serious question...regarding chutes and medicals...don't laugh.

midcap

midcap

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midcap
Ok...I had a long drive back home this week, like 10 hours and while driving I got to thinking (dangerous I know).

Ok...we now have basic med but there are pilots out there who this isn't going to help. I.E. John King. or folks who have things that really stop them from flying.

So, why wouldn't the FAA allow Sport Pilots and Those who have had their 3rd class revoked fly in an airplane with a Chute as long as they had a passenger that has the approved training for chute deployment. Obviously, the training would involve, how to use the radio, the transponder and how to pull the chute.
 
midcap said:
Ok...I had a long drive back home this week, like 10 hours and while driving I got to thinking (dangerous I know).

Ok...we now have basic med but there are pilots out there who this isn't going to help. I.E. John King. or folks who have things that really stop them from flying.

So, why wouldn't the FAA allow Sport Pilots and Those who have had their 3rd class revoked fly in an airplane with a Chute as long as they had a passenger that has the approved training for chute deployment. Obviously, the training would involve, how to use the radio, the transponder and how to pull the chute.
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I like the way you think. Like a logical person. Too bad the FAA is not known to be logical.

Just kidding. They are. Just in case they read these threads.

I guess they don't want planes falling on school playgrounds.
 
mulligan said:
I like the way you think. Like a logical person. Too bad the FAA is not known to be logical.

Just kidding. They are. Just in case they read these threads.

I guess they don't want planes falling on school playgrounds.
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You know I thought about that. I'd like to know the odds of a pilot both becoming incapacitated and then landing on a school.

Because with that train of thought, chutes should not be able to be used because you have no control over your landing area.
 
But then you could only fly with "certified" passengers. It would add a whole other rating!:rofl:
 
Keep in mind, that some of the regs are not FAA driven, but Congress.
 
why bother training at all, really. just give it a try and if u don't get it the first time, pull the chute.
 
The real reason is that nobody in government is likely to get fired, targeted by the media, voted out, etc for not letting people do something. Government is in the business of saying "no" not "yes".
 
AggieMike88 said:
Keep in mind, that some of the regs are not FAA driven, but Congress.
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I know that...like when the Airline Pilots lobbying group leaned on the senator they donate to for the basic med bill to hold the bill hostage in committee? You mean like that?
 
midcap said:
I know that...like when the Airline Pilots lobbying group leaned on the senator they donate to for the basic med bill to hold the bill hostage in committee? You mean like that?
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Who would that be? i'd like to make a donation to whomever opposes him in the next election.
 
midcap said:
You know I thought about that. I'd like to know the odds of a pilot both becoming incapacitated and then landing on a school.
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The odds must be lower than winning the lottery because people have actually won the lottery.
 
paflyer said:
Who would that be? i'd like to make a donation to whomever opposes him in the next election.
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On the Airplane Owner's Podcast, Episode 54, around the 17 minute mark, Senator Nelson is called out by Judge Arthur Rosen.

I assume it's Democratic Senator Bill Nelson from Florida.

His donors, it appears American Air is on the top 5.
https://www.opensecrets.org/politicians/summary.php?cid=N00009926

I am not sure why ALPA came out against an DL medical, but apparently they leaned on Nelson enough to get him to do what he did. This is all from the podcast.
 
midcap said:
Why wouldn't the FAA allow Sport Pilots and Those who have had their 3rd class revoked fly in an airplane with a Chute as long as they had a passenger that has the approved training for chute deployment. Obviously, the training would involve, how to use the radio, the transponder and how to pull the chute.
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The BRS chutes in the Cirrus and other light sport aircraft are ignored by the insurance companies as a safety feature. The insurance companies say once you pull the chute the aircraft will likely be totaled and becomes their property.

The FAA also has no opinion in regard to the BRS chutes. They do not cover their use in the AIM or have written questions on them nor test for their use in a PTS.

If you fail a 3rd class medical and/or have it pulled you cannot fly as a Sport Pilot. You are grounded.
 
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midcap said:
You know I thought about that. I'd like to know the odds of a pilot both becoming incapacitated and then landing on a school.
.
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Wellllll we had an RF-4 on takeoff climb out, maybe 1000" agl, and the pilot & GIB punched out. The RF-4 "glided" into a German cemetery and missed a German grade school full of kids by maybe 100 yards. So it could and does happen. :D
 
mscard88 said:
Wellllll we had an RF-4 on takeoff climb out, maybe 1000" agl, and the pilot & GIB punched out. The RF-4 "glided" into a German cemetery and missed a German grade school full of kids by maybe 100 yards. So it could and does happen. :D
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Sure...but it seems there is a better chance of Kate Walsh being my baby momma/:D
 
citizen5000 said:
The BRS chutes in the Cirrus and other light sport aircraft are ignored by the insurance companies as a safety feature. The insurance companies say once you pull the chute the aircraft will likely be totaled and becomes their property.

The FAA also has no opinion in regard to the BRS chutes. They do not cover their use in the AIM or have written questions on them nor test for their use in a PTS.

If you fail a 3rd class medical and/or have it pulled you cannot fly as a Sport Pilot. You are grounded.
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that's what I mean. Look at John King.

Let's say your wife isn't a Pilot, but can easily be one and can pass the BRS proficiency program. You two always fly together. Then your medical gets pulled.

So now your wife needs to get her PPL so you can fly again? makes no sense.
 
midcap said:
Let's say your wife isn't a Pilot, but can easily be one and can pass the BRS proficiency program. You two always fly together. Then your medical gets pulled.

So now your wife needs to get her PPL so you can fly again? makes no sense.
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Are you proposing that the FAA recognize the benefit of the BRS parachute and create a proficiency rating for it's use? The FAA will no doubt never allow that to substitute for having a current pilot in the plane (as Sport or Private and higher with appropriate BasicMed and/or standard medicals).

Cirrus has documented and online training for BRS use. The factory also has a BRS chute simulator in Diluth for current and new customers to "experience" what pulling the chute would be like and under what scenarios. And Cirrus pilots are expected to pre-flight brief the use of the chute to passengers (the briefing is inside the crew management of the Perspective system and in the Ops manuals).

But none of this is any good for John King as you note because unless his pilot wife is PIC he will be nothing more than a passenger pulling the chute.
 
citizen5000 said:
But none of this is any good for John King as you note because unless his pilot wife is PIC he will be nothing more than a passenger pulling the chute.
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The problem for John and Martha King is that they fly a Falcon 10 which is a two-pilot plane and both pilots need a medical.
 
WittyUsername said:
Am I the only one that thinks this is a terrible idea? You're opening the door for tons of people who truly and rightly should not be flying anymore to go up and rely on the chute to get them out of trouble... I can see a thousand ways this could end badly.
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yeah because everyone on basic med now is going to be 100% honest about their medical conditions.
 
citizen5000 said:
Are you proposing that the FAA recognize the benefit of the BRS parachute and create a proficiency rating for it's use? The FAA will no doubt never allow that to substitute for having a current pilot in the plane (as Sport or Private and higher with appropriate BasicMed and/or standard medicals).

Cirrus has documented and online training for BRS use. The factory also has a BRS chute simulator in Diluth for current and new customers to "experience" what pulling the chute would be like and under what scenarios. And Cirrus pilots are expected to pre-flight brief the use of the chute to passengers (the briefing is inside the crew management of the Perspective system and in the Ops manuals).

But none of this is any good for John King as you note because unless his pilot wife is PIC he will be nothing more than a passenger pulling the chute.
Click to expand...

That's my point.
 
midcap said:
On the Airplane Owner's Podcast, Episode 54, around the 17 minute mark, Senator Nelson is called out by Judge Arthur Rosen.

I assume it's Democratic Senator Bill Nelson from Florida.

His donors, it appears American Air is on the top 5.
https://www.opensecrets.org/politicians/summary.php?cid=N00009926

I am not sure why ALPA came out against an DL medical, but apparently they leaned on Nelson enough to get him to do what he did. This is all from the podcast.
Click to expand...
Thanks for the info, Cap.

Like most things, it's a follow the money deal.
 
mscard88 said:
Wellllll we had an RF-4 on takeoff climb out, maybe 1000" agl, and the pilot & GIB punched out. The RF-4 "glided" into a German cemetery and missed a German grade school full of kids by maybe 100 yards. So it could and does happen. :D
Click to expand...
If the pilot had a medical this wouldn't have happened.
 
I can't find the darn thing, but someone (Flying? AOPA?) tracked down GA fatals caused by pilot incapacitation - it just doesn't happen, as in, as close to never as anything gets in the real world. Might have missed a few, granted - I was involved in a search for one we suspected was caused by a medical issue, but there wasn't an autopsy, so no certainty (he was alone). But it's very, very rare - we just don't spend a big percentage of our time flying. Something like a 100 hours per, on average? The III Class always was pointless . . .
 
Sundancer said:
I can't find the darn thing, but someone (Flying? AOPA?) tracked down GA fatals caused by pilot incapacitation - it just doesn't happen, as in, as close to never as anything gets in the real world. Might have missed a few, granted - I was involved in a search for one we suspected was caused by a medical issue, but there wasn't an autopsy, so no certainty (he was alone). But it's very, very rare - we just don't spend a big percentage of our time flying. Something like a 100 hours per, on average? The III Class always was pointless . . .
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Just look at LSA...same thing. Very few accidents related to health reasons.
 
Since when does the equipment installed in a particular aircraft affect the medical status of the pilot? Yeah, chutes are nice, but its presence shouldn't be used as an excuse to do something that you wouldn't do without it. That's how "accidents" happen . . . .
 
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