukah Bush (another modern American Jewish invention without religious or historical basis used in some Jewish homes to provide context to Jewish children too young to understand the situation), the Chanukah Birdie (a close relative, I suspect, of the stork who delivers babies) was invented to fill that imaginary role.

BTW, if you want an explanation of Orthodox, Conservative, Reformed, Liberal, and Reconstructionist Judaism, and the differences between them all (including all the shades of each), you're going to have to get that from my brother, the rabbi. ;)

Actually Ron, it turns out that giving gifts (or at least money) is one of the oldest and most authentic customs associated with Chanukah.

/shamelessplug ON
You can read all about that and any other Jewish holiday in my latest book:
http://www.amazon.com/Your-Guide-Je...8&qid=1416960751&sr=8-1&keywords=matt+axelrod
/shamelessplug OFF

Anyway, in our house, we put blood on the doorposts so Santa passes right over.

Matt (my day job is Conservative cantor)
 
Santa better be real.

I'm counting on him for a new airplane this year. (That'll be the only way I will get one.).


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Actually Ron, it turns out that giving gifts (or at least money) is one of the oldest and most authentic customs associated with Chanukah.

/shamelessplug ON
You can read all about that and any other Jewish holiday in my latest book:
http://www.amazon.com/Your-Guide-Je...8&qid=1416960751&sr=8-1&keywords=matt+axelrod
/shamelessplug OFF

Anyway, in our house, we put blood on the doorposts so Santa passes right over.

Matt (my day job is Conservative cantor)

If you don't mind my asking, why is Chanukah such a minor holiday? The event it commemorates and the history leading up to it were of considerable religious and historical significance.

Rich
 
If you don't mind my asking, why is Chanukah such a minor holiday? The event it commemorates and the history leading up to it were of considerable religious and historical significance.

Rich

Only the holidays or festivals mentioned in the Torah (Old Testament) are considered major--like Passover, Rosh Hashanah, etc. Along with the description of the holidays are restrictions on doing work, much like on the Jewish Sabbath.

Chanukah, OTOH, is not mentioned in the Torah (the events it commemorates occurred much later). There are no religious restrictions against doing any work or anything, so it's considered a minor festival. While the events were of historical significance (establishing the first Jewish independent control in the Land of Israel), there was originally very little religious importance to it. In fact, the famous miracle of oil lasting for 8 days was a later addition by the rabbis in order to give it a little more "oomph."
 
Now one of my granddaughters is getting to the age where she is questions Santa. Her dad has a good answer. If you believe in him you will get presents from him if you do not believe he will not get you presents.

I didn't think you were anywhere near old enough to have a granddaughter. But, that answer is very similar to what my aunt told my older cousins when they started questioning if Santa was real:

"Well, he always comes to my house."

They got the idea that they best not spoil it for my younger cousins, lest their piles of presents be replaced with coal.
 
Actually Ron, it turns out that giving gifts (or at least money) is one of the oldest and most authentic customs associated with Chanukah.

/shamelessplug ON
You can read all about that and any other Jewish holiday in my latest book:
http://www.amazon.com/Your-Guide-Je...8&qid=1416960751&sr=8-1&keywords=matt+axelrod
/shamelessplug OFF

Anyway, in our house, we put blood on the doorposts so Santa passes right over.

Matt (my day job is Conservative cantor)

And here I thought you were a professional marathon runner who just happened to have a thing for Jewish Music.

I might add that Matt's books are great reads !
 
I can't imagine any point to having a kid if you can't corrupt it for your own amusement.

Teach it the old ways of Krampus. Make the thing cower in fear behind the tree, brandishing a lego axe aimed at the fireplace. Fill a stocking with disembodied hands. Cackle in anticipation of the parent-teacher conferences you'll be invited to when little Snacky tells the class about the TRUE meaning of Xmas, and all of his spineless classmates start to cry and need retrieval from their soft parents in their safe, fake little SUVs, and taken back home for bravery gifts, ice cream, and a new layer of hot buttered lies and soothing hallmark-grade Kringle stories.

Applaud when he takes over the world in his teens, because he was raised to be a hard little mofo, and not some doughy, slobbering parasite.

Arch a concerned eyebrow if he invades Poland. :D



...it is possibly a good thing that I don't have children (touch wood).
 
I'm 27 and my parents still put stuff under the tree that says "from santa"

I turned out okay. :crazy:

You might want to rethink the turned out okay if you still live with your parents at 27
:lol:
 
Jesus Mike. You should breed often and with many mates. An army of you's could be entertaining...
 
Only the holidays or festivals mentioned in the Torah (Old Testament) are considered major--like Passover, Rosh Hashanah, etc. Along with the description of the holidays are restrictions on doing work, much like on the Jewish Sabbath.

Chanukah, OTOH, is not mentioned in the Torah (the events it commemorates occurred much later). There are no religious restrictions against doing any work or anything, so it's considered a minor festival. While the events were of historical significance (establishing the first Jewish independent control in the Land of Israel), there was originally very little religious importance to it. In fact, the famous miracle of oil lasting for 8 days was a later addition by the rabbis in order to give it a little more "oomph."

Thank you.

I am aware that Chanukah is not one of the mitzvot of the Torah and was rather instituted by the Sages of the Sanhedrin; that the same Sages chose not to include the account of the Maccabees in the Tanakh (nor are the books of the Maccabees included in the Protestant canon, just as an aside); and that the Maccabean revolt took place during what Christians call the intertestamental period. So I do understand why Chanukah doesn't have the same weight as the holy days commanded in the Torah.

Nonetheless, I've always felt that Chanukah deserved more respect for its religious significance. Miracle of the lamps aside, Chanukah commemorates the re-dedication of the Temple and the Jews' return to Temple worship. It also references a period marked by purification of Judaism from Hellenistic influences, mixed worship rituals, and outright sacrileges.

Considering that such abuses were among the major reasons for the captivity, I would think that the Maccabees' efforts toward removing such destructive and sacrilegious influences from Judaism would be very religiously significant. But I do understand why the holiday doesn't rank up there with the holy days Moses was commanded to have the people observe.

Thanks,

Rich
 
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To the OP: I am glad that you are considering the question, regardless of the choice you make; I think it represents a shift in consciousness of society as a whole, for which I am grateful.

FWIW- I knew early on but it was somewhat matter of fact that he didnt exist & the question was taken for granted. My folks split up early in my life and I have every reason to belive that if I had been reared by my father, the myth(s) would have been propagated longer than it was.

Although I knew it was mythical, when I celebrated as a child it did not undo any enjoyment of the celebration. I have fond memories of awakening to a room full of gifts.

We do not celebrate in my household, but my children are aware that others do including my parents. My mother tends to go overboard with it and its the cause of a bit of angst for me and I yet have found a way to communicate the balance that I think would be appropriate - and I have consciously chosen not to withdraw my children from the affection associated with the festivities, and I thank mom for that.

I suspect you will find what you seek that caused the question to be raised. As for me, I will work on better communication with mom. Thank you for posing the question.
 
What? Granddaughter? No effin' way!

I am 48 so according to Henning I could have great grand kids :D

Wife is older then me and all 4 kids are hers from first marriage. I only claim the grandkids :D
 
Telling them it's a game played on a global scale and to play along wouldn't be a bad option.
 
A nice roaring fire with a few chestnuts will do the trick very nicely.

And we turn on the Old King Cole recording of "Jack Frost roasting on an open fire..."
 
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