Safety pilot

sdflyer

sdflyer

Pre-takeoff checklist
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sdflyer
OK,
I found out the following statements
Part 91.109 (3)
(ii) The person manipulating the controls has at least a private pilot certificate with appropriate category and class ratings

Part 61.31 (d) (e) Additional training required for operating complex airplanes. (1) Except as provided in paragraph (e)(2) of this section, no person may act as pilot in command of a complex airplane (an airplane that has a retractable landing gear, flaps, and a controllable pitch propeller; or, in the case of a seaplane, flaps and a controllable pitch propeller), unless the person has—



Here the scenario. I'm flying complex, high performance airplane for IFR re-currency and need a safety pilot. My friend holds PPL in same category and class; however, he doesn't have complex and high performance endorsement. Question:

Does he qualified to be a safety pilot? If so how can he log it?

Thank you
 
sdflyer said:
OK,
I found out the following statements
Part 91.109 (3)
(ii) The person manipulating the controls has at least a private pilot certificate with appropriate category and class ratings

Part 61.31 (d) (e) Additional training required for operating complex airplanes. (1) Except as provided in paragraph (e)(2) of this section, no person may act as pilot in command of a complex airplane (an airplane that has a retractable landing gear, flaps, and a controllable pitch propeller; or, in the case of a seaplane, flaps and a controllable pitch propeller), unless the person has—



Here the scenario. I'm flying complex, high performance airplane for IFR re-currency and need a safety pilot. My friend holds PPL in same category and class; however, he doesn't have complex and high performance endorsement. Question:

Does he qualified to be a safety pilot? If so how can he log it?

Thank you
Click to expand...

Yes. Second in Command. You are the acting PIC, he is not, nor is he manipulating the controls.

Cue flow chart.
 
As Ed says, he doesn't need the endorsements to be a safety pilot, as long as he's acting as SIC and not PIC.

He DOES, however, need a valid medical certificate since he's a required crew member when the hood is on.
 
And God help him if the PIC files for an IFR clearance, just to be in the system...then the Safety Pilot needs to be Instrument Rated too...
 
Ok, so then how about this

According
Part 61.31 (d) (e) he cannot act as PIC

but nevertheless he can log? Say for example while I'm under the hood he sees traffic and take controls to avoid it
61.51
(e) Logging pilot-in-command flight time. (1) A sport, recreational, private, commercial, or airline transport pilot may log pilot in command flight time for flights-
(i) When the pilot is the sole manipulator of the controls of an aircraft for which the pilot is rated, or has sport pilot privileges for that category and class of aircraft, if the aircraft class rating is appropriate;
 
sdflyer said:
Ok, so then how about this

According
Part 61.31 (d) (e) he cannot act as PIC

but nevertheless he can log? Say for example while I'm under the hood he sees traffic and take controls to avoid it
61.51
(e) Logging pilot-in-command flight time. (1) A sport, recreational, private, commercial, or airline transport pilot may log pilot in command flight time for flights-
(i) When the pilot is the sole manipulator of the controls of an aircraft for which the pilot is rated, or has sport pilot privileges for that category and class of aircraft, if the aircraft class rating is appropriate;
Click to expand...
He can log PIC under the sole manipulator clause when he's actually flying the airplane, and SIC for the time when you're under the hood and he's being your safety pilot.

RATED != ENDORSED.

When I went up for spin training in a tailwheel I got to log all the time as PIC even though I don't have a tailwheel endorsement. I also logged it all as Dual instruction and as tailwheel time. I can't act as PIC of a tailwheel airplane yet, but (let's all say it together now) ACTING and LOGGING PIC are two separate things.
 
Last edited:
Look at the flow chart. Questions will be answered.
 
Logging, acting, rated, endorsed, and privileges tend to confuse people the first time through.
 
TMetzinger said:
When I went up for spin training in a tailwheel I got to log all the time as PIC even though I don't have a tailwheel endorsement.
Click to expand...
So,..you're saying you logged the landing as PIC? (all together now...) :wink2:
 
midlifeflyer said:
What's the trick? :dunno: I think I must be slow today. I don't get it.
Click to expand...

He doesn't log the landing as PIC because that implies that he is PIC. Maybe it's just the way I read it. Plus, I don't recall a PIC or SIC landing column in any logbooks. :D
 
Chances are he wasn't actually landing, so he even if he manipulated the controls the entire time, that 30 seconds at the end when the instructor landed the plane he wasn't, so he wouldn't log the landing.

For example, when I'm instructing, the student is the one doing the landings. So I'm logging PIC and dual given as an instructor, but I'm not logging the landings. If I do a landing for a student to demonstrate something, I do log it.
 
EdFred said:
He doesn't log the landing as PIC because that implies that he is PIC. Maybe it's just the way I read it.
Click to expand...
The FAA reads it the same way -- he's logging the landing as the sole manipulator of the controls during the landing, not as PIC or SIC or anything else. The Chief Counsel discussed this when answering my question about CFI's getting credit for the landings performed by their trainees -- they don't.
 
Yes, I logged the landing - PIC is irrelevant. I made the landing with minimal assistance - all verbal.
 
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