Really Bad Lesson

[DutchessFlier]

Yesterday, I had probably my worst expeience in flight training. I joined PoA because I wanted to have a resource to work with through my training and beyond. Thanks for being here!

I am about 40 hours into my PPL. This was an interesting week. Flew my prep ride for the 3rd solo with my CFI (who is an awesome teacher and friend) then he cut me loose on Friday. Was great! Flew for about 1.5 hours out into the practice area..did my maneuvers (even full stalls) had some fun flying in the area, out about 20 miles and tracked the local VOR back to the approach to my home field when I returned. I felt great and learned alot about myself on that flight. Got back, we did the postflight, and my CFI sets us up for the next lessons: back to more intensive work in short field/soft field T/O & landings, then VOR work, night work then cross country work.

Yesterday... lesson to do soft field/short field work. Weather was crappy and windy, but we had the ceiling and visibility to stay in the pattern. As I was preflighting the plane, I am thinking, man this is above my personal minimums right now. (RWY 15 / wind 12 kts 130-140 / gusts to 19). We talked about it, and I decided to go, and would call the flight if necessary.

I was horrible!!! I was inconsistent, was unstabilized in just about every phase of my pattern work, had the usual student crosswind issues and was trying to work in soft field work. I knew I was not mentally sharp, and my mind kept going back to that preflight moment when I questioned myself about the conditions. What bothers me the most, is whether my decision even to do that flight was wrong. Over the last 12 hours I am wrestling with the fact that my decision making skills should have been better.

My CFI and I had a very honest, open and intense postflight. He was very concerned that I was not listening to his instruction, that I was ahead of myself in the plane. I explained my mental state, the preflight concerns, and that my mind was not on the lesson, but was on the conditions and my decision to fly at all. How can it be that one lesson, and a solo flight, you fly in a manner which demonstrates proficiency,skill, and safety and the next, you can't seem to do it at all?

All things considered, I am airing this out to you all, first to get it out, and second to get any feedback you may have for me. Your thoughts and suggestions-comments are very much appreciated!

 

[dmccormack]

I was horrible!!! I was inconsistent, was unstabilized in just about every phase of my pattern work, had the usual student crosswind issues and was trying to work in soft field work. I knew I was not mentally sharp, and my mind kept going back to that preflight moment when I questioned myself about the conditions. What bothers me the most, is whether my decision even to do that flight was wrong. Over the last 12 hours I am wrestling with the fact that my decision making skills should have been better.

My CFI and I had a very honest, open and intense postflight. He was very concerned that I was not listening to his instruction, that I was ahead of myself in the plane. I explained my mental state, the preflight concerns, and that my mind was not on the lesson, but was on the conditions and my decision to fly at all. How can it be that one lesson, and a solo flight, you fly in a manner which demonstrates proficiency,skill, and safety and the next, you can't seem to do it at all?

All things considered, I am airing this out to you all, first to get it out, and second to get any feedback you may have for me. Your thoughts and suggestions-comments are very much appreciated!

Welcome to the board and to flying!

I grade myself after every flight -- whether I'm instructing or flying.

I've yet to have 100% on any flight.

Every once in a while there is a 70% -- or lower (I had a landing a few weeks ago in gusty x-wind conditions that was downright horrible. The Pax didn't complain but I knew better).


Don't beat yourself up too much. It sounds like you were at the edge of your personal comfort/ability envelope, and you may have been overcontrolling a bit. Flying is like athletics in this regard -- we do best when we work within a fairly narrow performance band -- not too relaxed, but not too amped.

 

[Geico266]

I agree with Dan, don't worry about it. Learn from your experience and move forward. There are days when I get done flying and tell myself I should have never left home, then there are days when I don't want to land.

Once you make a decision don't change your mind or question yourself until you are on the ground. Live with your decisions, and learn from them. You are building your knowledge base of decision making tools. As a student you are bound to make a few "misjudgments". Learn from the and move on.

Some days are diamonds, some days are coal.

Don't let the fact that there are pilots here with 1,000's of hours be intimidating. IMHO every time I fly I have the opportunity to learn something new. Whether I do or not depends on my ability to open my mind to learning.



...And a big POAWelcome.

 

[OtisAir]

You're gonna find that most folks on the board here will admit to having had bad days too. It gives you the opportunity to learn. Kinda sorta like a reality check. Keep you situational awareness in tact and you'll learn from every flight; I still do.

Welcome to the board as well.

 

[flyersfan31]

How can it be that one lesson, and a solo flight, you fly in a manner which demonstrates proficiency,skill, and safety and the next, you can't seem to do it at all?

Because some times you have it, and some times you don't. I'm willing to bet all of us had a similar experience during our training. I know I did. I thought I had it all nailed then, bam, one crappy lesson where even maintaining a heading was a major challenge. It happens.

You need to move on. Forget it. Next lesson will be completely different.

Personally, my rule of thumb is if I feel at all funny about flying, i don't go. I've turned around on my way to the airport before because I didn't "feel it."

Next time, I would suggest communicating your concerns with the CFI before and during the flight. The worst place to be stewing over something is in the air, where you need to be focused on flying, and only flying.

Hang in there. You'll be fine. It's worth it in the end!

 

[RJM62]

Based solely on my personal experience, I'd say that the couple of dual lessons I had on days when my gut had been telling me to stay on the ground were very useful. They taught me the importance of trusting my gut.

Chalk it up to experience, use it to reinforce the importance of staying within personal minimums, and move on. We can learn from our "bad" flights as much as (and maybe more than) we learn from our "good" ones. It seems you already have this time around, so consider it a successful lesson.

-Rich

 

[Ted]

As has been said, don't beat yourself up. We all have bad lessons and times when we aren't quite with it. It's something that happens to everyone.

No flight is ever perfect, especially when you only have 40 hours. Keep at it, you'll do fine. I had several flights when I was a student where I wondered how I could botch things up so badly. Now I think I botched the flight up if my landing wasn't a greaser. You'll get better with time.

 

[jmaynard]

People learn at different rates at different times. You have to be ready to learn, and if you're worried about whether you should be flying, you're not ready to learn.

Don't sweat it. Take the lesson you actually learned to heart: that you need to evaluate honestly whether this is a day to go flying, and stick to the decision. You can always learn short and soft field takeoffs and landings, but you can't always learn good decision making with someone there to help.

 

[jason]

First, welcome to the board. We're always happy to get new blood.

I don't think I can add much beyond what's already been said. I think the decision to go up was a fabulous one. You had an out and he was sitting in the right seat. You probably learned more on that flight than any of the past five. That said, don't be afraid to give it another shot. We all have our personal minimums, but learning to push through them safely is one of the most fulfilling parts of flying. The next time you look up and think "I could go up but I'm not sure if I'm comfortable doing so" grab your instructor and go. I promise that after two of three of those sessions the conditions from this flight won't even make you think twice.

Now get back out there!

 

[TangoWhiskey]

I don't think I can add much beyond what's already been said. I think the decision to go up was a fabulous one. You had an out and he was sitting in the right seat.

You've heard good advice on this thread. How would you ever know if your "gut" was right if you didn't go up and try, especially when you had an instructor on board who was proficient enough to be your backstop if it was over your current skill set?

That said, one day you will likely feel comfortable with those conditions... just not yet. That will come with practice and the mechanics of flying becoming "second nature" to you. This flight introduced a lot of new sensations... you need time to process those. Go up again, with your instructor, on a day with lighter gusts (G12-15) and practice with those. When proficient with those, watch for a day with gusts 17-19 and try it again. You'll build confidence and proficiency... something we continue to do through YEARS of flying and practice.

Oh, and WELCOME TO POA! We're glad you're here!

 

[Everskyward]

I joined PoA because I wanted to have a resource to work with through my training and beyond. Thanks for being here!

Welcome to the zoo!

my mind kept going back to that preflight moment when I questioned myself about the conditions.

When you are flying you need to focus on the task at hand and not stew about something that happened earlier in the flight. This is a common reaction but it's unproductive. It's also not reasonable to assume that you will do as well in adverse conditions as you did on another flight in good conditions especially if it's your first time seeing them. Your CFI probably just wanted to challenge you a little.

What bothers me the most, is whether my decision even to do that flight was wrong. Over the last 12 hours I am wrestling with the fact that my decision making skills should have been better.

I don't see how it was a bad decision. It seems like it was a joint decision with your CFI. It's good to be exposed to things that are a little bit outside what is comfortable for you when you have a CFI along. It's much better than if you were to face this the first time alone.

How can it be that one lesson, and a solo flight, you fly in a manner which demonstrates proficiency,skill, and safety and the next, you can't seem to do it at all?

That's also pretty common. People have good days and bad days. You need to know that this is normal and not be so hard on yourself. Good luck and have fun with your lessons!

 

[d.grimm]

I agree with INverted. Being able to shrug it off and move on and keep your head on the current condition is very important in flying, especially checkrides.
Dave

 

[DutchessFlier]

Funny how things happen like they do....Just about a half hour after my initial post this morning, I get a call from my CFI. Now, last night, the weather forecast here for this morning was pretty cruddy..and the TAFS all showed marginal at best. I was scheduled for a lesson at 1000 today, but we were both sure that was going to be cancelled due to the WX. Yesterday, I was in the state of mind that cancelling the lesson this morning might not be a bad idea. The front came through ahead of schedule last night, this morning was calmer, still breezy, but calmer, and the ceiling was around 3700. CFI says, cmon man let go flying this morning. I did. I knew from the moment I got into my car to drive to the field, my mind was at ease, my outlook for the flight was positive, and I was mentally and physically ready. Posting here helped me alot, and I thank you all as well.
Got into the soft field and short field work, had my share of plusses and negatives, but overall it was great (how do you get used to flying just above the runway at 59 kts! .

We finished the lesson, and on the taxi back, my CFI gave me the hi-five and said that he was sure I would want to get back upstairs right away. Yup! Postflight was completed, we fly again tomorrow at 4PM...VOR work and some more short-soft field work, then he tells me, oh by the way, get back here tomorrow night at 2100...our first night dual...I think you all were so right..I pushed myself to the edge of my personal limits, learned alot about myself and my skills, learned how much I still have to learn, realize what an excellent instructor I have, and love to fly even more than before. Yesterday might have been the most important lesson of my flight experience so far.

 

[gismo]

Funny how things happen like they do....Just about a half hour after my initial post this morning, I get a call from my CFI. Now, last night, the weather forecast here for this morning was pretty cruddy..and the TAFS all showed marginal at best. I was scheduled for a lesson at 1000 today, but we were both sure that was going to be cancelled due to the WX. Yesterday, I was in the state of mind that cancelling the lesson this morning might not be a bad idea. The front came through ahead of schedule last night, this morning was calmer, still breezy, but calmer, and the ceiling was around 3700. CFI says, cmon man let go flying this morning. I did. I knew from the moment I got into my car to drive to the field, my mind was at ease, my outlook for the flight was positive, and I was mentally and physically ready. Posting here helped me alot, and I thank you all as well.

It's amazing how much your state of mind affects your performance. And now you know what it feels like to have a bad day in the air and how quickly things can turn around when you feel up to the challenge. Next time you feel like you are performing sub par (and believe me there will be many a next time for that if you're anything like me), try to remember how much better things went when you were in a better frame of mind and then attempt to push yourself into such a place. This is a useful skill in many endeavors.

Got into the soft field and short field work, had my share of plusses and negatives, but overall it was great (how do you get used to flying just above the runway at 59 kts! .

Like most anything else: repetition. With repetition comes comfort as well as some "reflexes" (subconscious learned behavior) that leave more of your mental bandwidth for the trickier stuff.

We finished the lesson, and on the taxi back, my CFI gave me the hi-five and said that he was sure I would want to get back upstairs right away. Yup! Postflight was completed, we fly again tomorrow at 4PM...VOR work and some more short-soft field work, then he tells me, oh by the way, get back here tomorrow night at 2100...our first night dual...I think you all were so right..I pushed myself to the edge of my personal limits, learned alot about myself and my skills, learned how much I still have to learn, realize what an excellent instructor I have, and love to fly even more than before. Yesterday might have been the most important lesson of my flight experience so far.

A very good lesson indeed. As "Sully" so completely demonstrated, it's how you perform when things aren't working out well that really matters. The key is to focus on the tasks ahead rather than the difficulties behind.

 

[Lance F]

One more welcome to the board. Keep posting.
A couple of things crossed my mind when reading your first post.
Doing short/soft field approaches for the first time in gusty conditions may not have been the best lesson plan for the day. Generally lower approach speeds are used for the former and higher approach speeds for the latter. How exactly did your instructor teach that?
Then I will second the comments regarding your mental state once you did decide to go. Do not let the plane intimidate you. Do not let weather conditions intimidate you. It is absolutely ok to make a decision not to go, but once you do go you can't use up neurons being intimidated. You gotta be da man. You have to be confident. Use 100% of what you've got to fly the airplane. Have fun!

 

[rottydaddy]

(how do you get used to flying just above the runway at 59 kts! .

Best way to start is to ignore the airspeed indicator. Just fly the damn thing.

More seriously: practice, which leads to acclimation. Once you get a better handle on flying the plane quite low, or quite slowly, or both, more by "feel" than anything else, you will probably start to actually enjoy it. The "weird", challenging things that are exclusive to flight can become very satisfying once you have a little more time under your belt.
And later, practicing MCA, stalls, etc. "just in case", or even "just for fun" will keep you comfy with such maneuvers so that you'll be safer when you really need those skills.

Another thought, to sort of echo what Lance said: deciding to forget any part of your plan for the flight, including bagging the flight altogether, doesn't have to make you feel inadequate. Saying "no" can definitely be a sign of real confidence, just as bravado (which has killed a lot of pilots) can be a sign of insecurity.

When old-timers see you moping because you had to cancel, or you're stuck somewhere far from home because conditions have worsened , and they say stuff like "well, better to be down here wishing you were up there than the other way around", heed their words, and take heart! They're not just trying to make you feel better. It's the mantra of those with experience, and the real confidence that comes with it.

 

[Geico266]

Funny how things happen like they do....Just about a half hour after my initial post this morning, I get a call from my CFI. Now, last night, the weather forecast here for this morning was pretty cruddy..and the TAFS all showed marginal at best. I was scheduled for a lesson at 1000 today, but we were both sure that was going to be cancelled due to the WX. Yesterday, I was in the state of mind that cancelling the lesson this morning might not be a bad idea. The front came through ahead of schedule last night, this morning was calmer, still breezy, but calmer, and the ceiling was around 3700. CFI says, cmon man let go flying this morning. I did. I knew from the moment I got into my car to drive to the field, my mind was at ease, my outlook for the flight was positive, and I was mentally and physically ready. Posting here helped me alot, and I thank you all as well.
Got into the soft field and short field work, had my share of plusses and negatives, but overall it was great (how do you get used to flying just above the runway at 59 kts! .

We finished the lesson, and on the taxi back, my CFI gave me the hi-five and said that he was sure I would want to get back upstairs right away. Yup! Postflight was completed, we fly again tomorrow at 4PM...VOR work and some more short-soft field work, then he tells me, oh by the way, get back here tomorrow night at 2100...our first night dual...I think you all were so right..I pushed myself to the edge of my personal limits, learned alot about myself and my skills, learned how much I still have to learn, realize what an excellent instructor I have, and love to fly even more than before. Yesterday might have been the most important lesson of my flight experience so far.

You have learned one of the most important lessons about flying, and about life. Flying makes you a better person, and being a better person makes you a better pilot.

You have learned well Grasshopper.
(From the 70's TV show Kung Fu)

 

[Dan Thomas]

Yesterday, I had probably my worst expeience in flight training. I joined PoA because I wanted to have a resource to work with through my training and beyond. Thanks for being here!

I am about 40 hours into my PPL. This was an interesting week. Flew my prep ride for the 3rd solo with my CFI (who is an awesome teacher and friend) then he cut me loose on Friday. Was great! Flew for about 1.5 hours out into the practice area..did my maneuvers (even full stalls) had some fun flying in the area, out about 20 miles and tracked the local VOR back to the approach to my home field when I returned. I felt great and learned alot about myself on that flight. Got back, we did the postflight, and my CFI sets us up for the next lessons: back to more intensive work in short field/soft field T/O & landings, then VOR work, night work then cross country work.

From Transport Canada's Flight Instructor Guide:

Learning is made easier when the following factors are used:
(a) READINESS — Ensure students are mentally, physically and emotionally ready to learn.
(b) PRIMACY — Present new knowledge or skills correctly the first time. (Teach it right the first time.)
(c) RELATIONSHIP — Present lessons in the logical sequence of known to unknown, simple to complex, easy to difficult.
(d) EXERCISE — Ensure students are engaged in meaningful activity.
(e) INTENSITY — Use dramatic, realistic or unexpected things, as they are long remembered.
(f) EFFECT — Ensure students gain a feeling of satisfaction from having taken part in a lesson.
(g) RECENCY — Summarize and practise the important points at the end of each lesson, as last things learned and practised will be remembered longest.


Flying if you were tired violates Readiness. Flying in gusty crosswinds while trying to learn short/soft stuff violates Relationship if you haven't mastered crosswind work earlier. If you hadn't flown recently you were learning to fly all over again, violating Recency. These Learning Factors are not unique to aviation, but they hold true and we use them in training. The students don't normally see them, but we're conscious of their importance. Instructors who ignore them will have unsuccessful students, and it's not the student's fault. Don't get down about it.


Dan

 

[gprellwitz]

First off, another welcome to the board!

It sounds like you've already learned a lot from both your instructor and the others on the thread.

The only thing I'd add is a clarification to some of the comments that said "Once you make a decision don't change your mind or question yourself until you are on the ground. Live with your decisions, and learn from them." and "stick to the decision." What I would not want you to take from those comments is that you should stick by a decision that you made earlier if conditions change. You should continue to re-evaluate your decisions in the face of changing conditions or new information. That may be a realization that something isn't quite what you thought it was when you began. If in doubt, go ahead and land and think about it more on the ground.

 

[Ghery]

Welcome to POA. Lots of good comments above. You learned something from the lesson, even if it wasn't what you expected to learn. Not a wasted flight at all.

Pay attention to your mental state. You will find that it can have an amazing impact on how well you do. Let me give you a personal example.

Last year I was dianosed with prostate cancer. Medical was toast as of that instant. I continued lessons for a while working on my instrument rating. Our flying club requires an annual review with a CFI. A flight review qualifies, but I wasn't due last year. I flew my annual review with one of the CFIs in the club 3 days before the scheduled surgery for the cancer. My flying stank. At least, to my standards it was bad. I passed and got signed off to reset the review clock, but I wasn't happy with my flying. And I really couldn't put a finger on what was wrong. Lots of time in that airplane, airports I'm quite familiar with, but I just couldn't get it all together.

Some time after the surgery I looked back on it and it became obvious to me. My mind really wasn't on flying that day. It was on something that was going to happen in 3 days. I found it a valuable lesson. Like your flight, something to learn from.

The good news? Nailed the cancer, it's gone and I got my medical back a week and a half ago. Went flying last Monday for the first time in 10 months. Took a little longer to get the plane ready to go that normal, but we (CFI and I) went up in lousy cross winds, shot cross wind T&Gs at a neighboring airport and came back, all without bending anything. And I went up solo yesterday for a great 2 hours of sightseeing and more T&Gs, just with no wind. Difference from last July? My mind was in the game.

Again, you didn't have a bad lesson. You learned a bit more about where your limits are (at this time). You didn't bend anything. Now, go out and fly some more. This is an awful lot of fun, and a challenge to boot. Keep on posting and we'll be rooting for you to nail your checkride in the not too distant future.

Fly safe and have fun.

 

[wabower]

Most of the graybeards looked at the weather conditions you described as above your personal mins, then yawned, scratched and moved to another thread. Just another newbie bouncing and bitching. . . what's for lunch? Lakers game early or late? Do I have time to hit some balls before dinner?

So how is it that we all find ourselves so nonchalant about a day that was more work than you thought you wanted? Basically because we did the same thing you did. We went out with somebody that could handle the weather in case we couldn't and got knocked around until the novelty wore off and we were ready to take up horseshoes or gardening. First day was terrible, next day wasn't quite as bad and after a while it was just another day at the airport. It won't be long before it's that way for you too, just hard for you to see it quite as clearly since your nose is up against the glass.

Sounds like you have a good grip on things, and more importantly have someone that you really enjoy in the right seat. That combination usually leads to even more good things. Hang in there.

 

[4763E]

Take it from a girl who cried driving home from the airport more than a few times...it's pretty much chicken one day, feathers the next when it comes to learning how to fly.

The nice thing about it is one day you'll look back and realize you learned just as much on the bad days as you did the good ones...

Heck, I still have days I wish I could do over...

 

[DutchessFlier]

Thanks again everyone!! I will keep posting and be a part of this community as long as I fly. We did fly again this afternoon, twice. Back out into the practice area and under the hood for the whole hour for attitude flying, stalls, turns, unusual situations and simulated accidental IMC. Then we tracked a few NDB's and the VOR back to the field...(yes, the plane still has an ADF, which I am happy to have along). Our airport has a grass strip adjacent to one of our paved runways, so we finished the lesson using the grass for the soft field work. Sheesh, it does a number on the airplane, but drives home the point about having to master the technique.
Then, later this evening, we went out around 2045 and flew the pattern for about an hour in night conditions...that was pretty amazing!

 

[AdamZ]

You've heard good advice on this thread. How would you ever know if your "gut" was right if you didn't go up and try, especially when you had an instructor on board who was proficient enough to be your backstop if it was over your current skill set?

!

Yup exactly what Troy said. You did learn something. You learned that when your head ain't in it your not going to preform. Thats a good lesson and one you won't soon forget.

Good to have you hear at POA. Look forward to hearing more from you.

 

[EdFred]

Skipped all the responses so it might have already been said, but it's like this:

If you learned something, it couldn't be a "really bad lesson." You might have had bad decision making, or bad technique, but if you walked away, the plane is still in one piece and you learned something, it was a good lesson. Not all learning experiences are going to be incense and peppermint.

 

[spiderweb]

I agree with most everything that's been said. I was the world's worst and slowest student, but I had a great instructor, and I was willing to put in my best effort. I'm not a natural stick by any means, but over the years I've improved, gained experience, and a few ratings/endorsements.

NEVER GIVE UP, and listen to the wise men and women on this board. If you don't know who they are, you will quite soon.