Practice PAR approaches

pericynthion

pericynthion

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pericynthion
On Sunday I was flying across the CA central valley with some time to spare and thought I'd ask Lemoore if I could fly a PAR approach just for the experience. They said that wasn't possible without a "facility license". Is that true at all military bases now? Might it have something to do with the station being IMC at the time - could I expect to have more luck on a VMC day?
 
Someone misunderstood and thought you wanted to land, not just do a PAR to a low approach. No facility license is needed to do an approach at a military base if you don't touch down. One memorable radio transmission on this point involves an instrument training flight which did a practice ILS at Dover AFB and appeared to do a T&G: "Cessna 123, Tower, that was a low approach, not a touch and go, right? Because if you did touch down, that would be very bad."
 
I think the key is to state your full intentions..... Ask for a practice PAR to low approach and go missed.

Using the word "practice" also alerts the controller that a clearance is not needed and the maneuver will be made in VFR conditions. Simply asking for the approach for experience should get you a full IFR clearance unless the controller asks for clarification.

I have done several low approaches into Camp Pendleton, ca this way.
 
When I was a controller at NAS Mayport, we were prohibited from doing PARs for civilian aircraft unless they were affiliated with the Navy Jax Flying Club. This was spelled out clearly in our Ops Manual.

On the other side of the coin, when I was flying out of Ft. Wainwright, the controllers there were always wanting to do PARs. It didn't matter whether the aircraft was civilian or not.
 
Never had a problem getting a par approach as long as the approach did not finish with a landing. When you ask for a practice approach you will probably get a new controller,who needs the practice also.
 
Anymouse said:
When I was a controller at NAS Mayport, we were prohibited from doing PARs for civilian aircraft unless they were affiliated with the Navy Jax Flying Club. This was spelled out clearly in our Ops Manual.

On the other side of the coin, when I was flying out of Ft. Wainwright, the controllers there were always wanting to do PARs. It didn't matter whether the aircraft was civilian or not.
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Yep, same policy we had in our Air Ops Manual. It's actually just copied from 00-80T-114 from the civilian transient aircraft section. Gotta have a civil aircraft landing permit for practice approaches. How closely Navy / Marine facilities follow that might vary by whom ever is working sup at any given time.

I too have gotten practice approaches at Army facilities no problem.
 
on a side note, were you flying over lake tahoe on saturday late AM/early midday timeframe? I looked up and saw what is in your sig and thought, "thats pretty cool!"
 
Ron Levy said:
Someone misunderstood and thought you wanted to land, not just do a PAR to a low approach. No facility license is needed to do an approach at a military base if you don't touch down. One memorable radio transmission on this point involves an instrument training flight which did a practice ILS at Dover AFB and appeared to do a T&G: "Cessna 123, Tower, that was a low approach, not a touch and go, right? Because if you did touch down, that would be very bad."
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I've heard that AF policy permits civilian approaches as long as you don't land, but I don't believe the Navy does the same.
 
My son is Navy ATC, I asked him about this earlier and he said that they can only do military aircraft.
 
Yep, tried to get an approach at PXT a while back. No dice on a random call up with out a license or other PPR. I did get PPR to actually land there once when my buddy was getting his general star and also turning over command of his squadron there in the same ceremony.
Alas the job intervened and I had to cancel. That would have been cool.
 
NAS Fort Worth is kind enough to allow practice PAR and ASR approaches when they're not busy. Also fun is to throw in No-gyro.

Otherwise we go to KACT (Waco) and ASR's are regularly available.

As all previous posts say.. low approach only for the military sites.
 
I love PAR and ASR approaches... The controllers need 5 approaches/month to retain proficiency... Try getting a PAR with a No Gyro approach... Even more fun! I consider this to be the, "LAZY PILOT'S APPROACH!"

They do all the work for you! They even tell you when you've reached DH!
 
akpilot907 said:
I love PAR and ASR approaches... The controllers need 5 approaches/month to retain proficiency... Try getting a PAR with a No Gyro approach... Even more fun! I consider this to be the, "LAZY PILOT'S APPROACH!"

They do all the work for you! They even tell you when you've reached DH!
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Currency varies by FAA / military branch. FAA specifies only 3 ASRs each quarter. Army requires 10 GCAs every 6 months. Navy / Marines require 10 GCAs each calendar month. Also, depending on the facility, simulations can be used to make up for the lack of "lives."

Currency usually isn't an issue until you go on to higher positions such as approach or tower. Then you have to make time in at the end of the month and bump someone off position to get current at the last minute. :wink2:
 
Did a PAR to missed approach in Cessna 182 at NAS Pax River tonight - good service despite them being busy
 
Back "in the day", we could get a PAR from Pease AFB NH, an ASR from Portland Maine, and DF Steer and DF Approach from Concord NH FSS.

It was standard at my flight school college for a Private student to get a night DF Approach under the hood during his night cross country training.

Don't think there is a DF facility left in the US.
 
Fearless Tower said:
I've heard that AF policy permits civilian approaches as long as you don't land, but I don't believe the Navy does the same.
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I always get approaches at Palmdale CA, AF Plant 42, cleared low approach to missed.

Depending what is happening at Nellis AFB, NV, you might get the ILS to higher minimums. It's an ILS/DME based on the Nellis TACAN, a freq not available to Civil aircraft. It's on an "unpaired" frequency.
 
BillTIZ said:
Back "in the day", we could get a PAR from Pease AFB NH, an ASR from Portland Maine, and DF Steer and DF Approach from Concord NH FSS.
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From some remarks on SkyVector it seems Pease still has military ops (ANG) and even PAR capabilities. I don't know if they'll do PARs for civilian aircraft though. Might be worth calling them to find out.

I've wanted to get over there someday just to shoot the ITAWT ITAWA PUDYE TTAAT, IDEED approach. Now I've got another reason.
 
I have never done one, but after looking at this video. I want to do some!

 
ATNAVICS PAR. The "new" stuff.
 

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BillTIZ said:
Back "in the day", we could get a PAR from Pease AFB NH, an ASR from Portland Maine, and DF Steer and DF Approach from Concord NH FSS.

It was standard at my flight school college for a Private student to get a night DF Approach under the hood during his night cross country training.

Don't think there is a DF facility left in the US.
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We did some DF stuff during my PPL training back when, but I've never heard nor seen anyone use it since.
 
35 AoA said:
We did some DF stuff during my PPL training back when, but I've never heard nor seen anyone use it since.
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Alaska officially decommissioned all DF capability a couple of years ago. It was time, although I have fond memories of working practice DF steers with FSS.

I haven't done a PAR approach to a military base in a long time. They were hit and miss with allowing them 20 years ago. We used to do VAR approaches to the civilian airport, though. Those were pretty fun under the hood. That was a long time ago, too.
 
Lawson AAF (LSF) still does civilian PARs. My CFII asked for a low approach and their response was "go as low as you want, just don't let the wheels touch." He suggested 200 agl, but I descended until over the numbers before initiating the miss. Much nicer than a civilian no-gyro approach. Now that they are so close, I'll have add them into my normal currency approach routine.
 
Stewartb said:
... We used to do VAR approaches to the civilian airport, though. Those were pretty fun under the hood. That was a long time ago, too.
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Okay, I have to ask. What is a VAR approach?
 
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