Saving W&B from multiple flights

AdamZ

AdamZ

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Adam Zucker
Angel Flight East hold's its annual Wings -n- Wheels show every September and as part of the event they have airplane rides.

We'd like to improve the method by which a Weight & Balance is done for every flight. We are looking to see if there is a program or and app that we can use to save the weight and balance from each flight. I know you can get a program or App that allows you to save the data for each plane, Jesse's is a good one but we are looking for a program or app that will allow us to save not only the calculated W&B for multiple planes within one program but also save the W&B from each flight and then print the W&B for each flight later when we get back in the office. Printing them on the field would be tough.

Does anyone know of such a program or app? I suppose that we could build an Excel spread sheet for each plane, but we would prefer to avoid reinventing the wheel if possible. Thanks for your input.
 
Why do this? Has Angel Flight run into a legal problem involving this?

I'm struggling to understand this.
 
You seem to be looking for two things, correct me if I'm wrong:

1) an easy way to calculate W/B for each airplane ride that day
2) a way to save/print them out

I have no idea why you would want to do #2. Seems like creating a load of paperwork for no gain. But an excel spreadsheet for each plane is pretty simple and would work well for this purpose.

As for #1, are your loads that different from airplane ride to airplane ride that it merits a separate W/B calculation for each flight? What I'll usually do in such a case is determine the edges of the envelope. In other words, with one passenger in the right seat, as long as he/she weighs less than say 250 pounds I'm in the envelope. Or, if people are in the back as well, as long as the front seater is 200 or less and the back seaters are 300 or less total we're fine. If either outweigh those numbers, I calculate, but other than that, no need.

Wouldn't this work for you?
 
Another way to accomplish saving the calculation on your W&B app for later printing is to take a screen shot. Simultaneously pressing the on/off and home buttons does this for iOS devices.
 
dunno if this will meet your needs but try fltplan.com. under 'tools' they have a W&B section, you can fill in a plane profile. haven't tried printing. looks like you can email it, therefore it can be printed.
 
If an iPad/iPhone app will work for you, Mike Schulte built a very sophisticated app for CAp. It is overkill for what you need (all the CAP paperwork) but he has every CAP airplane pre-loaded with its specific W&B, you fill in the load numbers. Contact him and see if he'll simplify it for AFEast. Check iTunes for his contact info or PM me and I'll put you in touch.

Plan B: Laurie Davis ported his app from Palm to the iOS world years ago. Load in the W&B for a specific airplane and save it. Then for each flight, enger the specific load numbers.

Both can send the forms to a printer.

Plan C: Many years ago I found an Excel sheet that does all this. Have each pilot create the sheet for their airplane. Each flight, enter the load numbers, print.

This aint rocket science. Everything is based on the TCDS for the specific model along with any STCs and latest W&B for the individual aircraft. If the owners of the aircraft aren't doing this already, something is wrong.

And this is where the problem lies. A single W&B form doesn't work because each airplane is different. Go read the TCDS just for the PA28 line of aircraft.

But let's go back to the comment "Why does AFEast need/want to capture this info?"
 
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I, too, would like more info on why this is necessary or when it would be a good thing to do.
 
Saving W&B from multiple flights

A lot of folks have developed excel spreadsheets that calculate, and sometimes even graph W&B based on user input. Back when I flew alot of rentals, I would search for an appropriate spreadsheet/ calculator and use it. Saving a new file for each flight would be very easy using that method.

You shouldn't need to build a new spreadsheet. By now, someone out there in just about every type club forum has already done it.
 
Maybe, for liability protection, they just want a record that the W&B was actually calculated?
 
brywd said:
Why do this? Has Angel Flight run into a legal problem involving this?

I'm struggling to understand this.
Click to expand...

RussR said:
You seem to be looking for two things, correct me if I'm wrong:

1) an easy way to calculate W/B for each airplane ride that day
2) a way to save/print them out

I have no idea why you would want to do #2. Seems like creating a load of paperwork for no gain. But an excel spreadsheet for each plane is pretty simple and would work well for this purpose.

As for #1, are your loads that different from airplane ride to airplane ride that it merits a separate W/B calculation for each flight? What I'll usually do in such a case is determine the edges of the envelope. In other words, with one passenger in the right seat, as long as he/she weighs less than say 250 pounds I'm in the envelope. Or, if people are in the back as well, as long as the front seater is 200 or less and the back seaters are 300 or less total we're fine. If either outweigh those numbers, I calculate, but other than that, no need.

Wouldn't this work for you?
Click to expand...

Matthew said:
Maybe, for liability protection, they just want a record that the W&B was actually calculated?
Click to expand...

Russ, you are essentially correct in what we are looking for.

As for everyone who is asking why, No we have not run into any issues and are working hard to keep it that way. In this situation its important to do a W&B for each flight. There are certainly liability avoidance issues and Compliance issues. Running a safe operation is first and foremost. Documentation is also important. Documentation while not fool proof certainly helps in avoiding problems. This is an advertised event if a friend from the FAA walks up and decides to ramp check one of the planes we'd really like to whip out the W&B if requested.
 
The app called Aviation W&B is what I use. It supports as many aircraft as you care to set up. You can "print" each W&B calculation to the camera roll of an iPad even while offline and then print it on paper or email it later as needed.
 
AdamZ said:
Russ, you are essentially correct in what we are looking for.

As for everyone who is asking why, No we have not run into any issues and are working hard to keep it that way. In this situation its important to do a W&B for each flight. There are certainly liability avoidance issues and Compliance issues. Running a safe operation is first and foremost. Documentation is also important. Documentation while not fool proof certainly helps in avoiding problems. This is an advertised event if a friend from the FAA walks up and decides to ramp check one of the planes we'd really like to whip out the W&B if requested.
Click to expand...
Roger all that, but why do you need to save the info from flight to flight and print it at the end of the day? After a given flight is back on the ground, you know all went well and the precise W&B calculation would seem to be moot. And this seems to be the most difficult issue.
 
petrolero said:
The app called Aviation W&B is what I use. It supports as many aircraft as you care to set up. You can "print" each W&B calculation to the camera roll of an iPad even while offline and then print it on paper or email it later as needed.
Click to expand...

+1

It can handle as many different types and as many unique tail numbers as you want to plug into it. Save or email a copy of each w&b with pax names or whatever you want to include. Problem solved.
 
Fltplan.com has a good one that can be emailed straight from their site.
 
You can do precisely what you describe with WnB Pro. actions then save profile.
 
Any W&B apps, for Android, that handle CG envelopes in moment instead of inches? Or do I need to do the conversions?

The Musketeer 23 CG envelope chart is only in moment units along the bottom.
 
Any of the iOS ones, once you've done the calculation, hold the power and front button down and voila...screenshot to the camera roll. Makes a perfect record.
 
Really? Do it on a spreadsheet.
If you don't know how, I'll write one for you and bill you for my time :)
 
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