Question regards scars and a future visit to an AME

James331 said:
:confused: I don't think my AME even has gowns.

Does your AME wear a full on white coat around the office too?
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This has happened at a number of different AME offices. I have been getting yearly EKGs for a long time.

Besides, how do you know whether the office has gowns or not if you haven't had an EKG there.
 
Unregistered said:
I was checking to see if a doctor would defer me based on that. Yes, it's an unusual thing that I did, but it was only with this one girl. I haven't really done it at all since then.
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Well, have you or have you not done it since then? Your choice of words leaves me wondering. Despite all the wishful thinking to the contrary here, I think you fully comprehend that there exists a real chance you'll be deferred.

Cutting is going to be viewed dimly, and you've already stated your scars may be interpreted that way despite your tale of deviant sex. I don't know of any AME in Ohio I would trust for something complex like this - so I can only recommend Dr. Chien, with whom I have personal experience. But you had better have your story straight and you'd better be honest with him, this is your future you are talking about after all.
 
Everskyward said:
This has happened at a number of different AME offices. I have been getting yearly EKGs for a long time.

Besides, how do you know whether the office has gowns or not if you haven't had an EKG there.
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It's a small office and a small pool of pilots.


Ether way, main point is the OP shouldn't have anything to be concerned about.
 
James331 said:
No, I just have never had have a busy body AME, I've also never dropped my pants for a AME, or any of the other weird (slightly homo erotic) stuff I've read here that some of your AMEs are doing.

It's really a simple physical unless someone doesn't want it to be.
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So your AME is skipping over at least questions 39 and 44.

Have you ever looked at the back of the 8500 form to see what the FAA expects?

And, there is nothing simple about it when it comes to things that might indicate to the FAA that there is a possibility mental issue - such as self inflicted cutting.

Dear O.P.

You have gotten all the advice you are going to get here - some people suggest hiding it. Others suggest finding out what will be involved before you commit to an FAA medical. Could you let us know what the outcome was once you do get this sorted out to help the next guy down the line.
 
James331 said:
:confused: I don't think my AME even has gowns.

Does your AME wear a full on white coat around the office too?
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AMEs often have a real practice that supports them and do AME stuff on the side because they are pilots. The one I used in Key West was an OB/GYN, I'd get funny looks in waiting room.:lol:
 
Would you actually want it noted on your file? Because then you could answer PRNC when the next AME asks.

Somebody needs to get a real answer from a real AME.
 
Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe said:
So your AME is skipping over at least questions 39 and 44.

Have you ever looked at the back of the 8500 form to see what the FAA expects?

And, there is nothing simple about it when it comes to things that might indicate to the FAA that there is a possibility mental issue - such as self inflicted cutting.

Dear O.P.

You have gotten all the advice you are going to get here - some people suggest hiding it. Others suggest finding out what will be involved before you commit to an FAA medical. Could you let us know what the outcome was once you do get this sorted out to help the next guy down the line.
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:rolleyes2:


Speaking of mental issues

.....some people just like to find problems where there are none.



I once cut my thumb with a razor knife while I was working on my house... But maybe subconsciously....I'll get right on the phone to OKC and self ground myself right now

Probably should call a lawyer too because I didn't declare that scar on my last medical too :rofl:
 
James331 said:
:rolleyes2:


Speaking of mental issues

.....some people just like to find problems where there are none.



I once cut my thumb with a razor knife while I was working on my house... But maybe subconsciously....I'll get right on the phone to OKC and self ground myself right now

Probably should call a lawyer too because I didn't declare that scar on my last medical too :rofl:
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Considering the importance of a thumb, you may as well just send yer cert to OKC and take that Walmart job.
 
My former AME, I started going to him when he was 75 years old and now recently retired, would always ask the same questions:

1. Any new scars that are big enough to make an ID on you if you bash your face in during a crash??

2. Have you gotten a tattoo of a bulldog on your d**k lately?
 
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iflyvfr said:
Well, have you or have you not done it since then? Your choice of words leaves me wondering. Despite all the wishful thinking to the contrary here, I think you fully comprehend that there exists a real chance you'll be deferred.

Cutting is going to be viewed dimly, and you've already stated your scars may be interpreted that way despite your tale of deviant sex. I don't know of any AME in Ohio I would trust for something complex like this - so I can only recommend Dr. Chien, with whom I have personal experience. But you had better have your story straight and you'd better be honest with him, this is your future you are talking about after all.
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I haven't done it sense then, and all the scars are about five years old. I've heard about Dr. Chien, but he's all the way out in Illinois. I'm not going to lie to my AME because I want to make a job out of this. I don't want to constantly go back to an AME every year and worry about them finding out that I lied on my medical form. The first hurdle is going to be the hardest. After that, they become "previously reported."

My main thing is that there's a difference between self harm regarding mental disorders and self harm regarding deviant sex and the practice of scarification. Self harm regarding mental illness is typically done in regards to coping with an issue because they have no way of coping with it in other ways. Often times, self harm can be a sign of further underlying mental issues in those cases.

As for the practice of scarification: it's basically like tattooing and has no negative emotion attached to it. Most of the times though, they're self inflicted, but does self infliction due to scarification equal self inflection in regards to mental illness? It was a thing for remembrance, although a very short sighted and stupid decision to make. Tattoos are basically self inflicted injuries using a needle to inject ink into the skin, and scarification has actually grown to be somewhat popular now.

Likewise, I never cut myself during my long ago sexual escapades. However, they have added up a considerable amount of scars, maybe around 50 lines that are parallel to each other. I'm not going to lie to my AME, but if I wanted to use an "accident excuse," I don't know of anything that can put 50 parallel lines on a person's arm close together and in extremely thin lines. Haha.

My thing is that I've always known how to cope with my emotions without regarding to hacking away at my skin. Bedroom practices and scarification are a completely different matter, in my opinion. I know I probably won't get any more answers unless I talk to Dr. Chien or to my AME on Wednesday, but I thought I'd bounce ideas here and try to get more information. :)
 
Use the lines to tattoo some FARS on your arm the FAA will love it.:D
 
I doubt the FAA will care about your tats, except to note them for ID purposes in a crash, as stated earlier. Tatooing is not considered a sign of mental illness. The scars from your bedroom kinks are what I'd be concerned about. Best to come clean with an AME who is a pilot advocate, discuss the whole thing with him. I doubt they care about bedroom stuff either, it all hinges on whether he believes you and whether he has the discretion to issue if he does (my guess is yes, but I'm not an AME).

Illinois isn't THAT far, but Michigan isn't far at all and Drs. Gordon and Pinnell are both very good. There are probably other good ones either in Ohio or in PA or IN.
 
Unregistered said:
However, they have added up a considerable amount of scars, maybe around 50 lines that are parallel to each other. I'm not going to lie to my AME, but if I wanted to use an "accident excuse," I don't know of anything that can put 50 parallel lines on a person's arm close together and in extremely thin lines.
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Considering the heightened awareness of suicidal pilots as a result of the Germanwings incident, it would not surprise me at all if an AME were to defer you if the self inflicted scars on your arm appear to be evidence of past suicide attempts, particularly if they're across the vein.

Another thing to consider is how visible these cut marks are. People are used to tattoos these days, but an employer may have second thoughts about someone who's into cutting themselves, for obvious reasons.
 
Blood fetish? Bleech! I wouldn't let a girl into that anywhere near my ba-donk-a-donk.

Nothing creative to add, I doubt anyone can call this one. Too weird. Just wanted to use the term "ba-donk-a-donk". Good luck to the OP, both on the pilot stuff and girl selection.
 
Matthew said:
Can they be inked over?
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They're keloid scars, so even though they can be inked over, the raised texture of them will still show through. I'm currently getting laser treatment to lower them to skin level so that tattooing may be an option, but that'll be years down the road before that occurs.
 
I haven't done it sense then, and all the scars are about five years old. I've heard about Dr. Chien, but he's all the way out in Illinois. I'm not going to lie to my AME because I want to make a job out of this. I don't want to constantly go back to an AME every year and worry about them finding out that I lied on my medical form. The first hurdle is going to be the hardest. After that, they become "previously reported."
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http://www.aeromedicaldoc.com/

You don't have to physically see Dr Chien for him to help you. You can consult with him via email, he'll charge ~$120 for this. Send him a picture of your scars and he can tell you what, if any, problems you may have. He'll tell you how to honestly and correctly fill out the medical form without stepping on a land mine. He may tell you that you'll need some sort of testing in advance to avoid a long delay while your case sits in an FAA in basket.

He will call the FAA on your behalf if that's appropriate.

If you want to make aviation a career then you need to consult a pilot-friendly experienced AME, Dr. Chien or someone like him, BEFORE you fill out the FAA Form and go for your actual medical.

Neither Dr. Chien or any other AME is going to advise you to lie, but there is a difference betweening lying and providing enough rope for a bureaucrat to hang you with you.

I can't emphasize this enough. One mistaken checkbox on that form can cost you thousands in unnecessary testing, and even disqualify you from flying forever.

Consult an experienced AME before hand, or live with the consequences of your mistake for years and years.
 
This whole thread brings to mind a good piece of advice I learned for Dr Chien - if you have a question, it's a good idea to get a confidential consult from an AME. If you're paying them, you're protected by Dr/patient. I might not use my regular AME for it, but if you want the skinny on you condition, it's a good step. Always a good idea to approach your medical from the position of knowledge and to already have all the testing done and passed before you put it on the line.
 
"Deviant sex" :lol:

It wasn't very long ago that homosexual sex was considered deviant and was illegal, go say that now and see what happens.

The dude got into some kinky stuff with his girl, highly doubt ether of them had a death wish, or were looking for anything other than to get their kink on.

Frankly I'd say this guy is probably more stable than all the people who put SOO much effort into being "normal".
 
James331 said:
Frankly I'd say this guy is probably more stable than all the people who put SOO much effort into being "normal".
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It wouldn't surprise me in the least. But we all know that if the FAA starts digging, the sticking point isn't what IS, but what can be DOCUMENTED.

Hypochondria by proxy, someone called it. Personally I think that's putting it mildly.
 
azure said:
It wouldn't surprise me in the least. But we all know that if the FAA starts digging, the sticking point isn't what IS, but what can be DOCUMENTED.

Hypochondria by proxy, someone called it. Personally I think that's putting it mildly.
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And that's why I wouldn't give them any thing to dig into.

Wouldn't say a thing, if someone asks, which they won't, cut my arm as a kid on a window.

Done and done.
 
James331 said:
And that's why I wouldn't give them any thing to dig into.

Wouldn't say a thing, if someone asks, which they won't, cut my arm as a kid on a window.

Done and done.
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From the sounds of it he has far too much, as well as patterned, scarring for that to fly.
 
Henning said:
From the sounds of it he has far too much, as well as patterned, scarring for that to fly.
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Of course it wouldn't fly. You just don't know for sure that the AME won't ask, and not knowing is a bad strategy to go into an exam with. It's written on his body, if the AME does ask, there is no guarantee he will accept what the OP has said is the truth. If he doesn't, OP is in deferral hell.

I really don't care if someone hides something of no real aeromedical significance, assuming there is a safe way to do it. That's between them and the FAA. There's just no safe way to hide this though. The OP needs information, as several of us have already said.

And he's not going to get it here unless Bruce comes back.
 
Unregistered said:
Sorry for double posting, but I have tried to create an account to access the AOPA forums. It'll let me put my information in and everything, but every time I try to access the member forums, it asks me to verify my username and password. Despite the fact that I put those in correctly, it denies me access. So I don't know what's up with the AOPA website. :c
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Access to the AOPA forums is a "paid membership benefit" and requires you to have a "cookie" from the main aopa.org site to show the forums you are a paying member.

Go to AOPA.org and log in there.

Then go to AOPA.org/forums and you should be allowed to log in successfully.
 
azure said:
Illinois isn't THAT far, but Michigan isn't far at all and Drs. Gordon and Pinnell are both very good. There are probably other good ones either in Ohio or in PA or IN.
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I was thinking the same thing about the benefits of road tripping to Peoria.

The OP could get all the correct info plus guidance on proper documentation, then have one of the best advocates to push this through the system.
 
So an update! I went to a regular AME yesterday and "forgot" the FAA MedXpress paperwork. I turned it into a consult and talked to the doctor about. Unfortunately, he was wary and said that he didn't feel comfortable signing it and that it would be deferred to the FAA.

So I called up Dr. Chien, and he said that he would most certainly be certifiable. All I need to do is go to a psychiatrist and get a pysch eval showing that I have no mental issues. Just thought I'd update this post so all that helped me know what's going on, and to help answer some questions in case another future pilot finds himself in this situation.
 
That actually makes a lot of sense. Problem is if someone was committing self harm they might leave identical scars. So the FAA wants someone in authority to say that you're OK, which you probably are. I imagine many of us have done some….. ah, er, unusual things in the presence of attractive members of the opposite sex. Just the activities didn't leave evidence.

Good luck, I hope it all works out. Better a blood fetish than drug addiction, I guess.
 
Bass boat Trolling motor prop accident.

Ask me how I know.
 
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