Portable Oxygen systems

StinkBug

StinkBug

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Dallas
On my trip this summer I borrowed a very nice system from a friend and now I'm looking to get a system of my own, especially after watching my passenger get hypoxic after electing not to use O2 like I suggested (I was using, and doing great).

I've looked into the system I borrowed, and unfortunately it's WAY outside my budget, especially for the small amount of time I spend at those heights. There are some deals to be had on Ebay for used stuff, but I wanna make sure I don't buy the wrong thing. I've found a number of different systems and noticed that there are several different styles of valve on the bottles as well. I'm a welder, so I'm pretty familiar with the various industrial valves, but usually they are somewhat gas specific with welding tanks. It seems Oxygen for breathing is a different story.

For example, the tank I used this summer had valve similar to my welding tanks, like the one on the left here. Many of the one's I've seen for sale have what I'm used to seeing as a medical tank valve like the one on the right.

02-b.jpg


I've also seen some others that appear to have the regulator built into the valve, or with a small knob on the side and the outlet going straight up.

My question is am I going to have any issues getting the tank refilled because of one type of tank valve or the other? I've tried asking the guys at 3 of the gas suppliers I use for work, but all of them are clueless when it comes to aviation o2. They all send the tanks out to be filled, and if it's a medical tank you have to have a prescription so I wanna make sure I don't end up with that headache. Unfortunately my FBO also does not fill, so they weren't much help either.
 
You will have a hard time getting "aviation O2" in there from the premium (markup) FBO suppliers but regular gas suppliers can usually fill them. Back in the day not all oxygen came from the same place but these days it all comes from a liquid O2 store and the welder's stuff is the same.

Relevant article:
http://www.avweb.com/news/pelican/182079-1.html

Alternatively you can buy an expensive transfiller that will allow the 870 valve to fit to the type that FBOs use.
 
Yep, all O2 is the exact same. Buy the welding O2
 
I know the gas is the same these days, even though the suppliers have been telling me differently. Question was on the valves and getting the bottle filled. None of the welding suppliers around here fill, they all send the bottles out.

I just wanna make sure that if I walk in with a bottle with the valve on the right I'm not gonna have an issue with them telling me it's a medical bottle and I need a prescription, or some crap like that.
 
Last edited:
Aluminum tanks are nice. They arent such a lethal missle in the cockpit. But if you are going to strap it down the steel ones work, if you dont mind the weight. Get a bigger one than you think you need. Trouble with Oxygen, you get up there and run out, now what do you do? YOu reaally need TWO tanks. One backup. If you want to fill it at the airport you pretty much gotta get the aviation ones. They just have the one fitting from what Ive seen. I can get mine filled for 20 bucks. Its a small one (one hour on 2 liters per min) I believe. Too small. I just stick the tube in my mouth. Turned out I like that better than masks. If you start taking them apart, beware, they tend to have unmarked left hand threads. You need a special vice for the aluminum ones otherwise they bend. Steel ones are easier to work on, they dont bend.
 
AustinPilot said:
You will have a hard time getting "aviation O2" in there from the premium (markup) FBO suppliers but regular gas suppliers can usually fill them.
Click to expand...

Please explain. I've found the opposite. Never had a problem getting O2 filled at big city FBOs. Small FBOs can be hit or miss.
 
Dallas,

I can not believe all the miss information on here. Want to hear the truth from a tightwad aircraft owner?

First of all there is only one way to purchase O2 bottles, go for the aluminum 24 cu ft bottles, you buy them off EBay or from yard sales. Buy the medical oxygen bottles after folks have died. Yep, you heard it right. Lots of old folks who were on oxygen die every month and the family has no use for the bottles.

I never pay over $10.00 for a 24 cu ft bottle, and it has to be in perfect condition. Sure it is a medical bottle.

I then take the bottle to AirCo or you could use your supplier of industrial gasses. They take my bottle, hydro test it, change the valve from medical to aviation, and fill it with O2 for a charge of $24.00.

I do refill my own from a 282 cu ft bottle with a transfer hose that cost me about $50.00 and will last a lifetime.

When I was young and dumb with my first turbo craft I got my bottle filled at Henderson Nevada. They took my bottle to fill and returned it the next day, Next annual I found out that they had exchanged my bottle for an expired one. Always have your name on a bottle.

I never leave home with less than two bottles, and end up using less than half of one of them. Oxygen is so cheap when you fill your own and you can top them off for each trip. I now always use O,2 ten thousand and above and five thousand and above at night. I also use the inexpensive finger Oxymeter.

I want to live to be an old pilot and not a broke pilot.

Life is a barrel of fun.

Ken Andrew
 
coloradobluesky said:
Trouble with Oxygen, you get up there and run out, now what do you do? YOu reaally need TWO tanks. One backup.
Click to expand...

The tank I borrowed would easily outlast my fuel range. We used it for at least 5 hours, 2 people and it was still above half the starting pressure when I returned. Sounds like you have a really small tank.

If you want to fill it at the airport you pretty much gotta get the aviation ones. They just have the one fitting from what Ive seen.
Click to expand...

And which fitting is that? I've seen multiple different ones on the market, all sold as "aviation".
 
Go to your FBO and look at their fitting on their fillup system. Its that one. Ask the guy how many he has. Mine only has one. And it fits my SkyOx.
 
My FBO doesn't fill. Already tried asking them.

Here's what I'm seeing though

skyox
image.img


Different skyox
s-l1600.jpg


AirKing
s-l1600.jpg


Precise Flight
PFlight_0010_!570x328.jpg


Can you see why I'm confused?
 
Talk to any glider pilot, glider club or soaring center. You'll not want the "medical" connection. As a previous post stated, get it converted to the aviation style. Every where that can fill bottles will have the aviation safety style connectors. We maintain two large bottles that our members refill from. Different types of canula/mask, flow meters, dependent on altitude used. Check any soaring supply web site like Wings and Wheels, Cumulus Soaring, etc.
 
ksandrew said:
Dallas,

I can not believe all the miss information on here. Want to hear the truth from a tightwad aircraft owner?

First of all there is only one way to purchase O2 bottles, go for the aluminum 24 cu ft bottles, you buy them off EBay or from yard sales. Buy the medical oxygen bottles after folks have died. Yep, you heard it right. Lots of old folks who were on oxygen die every month and the family has no use for the bottles.

I never pay over $10.00 for a 24 cu ft bottle, and it has to be in perfect condition. Sure it is a medical bottle.

I then take the bottle to AirCo or you could use your supplier of industrial gasses. They take my bottle, hydro test it, change the valve from medical to aviation, and fill it with O2 for a charge of $24.00.

I do refill my own from a 282 cu ft bottle with a transfer hose that cost me about $50.00 and will last a lifetime.

When I was young and dumb with my first turbo craft I got my bottle filled at Henderson Nevada. They took my bottle to fill and returned it the next day, Next annual I found out that they had exchanged my bottle for an expired one. Always have your name on a bottle.

I never leave home with less than two bottles, and end up using less than half of one of them. Oxygen is so cheap when you fill your own and you can top them off for each trip. I now always use O,2 ten thousand and above and five thousand and above at night. I also use the inexpensive finger Oxymeter.

I want to live to be an old pilot and not a broke pilot.

Life is a barrel of fun.

Ken Andrew
Click to expand...

:yeahthat:
 
I called maybe 15 places, not kidding, to find a place that would fill my bottle. Then I ended up buying a connector to convert the medical valve to a welding valve off eBay. I still get some hassles every once in a while because of the connector, but otherwise works well for me.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
The bottles are largely immaterial but the industrial ones you are looking at are just going to consume gross weight compared to the lighter aviation ones.

There is one thing where aviation (as opposed to repurposing welding and medical parts) will help. A demand regulator such as the MountainHigh or PreciseFlight ones will dramatically extend bottle life which will mean can get longer durations out of smaller bottles and less frequent filling. With the PreciseFlight regulator, I can go long enough that the cost of getting the bottle filled is down in the noise, whether I use the $50 fill up at the FBO or the $20 fill at the local welding place.
 
Found this bottle for $50 on Craigslist.

Will it work?

24473a4e96b425777dc6fdc08f23db32.jpg
 
I talked to a couple of the gas places again today and finally found people that knew WTF I was talking about. They can and will fill the medical style tanks like the one Jose just posted with Aviation Oxygen. They said the tank doesn't matter, only what's going in it. If you want Medical O2 (we dont) you need a prescription, but filling the tank with non-medical O2 is not a problem.

Bottom line, I just ordered a brand new aluminum tank, regulator, flow meters and oxymizer cannulas for about $450 less than the same setup with an aviation brand on it.
 
StinkBug said:
Bottom line, I just ordered a brand new aluminum tank, regulator, flow meters and oxymizer cannulas for about $450 less than the same setup with an aviation brand on it.
Click to expand...



Do you have links to the items you ordered?

Help others follow your footsteps.
 
ksandrew said:
Dallas,

I can not believe all the miss information on here. Want to hear the truth from a tightwad aircraft owner?

First of all there is only one way to purchase O2 bottles, go for the aluminum 24 cu ft bottles, you buy them off EBay or from yard sales. Buy the medical oxygen bottles after folks have died. Yep, you heard it right. Lots of old folks who were on oxygen die every month and the family has no use for the bottles.

I never pay over $10.00 for a 24 cu ft bottle, and it has to be in perfect condition. Sure it is a medical bottle.

I then take the bottle to AirCo or you could use your supplier of industrial gasses. They take my bottle, hydro test it, change the valve from medical to aviation, and fill it with O2 for a charge of $24.00.

I do refill my own from a 282 cu ft bottle with a transfer hose that cost me about $50.00 and will last a lifetime.

When I was young and dumb with my first turbo craft I got my bottle filled at Henderson Nevada. They took my bottle to fill and returned it the next day, Next annual I found out that they had exchanged my bottle for an expired one. Always have your name on a bottle.

I never leave home with less than two bottles, and end up using less than half of one of them. Oxygen is so cheap when you fill your own and you can top them off for each trip. I now always use O,2 ten thousand and above and five thousand and above at night. I also use the inexpensive finger Oxymeter.

I want to live to be an old pilot and not a broke pilot.

Life is a barrel of fun.

Ken Andrew
Click to expand...


That.


Personally I prefer to just not fly high enough in unpressurized aircraft to need it, having junk up my nose or masks on and getting all dried out just isn't something I like to do.
 
JoseCuervo said:
Do you have links to the items you ordered?

Help others follow your footsteps.
Click to expand...

All of it was on ebay. I just searched for aluminum oxygen tank, oxygen regulator, oxymizer, etc. and pieced it all together. I also found someone selling the nice precise flight inline flow meters for much less than retail, but the rest was all stuff from various ebay stores.
 
If I had to do it over again, Id get a 4 hour tank. They seem to fill it for the same $20 as my 1.25 hour tank. SkyOx claims their valve is a "standard valve". From the pictures, I would say it is a "540" valve. What matters is does your supplier have a connector to fit the regulator you have. Some may have more than one adapter. Mine only has one.

If I use it 10 times a year (which I dont), thats $200 a year. Hardly worth getting a filling setup with larger tanks etc for me. YMMV. As for buying used equipment, sure it will be less, but will it work properly? Where do you think these Oxygen suppliers dump their broken regulator/bottles? Ebay 'em. As for using welding gas. Dunno. I buy mine from the FBO. No negative consequences yet. I just stick the tube in my mouth. Didnt like the mask or the thing in my nose. If you want to conserve on O2, just turn it off for exhaling and on for inhaling. I just hold the bottle in my lap. Uses at 1/2 the rate. Hey, it works for me! As I said, YMMV.

Theres a picture in the first thread with a "CGA540" label on it. I think thats what a 540 valve looks like. Can anyone verify that?
 
ksandrew said:
Dallas,

I can not believe all the miss information on here. Want to hear the truth from a tightwad aircraft owner?

First of all there is only one way to purchase O2 bottles, go for the aluminum 24 cu ft bottles, you buy them off EBay or from yard sales. Buy the medical oxygen bottles after folks have died. Yep, you heard it right. Lots of old folks who were on oxygen die every month and the family has no use for the bottles.

I never pay over $10.00 for a 24 cu ft bottle, and it has to be in perfect condition. Sure it is a medical bottle.

I then take the bottle to AirCo or you could use your supplier of industrial gasses. They take my bottle, hydro test it, change the valve from medical to aviation, and fill it with O2 for a charge of $24.00.

I do refill my own from a 282 cu ft bottle with a transfer hose that cost me about $50.00 and will last a lifetime.

When I was young and dumb with my first turbo craft I got my bottle filled at Henderson Nevada. They took my bottle to fill and returned it the next day, Next annual I found out that they had exchanged my bottle for an expired one. Always have your name on a bottle.

I never leave home with less than two bottles, and end up using less than half of one of them. Oxygen is so cheap when you fill your own and you can top them off for each trip. I now always use O,2 ten thousand and above and five thousand and above at night. I also use the inexpensive finger Oxymeter.

I want to live to be an old pilot and not a broke pilot.

Life is a barrel of fun.

Ken Andrew
Click to expand...

BillTIZ said:
:yeahthat:
Click to expand...

:yeahthat: again!
 
Do your own refill system? Thats two more bottles and two more regulators and space in your hangar. Fine if you want to go that way. Depends on what you want. Youre going to have to use it enough to justify all that. I guess after a while, it might be worth it. A lot of suppliers just want to switch tanks with a full one.

Recommended usage rates below 14k are 2 liters per minute. So 120 liters are one hour for one person. 120 liters are about 4 cu ft.

Thats not what they measure though, its what they are rated. Dont ask me, I dunno how they come up with that. IF you measure a tank that is supposed to be 24 cu ft, that would be 1' in diameter and 24' long!!! A 24 cu ft tank is NOT that big. It must be the cu ft when its released into the atmosphere or something. I dunno.

If you want to refill at aviation FBOs you need the standard aviation valve (a 540). Wrestling these valves isnt trivial, especially on aluminum tanks (cant put them in a vice).

If you want to set up your own filling station, you dont need my help. I dont know enough.
 
Fearless Tower said:
Please explain. I've found the opposite. Never had a problem getting O2 filled at big city FBOs. Small FBOs can be hit or miss.
Click to expand...

I was referring to the medical tanks with the 870 valves. FBOs will want the 580 valve. Welding suppliers may be able to do either, depending.
 
I talked to the only FBO at my field that does oxygen and they have the adapter for the medical valves as well to refill tanks for the medivac helis they service they said. Their prices are a lot higher than the welding shop though.
 
coloradobluesky said:
Do your own refill system? Thats two more bottles and two more regulators and space in your hangar. Fine if you want to go that way. Depends on what you want. Youre going to have to use it enough to justify all that. I guess after a while, it might be worth it. A lot of suppliers just want to switch tanks with a full one.
Click to expand...

That's my thought as well. I haven't priced full size oxygen cylinders lately, but both of my argon tanks (for welding) were over $300 a piece. Then you still have to add all the plumbing. So that's a minimum of $700 to start from scratch in addition to the stuff I'm already buying. I can pay to fill the tank I just bought 24 times for that, and for how much I use it that's many years of fillups.

In 60 hours of flying across the country last month we were on oxygen for at least 5, and didn't even use half of a 15cu ft bottle. At that rate, for how much I fly high, I'm happy to pay for fills. I'm especially happy that I wont even have to bother changing valves.
 
Welding suppliers around here just want to switch bottles. The FBO will fill mine.

Can anyone give me the name of a welding supplier that will fill my aviation bottle?
 
So, piecing together a system, you need a tank, a valve, flow meters, and cannulas? What else?


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
 
N2124v said:
So, piecing together a system, you need a tank, a valve, flow meters, and cannulas? What else?


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Click to expand...


Hoping somebody will chime in, with links to the products that work.

A recipe of sorts.
 
coloradobluesky said:
Welding suppliers around here just want to switch bottles. The FBO will fill mine.

Can anyone give me the name of a welding supplier that will fill my aviation bottle?
Click to expand...

Location would help, as a lot of suppliers are local/regional. 2 out of the 3 I called would fill, but had to send it out. Those were westair and airgas. The third was closed that day.
 
N2124v said:
So, piecing together a system, you need a tank, a valve, flow meters, and cannulas? What else?


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

Technically you don't need the flow meters, they just make it easier to adjust the flow for altitude and help save oxygen. Simply dialing in the flow on a regulator is fine.

At a bare minimum you need a tank, regulator and hose. If you don't wanna suck directly on the hose like some in this thread you'll also need cannulas. If you wanna spend a little more but save on O2 use you can get oxymizer cannulas and the inline flow meters.

Tank - there are a TON on ebay, new and used and tons of sizes. This is the one I ordered.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/D-Size-Alum...oggle-Valve-/151707712468?hash=item23527bfbd4

Regulator - again many options but this seems to be the most common style, and fairly compact and simple
http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-Drive-M...Barb-Outlet-/141692499191?hash=item20fd87f4f7

Cannula - oxymizer style here, also available from medical suppliers
http://www.pilotshop.com/catalog/ps...9kG1b8KGJOiEZ-Mao8rLwS6vIi6tsdFiEAaAlXY8P8HAQ

Flow meter - this seems to be the only aviation specific item, and it's NOT necessary, but it is nice.
http://www.pilotshop.com/catalog/pspages/mh-flowmeter1.php
 
I've seen all sorts of canulas in medical supply catalogs but never an oxymizer. You use a medical canula, you're just throwing O2 into the air and not delivering it to the pilot once you get to the altitudes you're concerned about.

Everybody want's to build their system out of junk to save a few $$$, but frankly what's the point. I guess you are happy with short durations (O2 is only useful if you have enough to get you through your high altitude flight) and excess gross weight from these steel monstrosities.
 
flyingron said:
I've seen all sorts of canulas in medical supply catalogs but never an oxymizer. You use a medical canula, you're just throwing O2 into the air and not delivering it to the pilot once you get to the altitudes you're concerned about.



Everybody want's to build their system out of junk to save a few $$$, but frankly what's the point. I guess you are happy with short durations (O2 is only useful if you have enough to get you through your high altitude flight) and excess gross weight from these steel monstrosities.
Click to expand...


Aren't the tanks linked Aluminum?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
James331 said:
That.


Personally I prefer to just not fly high enough in unpressurized aircraft to need it, having junk up my nose or masks on and getting all dried out just isn't something I like to do.
Click to expand...

Some of us don't have that option, when our ground is over 5000 MSL and regular flight altitude is 9-12K MSL.
 
StinkBug said:
Technically you don't need the flow meters, they just make it easier to adjust the flow for altitude and help save oxygen. Simply dialing in the flow on a regulator is fine.

At a bare minimum you need a tank, regulator and hose. If you don't wanna suck directly on the hose like some in this thread you'll also need cannulas. If you wanna spend a little more but save on O2 use you can get oxymizer cannulas and the inline flow meters.

Tank - there are a TON on ebay, new and used and tons of sizes. This is the one I ordered.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/D-Size-Alum...oggle-Valve-/151707712468?hash=item23527bfbd4

Regulator - again many options but this seems to be the most common style, and fairly compact and simple
http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-Drive-M...Barb-Outlet-/141692499191?hash=item20fd87f4f7

Cannula - oxymizer style here, also available from medical suppliers
http://www.pilotshop.com/catalog/ps...9kG1b8KGJOiEZ-Mao8rLwS6vIi6tsdFiEAaAlXY8P8HAQ

Flow meter - this seems to be the only aviation specific item, and it's NOT necessary, but it is nice.
http://www.pilotshop.com/catalog/pspages/mh-flowmeter1.php
Click to expand...

The $45 oximeter from Walgreens wouldn't hurt, either. Just to monitor your O2.
 
flyingron said:
I've seen all sorts of canulas in medical supply catalogs but never an oxymizer. You use a medical canula, you're just throwing O2 into the air and not delivering it to the pilot once you get to the altitudes you're concerned about.

Everybody want's to build their system out of junk to save a few $$$, but frankly what's the point. I guess you are happy with short durations (O2 is only useful if you have enough to get you through your high altitude flight) and excess gross weight from these steel monstrosities.
Click to expand...

Here you go ron, Oxymizer from a medical place. Actually the first link that comes up when you google "oxymizer". In fact in the entire first page of google results all but one were medical sites.

http://www.blowoutmedical.com/oxymi...ase&utm_campaign=products&feed_special=google


Also the tanks I linked are aluminum, the exact same tanks sold by several of the "aviation" system sellers at a much higher price.
 
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