Sacramento to east AZ -- general considerations

Irish_Armada

Irish_Armada

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Irish Armada
So I'm in the early planning stages of a flight from Sacramento to Willcox, AZ (just east of Tuscon) to visit my cousin in our Cherokee 180. This would be my longest cross country yet as a new private pilot. I'm thinking the trip will most likely happen in June or mid-July. Initial flight plan is KSAC, KPOC, KCHD, KTUS, E95, P33. The trip calculates out to about 6.5 hours of flight time, + another hour I'd guess for 2 (?) fuel/bathroom breaks (the fiance is going with me). This means if we were wheels up by dawn (6am) we'd be getting to the AZ high(er) country by let's say 2pm MST. In the summer, our destination airport (Cochise County) is going to have a pretty high density altitude by then (~4,200 ft elevation). I will be getting some mountain flying instruction here soon so that will help.

So I'd value your feedback on a couple of items I've been thinking about:

- Is this early enough (2pm-ish) to be getting to my destination in AZ? I know it gets hot, and hear it can get windy by then. Trying to balance getting there in one day and keeping the lady comfortable, and of course safety.
- Does it make sense to come down to the LA basin via the Tejon pass or the Tehachapi route then into LA by Palmdale? Perhaps a bigger threshold question: should I go through LA in the first place? Assuming I do, my flight plan basically has me more or less following Interstate 10 all the way out to Cochise County Airport.
- Anyone ever flown east of Tuscon? Looks pretty mountainy but it looked like following I-10 from Tuscon would be the best way to get to Cochise County.

Anyways, if I feel uncomfortable pushing the final stretch I can always put 'er down in Tuscon as its only about an hour drive from there to Willcox.

Thanks for any thoughts/advice.
 
I'd leave at 5:15am... even a bit before if you're OKd for night. Don't see any reason to go into Phoenix airspace, so I'd do KSAC KPOC KBLH KCGZ E77 P33. A few tweaks and you could easily get by at 7,500, much lower if you want to go below the peaks. 7,500 will help keep you cooler, too. Usually mornings are pretty tame, it's the T-storms that build up in the afternoons. June is less likely to have afternoon pop-ups. Don't sweat Tucson and East. Lot's of open space and roads.
Unless you are really loaded, DA isn't going to be a big factor. You'll be landing with partial fuel, and leaving P33 in the cool(?) of the morning.
 
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Cool, that makes sense, thanks Tim for the feedback. Although I'm a little worried about making sure the lady can be ready to go that early... :yikes:
 
Plan an alternate route VIA Tonopah and then check the forecast for winds. The shorter route should save you 45 minutes and favorable winds are likely saving another ~hour, not so much coming home.
 
Unless you are going to visit someone in Pomona I see no reason to cross the mountains and go into the basin. I usually stop at Fox then fly across the Mojave to Havasu then straight to Tucson.
 
LearDriver said:
What about going southeast over the Sierras then east of BIH with a fuel stop in IFP then direct to the destination?
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Interesting. That's similar to the Tonopah suggestion earlier. Is it a challenge to navigate through all the MOA's and Restricted airspace on that route? Either way, I'd be going over some of the higher Sierra's if I did that, which I haven't done yet. We won't be at max gross or anything like that, but I think I might prefer getting across at a lower section, like over Tehachapi at the south end of the central valley.

Silvaire: actually no real reason to go through Pomona, so I might follow your advice and just avoid the basin altogether. Thanks for the input.
 
Irish_Armada said:
- Is this early enough (2pm-ish) to be getting to my destination in AZ? I know it gets hot, and hear it can get windy by then.
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Another thing to be cautious of that time of year, besides the wind, is the monsoon thunderstorms that build quite quickly in the mid/late afternoon.

It'll be a beautiful day, then... this.
 
Leave early morning, go down to Palmdale and turn left.
 
Irish_Armada said:
Interesting. That's similar to the Tonopah suggestion earlier. Is it a challenge to navigate through all the MOA's and Restricted airspace on that route? Either way, I'd be going over some of the higher Sierra's if I did that, which I haven't done yet. We won't be at max gross or anything like that, but I think I might prefer getting across at a lower section, like over Tehachapi at the south end of the central valley.
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Going over the high Sierras is definitely the biggest issue on that route. It's hard to predict whether there will be clouds blocking your path, and even if there aren't, it should only be done when the winds are relatively light at ridge top level. It also depends on what you are flying. I wouldn't do it in a Warrior, for example, because the climb performance at high altitude is anemic.

As for restricted areas, the only one I see on the route he suggested is R-2310 southeast of Phoenix. That could be avoided by adding a waypoint well northeast of Phoenix, which you would need to do anyway, to avoid the class B.

http://skyvector.com/?ll=35.2958488...n=A.K2.KSAC:V.K2.BIH045005:A.K2.KIFP:A.K2.P33

If you want to avoid active MOAs, I've noticed that a DUAT briefing often contains information on which ones are active. When they are, in many cases it's possible to stay below them. You just have to look at the table on the sectional to find out what the altitudes are.

Unless conditions over the Sierras are ideal, when I fly from the Bay Area to the Phoenix area, I generally fly direct KWJF, and then either pass north or south of R-2501 depending on my mood. For your destination, it looks like direct KWJF direct P33 misses all of the restricted areas and most of the MOAs.

http://skyvector.com/?ll=35.4260615...301&zoom=10&plan=A.K2.KSAC:A.K2.KWJF:A.K2.P33
 
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Irish_Armada said:
Cool, that makes sense, thanks Tim for the feedback. Although I'm a little worried about making sure the lady can be ready to go that early... :yikes:
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Um ... If you plan on keeping this pilot thing going and are worried about the lady making the trip safe and comfortable ... you might reconsider the lady.

Or as Gordon Baxter (BAX of Flying Magazine) once said, "That's what my first wife said, too.".

:goofy:

Jim
 
Kristin said:
Leave early morning, go down to Palmdale and turn left.
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The lady knows of whence she speaketh. Me, I'd go over Tehachapi, head for Palm Springs through Banning pass, south to Imperial, then follow the freeway to Phoenix and Tucson. No big deal. No big hills.

Jim
 
I've made similar trips many times during the summer. The monsoon season may or may not have started by the time of your trip. Noon-3pm is about when you should expect storms to form around Tucson if the monsoon season has started.
 
Easy way. Go down to the LA/Palmdale area in the afternoon and then get going early the next am which should allow you plenty of time to get through before the monsoon TS get started. The monsoon season is really hard to predict this far out bit making it a day and a half trip is much more certain.

Alan
 
Crossing the sierra in a 180 Cherokee is quite doable. I used to fly one out of Mammoth Lakes.

Direct to Tonopah doesn't require flying a pass, you can follow HWY 80 if you like.

If you go farther south you probably want to cross NE instead of SE to align with a pass like at V230, 11,500 is a very comfortable altitude for that.
 
don't forget to account for the CBP stop too - thats suspicious behavior. :D
 
weirdjim said:
The lady knows of whence she speaketh. Me, I'd go over Tehachapi, head for Palm Springs through Banning pass, south to Imperial, then follow the freeway to Phoenix and Tucson. No big deal. No big hills.

Jim
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Tehachapi and Banning can get some pretty serious turbulence going in summertime. My practice is to try to avoid anyplace that has more windmills than houses. By "going to Palmdale and turning left" most of that mess is avoided, you avoid the 75 miles of east-west corridor into the LA Basin, and you avoid the San Gabriel Mountains, which can spawn some winds.
 
If you leave early enough - why not leave in the late afternoon - no worries about the girlfriend being ready at 0 dark 30 . . .

If you are night current its a pretty easy trip. . . .

Bring a L-3/4 low level IFR chart so you can see the routes and MEA's - but if you leave within 90 min of sunset even in July there is light sky late late late even in the southern latitudes. This way you can get to whereever your fuel stop is just after 8p [sunset] and the thermals will have collapsed and the winds will be dying down instead of getting worse. . .

Night time is a great time to fly in summer in the desert. . . . just like old days when we were kids and the adults would drive at night through the desert because a) the cars lacked ac, or b) would overheat if the ac was on or c) the car would just plain overheat in the desert in summer.
 
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