Overkill

[FastEddieB]

Anecdote:

When selecting options on my Sky Arrow, I was coming from the certified Cirrus world.

I was going to opt for steam gauges, but the salesman said the Dynon was only "27".

I balked, saying that adding $27k to the base price of the Sky Arrow seemed silly.

He then clarified the Dynon was 27 hundred dollars, not thousand.

That was completely different! Adding electric attitude and heading indicators would have likely been at least that much, not to mention a VSI.

Anyway, amazing how much cheaper avionics are in the Light Sport/Experimentsl world. And, to date, I've had zero issues with my Dynon in 7 years and 400 hours.

 

[Jay Honeck]

Just an individual data point.

For all normal flying, I use the steam gauge airspeed and altimeter*. There is no doubt that I can interpret them more quickly and easily than the Dynon displays of the same information. The physical ball front and center is also easier to see/interpret than the faux ball on the Dynon**.

That's interesting, because it's backwards from my experience.

When we put the new panel in last February, I retained the old altimeter and airspeed indicator, right next to the EFIS. Everyone told me that my eyes would be continually drawn back to them, and that I would have to consciously train myself to ignore them.

Here's a pic of the old panel:

And one of the new panel, showing the steam gauges to the right of the EFIS:

Maybe I'm just too much of a computer geek, but from Day One I've never, ever felt the need to look at those round instruments. I even had to add a line to our checklist, reminding us to set the old altimeter, as we both kept forgetting that it was still there.

I am eternally amazed (and pleased) with the information our GRT Horizon HXr presents. It truly is a wonder of technology that makes flying even better.

 

[RalphInCA]

People buy new cars knowing they will lose 25% driving it off the curb. I almost put $10k into my Cherokee panel, but I decided that the plane didn't totally fit my mission. If I could have pictured myself in the plane for five years I would have done it. I considered it an investment in myself, not the plane.

Sometimes you spend money just because the expenditure will result in something that is cool.

And... Sometimes that's reason enough.

 

[docmirror]

I am leaning toward the value of the new glass instruments, and I'm a pretty old dog. My only caveat is the lack of redundancy. I don't know what attitude or gyroscopic instrument is retained in the Aspen or other glass cockpit. I've done a lot of partial panel stuff with the suction cup over the failed instrument, but what happens when the glass goes away? I'm sure VFR it's no problem, but in the soup? Yikes. Reliance on any one thing for too much is asking for trouble.

I've been in the electronics biz too long and know too much about fault tolerance and circuitry.

 

[Henning]

I am leaning toward the value of the new glass instruments, and I'm a pretty old dog. My only caveat is the lack of redundancy. I don't know what attitude or gyroscopic instrument is retained in the Aspen or other glass cockpit. I've done a lot of partial panel stuff with the suction cup over the failed instrument, but what happens when the glass goes away? I'm sure VFR it's no problem, but in the soup? Yikes. Reliance on any one thing for too much is asking for trouble.

I've been in the electronics biz too long and know too much about fault tolerance and circuitry.

Backup, either glass or round.

 

[Clark1961]

I am leaning toward the value of the new glass instruments, and I'm a pretty old dog. My only caveat is the lack of redundancy. I don't know what attitude or gyroscopic instrument is retained in the Aspen or other glass cockpit. I've done a lot of partial panel stuff with the suction cup over the failed instrument, but what happens when the glass goes away? I'm sure VFR it's no problem, but in the soup? Yikes. Reliance on any one thing for too much is asking for trouble.

I've been in the electronics biz too long and know too much about fault tolerance and circuitry.

For certified installations backup is either a hardware redundant complete (including AHRS) system with additional battery capacity or steam gauges. On the 'kota I've got the steam gauges since the autopilot needs the attitude reference anyway. The HI and VS gauges "went away" when the Aspen was installed, airspeed, altimeter, AI, and T&B remain so partial panel isn't too bad. Also bolted on a wet vacuum pump just to power the AI. With that said, the Aspen has been reliable (Ted's experience was much different since he let the smoke out of his).

A thread titled "Overkill" somehow seems appropriate when describing the 'kota's avionic & instrument setup...

 

[Marauder]

I am leaning toward the value of the new glass instruments, and I'm a pretty old dog. My only caveat is the lack of redundancy. I don't know what attitude or gyroscopic instrument is retained in the Aspen or other glass cockpit. I've done a lot of partial panel stuff with the suction cup over the failed instrument, but what happens when the glass goes away? I'm sure VFR it's no problem, but in the soup? Yikes. Reliance on any one thing for too much is asking for trouble.



I've been in the electronics biz too long and know too much about fault tolerance and circuitry.

With just the Aspen PFD, your mechanical AI, ASI and altimeter will remain but the VSI can be removed. With the Aspen MFD with the extended battery pack, your ASI and altimeter can be be removed and only the AI remains.

The Aspen 2000 (without extended battery) which I own has full redundancy for the PFD including AP control. You simply push the "reversion" button and all of the PFD data is ported to the MFD which then becomes the PFD.

 

[jesse]

With just the Aspen PFD, your mechanical AI, ASI and altimeter will remain but the VSI can be removed. With the Aspen MFD with the extended battery pack, your ASI and altimeter can be be removed and only the AI remains.

The Aspen 2000 (without extended battery) which I own has full redundancy for the PFD including AP control. You simply push the "reversion" button and all of the PFD data is ported to the MFD which then becomes the PFD.

Damn, I don't think I've seen so much stuff mounted that close together on a panel before. That had to be a major PITA.....

Your steam gauge AI is also missing a screw

 

[AdamZ]

If I had the panel space and electircal capacity I would drop a glass Dynon and an IFR GPS in the Flybaby without hesitation. I want to fly that thing IFR so bad but it'd be so expensive to make happen from its current state.

Anyone know if it'd be possible to get the faa to thumbs up an IFR install that was dependent on electricity without an alternator or generator? Using the new lithium battery options I bet I could figure out a way to run a Dynon for many hours. I would just get vectors everywhere and leave the nav radio off until it was time for the approach...hmm.....

I'm sure I could figure out how to have more electircal runtime than fuel endurance.

Big difference IMHO between something like an aspen and a Dynon cost wise. Your post leads to an interesting question. I wonder if there are any open cockpit IFR cert aircraft.

 

[Henning]

Big difference IMHO between something like an aspen and a Dynon cost wise. Your post leads to an interesting question. I wonder if there are any open cockpit IFR cert aircraft.

I saw a Stearman with a hood for the aft cockpit equipped as an instrument trainer in a museum once....

 

[ElPaso Pilot]

...Using the new lithium battery options I bet I could figure out a way to run a Dynon for many hours...

I hear Boeing has a Japanese vendor who might be able to sell you some high capacity lithium batteries from old stock at a considerable discount.

 

[John221us]

It's not an investment in the plane because it's not an investment at all. It's a toy. And that is ok. Just call it what it is.

My point was that I would be putting it in so that I could train using more modern instruments with no expectation of recouping it when I sell the plane. People invest in themselves all the time and it is usually one of the best investments one can make.

 

[Clark1961]

Big difference IMHO between something like an aspen and a Dynon cost wise. Your post leads to an interesting question. I wonder if there are any open cockpit IFR cert aircraft.

Yup, WACO does it...hangar neighbor had one...

 

[James331]

A Aspen PFD.......with a Garmin 250XL.