Paris and what it means for us/me

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rt4388

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rt4388
So with the Paris incident and some other political shifts, it seems like it is likely we may be headed back to fight a war again sometime soon. I don't really want to get into if we will or won't or the politics behind it, but I have some questions about military flying that some people here might be able to answer.
Basically, how hard is it to become a military pilot? I'm about to graduate with 3 degrees and roughly a 3.1 GPA (not great, but also worked full time in college). I'm not sure if previous flight experience makes a difference, but I do have my PPL.
I would love to fly some sort of jet, but I would be happy with just about anything other than a helicopter. Also, I'm torn between doing some sort of Guard/Reserve work or making it a full time obligation. So if anyone can explain what the different tracks entail that would be helpful. Obviously, I should reach out to a recruiter, but maybe someone on here has some sort of advice before I do so. Thanks guys!
 
Go make money with that education. Let the french fight for themselves.
 
rt4388 said:
So with the Paris incident and some other political shifts, it seems like it is likely we may be headed back to fight a war again sometime soon. I don't really want to get into if we will or won't or the politics behind it, but I have some questions about military flying that some people here might be able to answer.
Basically, how hard is it to become a military pilot? I'm about to graduate with 3 degrees and roughly a 3.1 GPA (not great, but also worked full time in college). I'm not sure if previous flight experience makes a difference, but I do have my PPL.
I would love to fly some sort of jet, but I would be happy with just about anything other than a helicopter. Also, I'm torn between doing some sort of Guard/Reserve work or making it a full time obligation. So if anyone can explain what the different tracks entail that would be helpful. Obviously, I should reach out to a recruiter, but maybe someone on here has some sort of advice before I do so. Thanks guys!
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How hard? It depends on what their needs are at any given time. From what I understand, they've scaled back recruiting for flying positions, and shift folks around (I.E. remotely flying drones). As far as being competitive, along with the usual demographic attributes, having an engineering degree is favorable.

The hardest part is once you've been selected. The washout rate for pilot training is high, and you're either good or your out. You better have good study habits too, and a willingness to learn. Good luck.
 
rt4388 said:
So with the Paris incident and some other political shifts, it seems like it is likely we may be headed back to fight a war again sometime soon. I don't really want to get into if we will or won't or the politics behind it, but I have some questions about military flying that some people here might be able to answer.
Basically, how hard is it to become a military pilot? I'm about to graduate with 3 degrees and roughly a 3.1 GPA (not great, but also worked full time in college). I'm not sure if previous flight experience makes a difference, but I do have my PPL.
I would love to fly some sort of jet, but I would be happy with just about anything other than a helicopter. Also, I'm torn between doing some sort of Guard/Reserve work or making it a full time obligation. So if anyone can explain what the different tracks entail that would be helpful. Obviously, I should reach out to a recruiter, but maybe someone on here has some sort of advice before I do so. Thanks guys!
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Probably have more luck getting into a drone seat than a plane seat, that's where the expansion is. What's your degree? Is it something technically useful? That plus prior pilot experience would make you a prime candidate, you should be asking this question at the ROTC or recruiter office for your campus.
 
The future is unmanned aircraft. I'd be looking there. Still need for manned aircraft, but that will become harder to get into (with a less secure future).
 
Do some research on the aptitude testing, for all the services - that's one hurdle that'll make-or-break your application. You can prep for the testing, and improve your scores.

Don't sweat the grades or your under-grad degree so much; yeah a 4.0 in engineering won't hurt you. And won't help nearly as much as you might imagine; graduating with decent grades in animal husbandry worked just fine for someone I know. What I'm saying is, don't throw in the towel 'cause you got a 3.1 GPA.

Active Duty, Guard, or Reserve, the first couple of years will be full time, regardless - typically OCS and UPT; for Guard, find a unit flying the aircraft you want to fly, hit their recruiter. Same-same for Reserves. For either, get out to visit (recruiter will arrange it) and talk to the pilots there.

Whatever your preconceptions are, unless you're in touch with current members, you're probably wrong about the reality. If you want it, pursue it, regardless of what you hear about low-numbers on in-take, etc. You might be shocked at how much timing and luck has to do with selection.

The people involved in selecting you are looking for initiative; you'll need to do research, figure out what a "good" application package looks like, and carry the ball. When you have to write a narrative for your package, it had better be succinct, well written, grammatically correct, and focused on the topic. Get it proof-read, edit it, hover over it like a new-born.

I have seen a excellent on-paper candidates (including a MIT grad) go down in flames because they couldn't write worth spit. . .

People will tell you your civilian pilot experience won't matter - horse poop; maybe not so much for PP SEL, but if you have a Commercial and CFI, and some paid flying, it CAN be a differentiator.

Good luck!
 
Not likely you'll get in, drones will probably be flying over whatever new country we invade this time.

FYI, you'd be helping recruit for isis by dropping bombs over there BTW. If you want to make a positive difrence maybe fly for the boarder patrol and keep people who don't belong here, out of here. Or join the Minutemen, maybe fly for them full scale or UAS. Or help promote our right to bear arms. Or promote legal immigrants adopting to American culture.

I get you want to fly, but try to be part of the solution not the problem.
 
James331 said:
Or join the Minutemen, maybe fly for them full scale or UAS. Or help promote our right to bear arms. Or promote legal immigrants adopting to American culture.

I get you want to fly, but try to be part of the solution not the problem.
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Sure. Military service to our country or joining a militia...yeah, those are pretty much the same thing. :no:
 
Shawn said:
Sure. Military service to our country or joining a militia...yeah, those are pretty much the same thing. :no:
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Totally different. One serves America the other serves evil out to destroy America.;)
 
I always tell people you won't know until you apply. Too many prospects become demotivated because of rumors they hear. Seek out a recruiter to guide you through the process. First step is knock out the flight aptitude test for the service you seek. After that, then worry about other packet items such as the flight physical.

Acceptance percentages vary wildly depending on service and any given month. Washout rates vary amoung services as well. From what I've read on Air Warriors & Baseops, it around 25-30 percent for Navy / Marine & AF flight school. Evil or 35 can give better figures on washout rates. I can tell you in the Army it's less than 10 percent; you have to have major issues to wash out. Yes, the training is demanding because it's just not about the flight training. You've got that with all the other military training (SERE, dunker, PT, inspections, additional duties, etc) to contend with.

If it's what you really want to do, then go for it. Don't worry about percentages or if you'll get forced into RPA stuff. I'd say the Guard / Reserve route is the best way to go if you want to fly without the additional BS. That is if you can get in good with a unit that needs pilots. A lot of that is done in house though. There are differences in benefits between Guard vs active if you go that route as well. Good luck.
 
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Yes, a PPL would help. You can get tidbits here, but you really need to talk with an Officer recruiter at each of the services. As long as your age is reasonable, I say go for it.

If interested you really want to talk to ALL potential branches, Reserves, National Guard too. Until you have an offer, there's no choice anyway. One branch may be interested, another not. That could even change over 6 months.

As posted above MOTIVATION and entrance testing are key elements.

As to fighting ISIS, I don't have an answer. I expect it to be a long, ongoing slog. For every 10 we send to the 72 virgins, 40 more step up.
 
One common theme in isis recruitment videos (aside from them torturing and murdering folks) is they always detail a U.S., Isarial, etc, air strike and the damage it caused, complete with locals pulling dead bodies of women and children out of the ruble.

I would imagine these videos spawn new recruits for isis, just like the videos of the World Trade Center caused folks in the U.S. to join the military.

Best bet, defend our country (which doesn't mean invade countries half a world away to defend stock tickers and special interests), stand up and exercise all your constitutional rights, join the boarder patrol, local EMS, local FD or a local militia, etc if you really want to serve your country.
 
Best way to defend America is to stop paying income tax. Income tax does not pay for the country/defense... Bonds do that. What income tax does is pays the interest on our debt to the Federal Reserve on outstanding currency. People don't discuss what QE did to grow the national debt and tax burden.

Now where the Fed comes into the deal is any T-Bill Treasury can't sell to anyone else, the Federal Reserve has to buy. In exchange, they have the exclusive franchise to create currency for the United States, and do so at their own discretion creating fiat currency which the founders prohibited. The best way to get back to a socio-economic model that the founders intended is to quit paying income tax and default on the debt to the federal reserve. In order to do this in a beneficial manner that grows the economy rather than collapses it, we need to build a replacement source of revenue to fund the T-Bills that the Fed no longer buys. This is possible by ending the stupidity and waste that holds our country back, and being cooperative and productive. We are a consumer society to the advantage of the markets, not our society, we need to get back to being productive and what the world needs most is food and water. Drought and famine compounded with cruel treatment is what created ISIS and is what creates all global conflict and has since the days of Joseph and Pharaoh.

Here's how you create a socio economic system that serves everyone and operates without creating 'losers' and 'outcasts' and sends groceries to areas of resource conflict rather than guns.

https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/urban-agriculture-and-energy--2#/
 
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You can always depend on the Internet to provide lots of people who will tell you why your goals are not worthwhile instead of telling you how to reach your goals. :rolleyes:
 
Palmpilot said:
You can always depend on the Internet to provide lots of people who will tell you why your goals are not worthwhile instead of telling you how to reach your goals. :rolleyes:
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:confused: He's been told, "Talk to a recruiter" nobody here can answer his question with any accuracy as it's a dynamic process depending on need. Getting into a plane now is difficult, getting a UAV slot not so much.
 
Henning said:
:confused: He's been told, "Talk to a recruiter" nobody here can answer his question with any accuracy as it's a dynamic process depending on need. Getting into a plane now is difficult, getting a UAV slot not so much.
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"Talk to a recruiter" :rofl:

Taking to a recruiter about signing up for the military will give you about as a unbiased and accurate opinion as talking to a used car dealer about a used car.
 
Its funny how the world works. So I work in a mall and theres a recruiting office across from us. I typically wave to most of the guys and over a month ago i briefly mentioned how I might would be interested in some method of serving. Well yesterday, while on break, three recruiters came up and said they heard I might be interested in a flying position. They gave me some great advice on how to get into not just an Army plane, but any sort of military plane and we'll be setting up a formal meeting sometime soon.
 
James331 said:
"Talk to a recruiter" :rofl:

Taking to a recruiter about signing up for the military will give you about as a unbiased and accurate opinion as talking to a used car dealer about a used car.
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Yet they are the only ones fulfilling the positions.:dunno: Until you talk to them, you don't know what the current choices and options are, same as walking on a carlot. Once you know the current options, then seeking advice on choosing between them makes more sense. Without the recruiter, and I would trust an ROTC/OCS officer campus recruiter to be more frank and honest than the neighborhood recruiter. I don't disagree that you do have to be cautious and even then, "needs of the service" takes over as soon as you sign and they may throw you into left field. That's happened to several friends that went in, ended up with completely different MOS than they signed up for. So yeah, don't believe the tooth fairy, but listen to what they have to say.
 
Sorry you think helicopters are not a decent route...sadly with current admissions and mission requirements its real hard to find a commissioning program to aviation other than the Army and that's to a WO program that currently is on hold...I work military affairs in a side job and this is current info from a week ago regional meeting with all branches last week. If your not Academy or ROTC or connected at a state level related to a State Aviation Officer for the NG its going to be hard...
 
Agree with Warlock. Things are tight right now and pickings are slim. I heard 2 months ago the USAR FW warrant program isn't taking any pilots right now. About 7-8 yrs ago they were hurting for pilots. They seem to have filled those slots.

If these recruiters are directing you towards the NG, then that's a possibility. It'll be outside their hands though. You have to go through the State board that you are looking at applying for. A lot of times they hire within but it is still possible to get a "street to seat" OCS slot.

If they're trying to sway you towards active, then getting FW is no guarantee. Since they changed their policy this year and are taking only students for FW from now on, there's generally a couple of C-12 slots per class. Stay high on the order of merit list and you've got a shot.

If these recruiters try and talk you into going enlisted and switching to commission later on, walk away. At any rate, it's a long process of tests and boards to do before you think about stepping foot in an aircraft. Get the ASVAB and SIFT done first if you're thinking about Army Aviation.
 
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Velocity173 said:
Agree with Warlock. Things are tight right now and pickings are slim. I heard 2 months ago the USAR FW warrant program isn't taking any pilots right now. About 7-8 yrs ago they were hurting for pilots. They seem to have filled those slots.

If these recruiters are directing you towards the NG, then that's a possibility. It'll be outside their hands though. You have to go through the State board that you are looking at applying for. A lot of times they hire within but it is still possible to get a "street to seat" OCS slot.

If they're trying to sway you towards active, then getting FW is no guarantee. Since they changed their policy this year and are taking only students for FW from now on, there's generally a couple of C-12 slots per class. Stay high on the order of merit list and you've got a shot.

If these recruiters try and talk you into going enlisted and switching to commission later on, walk away. At any rate, it's a long process of tests and boards to do before you think about stepping foot in an aircraft. Get the ASVAB and SIFT done first if you're thinking about Army Aviation.
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From our brief discussion, they did mention that the National Guard may be a better option but that I should still talk to them and that they would be willing to help/offer advice no matter what direction I chose to go in. I definitely would not want to go enlisted. If I went the Warrant Officer route, would I be guaranteed to be a warrant officer or would that entail going enlisted and then swapping to WA? They were saying that going the WA route would be the best, because I wouldn't have to compete as much to get a flight position. And in terms of the ASVAB, I got a 95 percentile when I was a Junior in high school so that shouldn't be too much of a problem. And I have never taken SIFT before.
 
rt4388 said:
From our brief discussion, they did mention that the National Guard may be a better option but that I should still talk to them and that they would be willing to help/offer advice no matter what direction I chose to go in. I definitely would not want to go enlisted. If I went the Warrant Officer route, would I be guaranteed to be a warrant officer or would that entail going enlisted and then swapping to WA? They were saying that going the WA route would be the best, because I wouldn't have to compete as much to get a flight position. And in terms of the ASVAB, I got a 95 percentile when I was a Junior in high school so that shouldn't be too much of a problem. And I have never taken SIFT before.
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If you're talking NG WOFT I would PM "armycopter" with that question. He's a Vermont NG pilot new to POA. I heard you had to go enlisted first for WOFT in NG but never seen any policy on that.

If you're looking at active, no, you most definitely do not have to go enlisted first. Like I said though, you'd be competing with the rest of your class for a C-12 slot in active Army. Then again, it's not like the C-12s are always first to go either. You could be 5th or 6th in your class and still have a shot at C-12s.

Not sure why you wouldn't want helos though. Outside of a fighter / bomber, it's the only thing I wanted to fly in the military. Flying race track patterns in an RC-12 or flying VIPs from A to B doesn't do it for me. Everyone has their preference I guess. The travel is good in FW and they get good flight time but for ultimate enjoyment, I like helos. Utility ones at that. :wink2:
 
Well the good thing about the UAV slot is you will still go through SUPT and be a rated pilot. So go for it, I talk to UPT students daily, some are engineers, some are history majors some are business majors. Really doesn't matter what your degree is. Cant help you on the wash out rate but I just talked with a guy who has lost 3 students in his class so far. Not sure what that equates to and currently in his class is a guy who flew for the airliners. He said initially he was better than everyone, then when they got into formation flying everybody sucked equally.

If you want it go for it don't listen to nay sayers. To many variables to say the least. Maybe one day Ill see you here in the simulators! Go for it, you wont regret it.
 
Ignore the "anti-recruiter" rhetoric; it's usually one-off experience, hear-say, or a bitter reject just venting. Also the drone nonsense; a rated military pilot is a pilot - you don't graduate UPT as a "drone pilot". And the loadout on those vehicles is limited, both in weight and kind. They have a place, but they aren't replacing manned aircraft as much as filling a previous void and/or augmenting manned platforms.

Follow through, if you care to, take all the stuff posted here as hearsay, and talk to guys already doing the job. Goid on ya. . .
 
rt4388 said:
Its funny how the world works. So I work in a mall and theres a recruiting office across from us. I typically wave to most of the guys and over a month ago i briefly mentioned how I might would be interested in some method of serving. Well yesterday, while on break, three recruiters came up and said they heard I might be interested in a flying position. They gave me some great advice on how to get into not just an Army plane, but any sort of military plane and we'll be setting up a formal meeting sometime soon.
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Have em put it in writing, and signed by however high up you can go that you will be flying planes. Bet they get real quiet.
 
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