Half Fast
Touchdown! Greaser!
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He’s a bass?
Next chapter in my flying journey - Conquest 441
- Thread starter James_Dean
- Start date
He’s a bass?
MauleSkinner
Touchdown! Greaser!
Of all the fishes in the sea, I’d rather be a bass.
I’d crawl up on my hands and knees, and slide down on my…
Whattaya want, poetry or prose?
James_Dean
Pattern Altitude
I will use the plane for business trips, but only within the confines of the NBAA exemption. I have also decided that I will not transport any of our team members without a second pilot on board. If our executive team were to travel like that it will be in the back with two pros upfront. We do that on occasion and have access to a CJ3, Bravo, and an Excel.
The Conquest has two primary purposes. Flying carpet for my family, and minimizing my time driving to commercial airports and time spent in the Delta clubs while waiting for the next flight.
@James_Dean how are Cessna parts inventory for the Conquest series? With your previous experience in the model 400's, are parts still available? (Door seal, freon A/C, flow-pack, etc. etc.)
flyingcheesehead
Taxi to Parking
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Yeah, what's being described sounds like a 91 ownership group to start, expanding into 135... It can be done, but it is not trivial.
That must be... Interesting.
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The biggest hurdle would be @James_Dean and his utilization. I don’t know how much he flew the 425 he had, but his old posts about 310 ownership and airline legs avoided make me think he’ll be flying the 441 enough that the hangar will seem superfluous.
James_Dean
Pattern Altitude
During my research I talked to several shops and several owners. There are some issues, but generally support has been available. Engines are well supported. I picked the plane I did because several of the big ticket items have recently addressed. ACM was overhauled in 2023, many of the big phase inspections are many years out. I'll have a huge MX year in 4 -5 years that will probably include engine overhauls and some of the more invasive inspections will be due. One issue I will have is that both third stage turbine wheels will be cycled out about the same time as the overhauls will be due. No issues with availability, but $$$.
James_Dean
Pattern Altitude
My goal is 100 - 150 hours/year. I have fantastic support from our local FBO for pilot and charter service, but the 441 will be strictly Part 91, and the rules will be followed. I won't have anything to do with 134.5 operations. I put about 800 hours on the 425 in 6.5 years of ownership.
Doc Holliday
En-Route
The best advice I can give on overhauls is start about a year out getting parts together (coordinating with the OH facility). The biggest issues we have dealt with on Honeywell is parts sourcing.
Ted
Twin Engine Ted
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Agreed, Honeywell is slow on these things. Long lead times.
And, interview shops. The shop I used was great and I'd recommend to anyone. There were other shops that I would not recommend.
James_Dean
Pattern Altitude
S & S Aviation Co. - Maintenance
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schmookeeg
Final Approach
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I have twice been on the road leaving the airport and he hooked his plane hard right overhead at like 50' (road is a few thousand feet from the runway) and I've pulled over to see if his RHE packed up -- no, he was just departing like a doos.
He once met me at the keycard gate and requested $5 entry with this giant dad-joke smile. Total rofflecopters moment.
I rolled the window up and stared at him like he had three heads.Otherwise I don't see him all that much.
flyingcheesehead
Taxi to Parking
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You know, for every time I hear someone talking about how an ATP flew their personal plane into a situation they couldn't handle and got themselves killed, and that scares people...I have twice been on the road leaving the airport and he hooked his plane hard right overhead at like 50' (road is a few thousand feet from the runway) and I've pulled over to see if his RHE packed up -- no, he was just departing like a doos.
He once met me at the keycard gate and requested $5 entry with this giant dad-joke smile. Total rofflecopters moment.
Otherwise I don't see him all that much.
You could always counter with "Yeah, but Jerry Wagner is still alive!"
I guess there's hope for all of us.
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A sufficiently broken clock can be right more than twice a day?
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hindsight2020
Final Approach
yeah I've never understood the draw to whip around dump trucks and wagons like it's an acro bird. Just get a small fun acro bird.
I dealt with that dynamic all the time in the buff. The USAF has tried on several occassions to redress the concentration of entire communities with people who didn't get what they wanted, with little success imo, for reasons that go beyond this thread. Bringing up RAIDR21 in that vein may still be fighting words for some people, but those of us who know, know. Following Bud Holland's spectre.
A guy who can float the opex of a 421 could probably afford some cheapy acro one holer as a side dish and get that thrill done much safer and frankly a whole lot more fun.
I dealt with that dynamic all the time in the buff. The USAF has tried on several occassions to redress the concentration of entire communities with people who didn't get what they wanted, with little success imo, for reasons that go beyond this thread. Bringing up RAIDR21 in that vein may still be fighting words for some people, but those of us who know, know. Following Bud Holland's spectre.
A guy who can float the opex of a 421 could probably afford some cheapy acro one holer as a side dish and get that thrill done much safer and frankly a whole lot more fun.
N3318Q
Filing Flight Plan
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- Jerry "Air Wagner" on YouTube
None of this from "schmookeeg" is accurate except for his earlier post calling me a "clown", I did not comment on the original post as I have no experience in a Kerosene Burner Cessna and don't wanna " Make stuff up" like others....I have twice been on the road leaving the airport and he hooked his plane hard right overhead at like 50' (road is a few thousand feet from the runway) and I've pulled over to see if his RHE packed up -- no, he was just departing like a doos.
He once met me at the keycard gate and requested $5 entry with this giant dad-joke smile. Total rofflecopters moment.
Otherwise I don't see him all that much
Jerry, are you stating it’s inaccurate that someone outside an airplane has seen that plane flying in a manner that has caused them to wonder whether an engine failure has occurred or not?
Were you with the person at that time?
N3318Q
Filing Flight Plan
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the "inaccuracy" is the post , my Wingspan is 42 feet so not a turn at 50 feet AGL and this is a towered airport, I have no idea what the $5 reference is about, never met this person at a keycard gate. However the "clown" reference could be somewhat accurate
N3318Q
Filing Flight Plan
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Nice math calculation Mikey BUT a 90 degree turn at 20 feet above the ground means no lift, not quite what you want in a 7500 lb aircraft not to mention the power lines on Doolittle drive and the towers from the old Bay Approach building
James_Dean
Pattern Altitude
Seal let go on MLG actuator. $5AMUs later the new one is on and I'll have a spare after an OH. Isn't airplane ownership fun?
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I sometimes debate the value of a prebuy given how these airplanes always manage to sneak something by the inspector so they can still give us a little bite on the buttocks as soon as they get to their new homes. (Not blaming inspectors or anything else. Airplanes are just mean-spirited about getting new owners.)
Did that puddle happen sitting in the hangar or at a time when it could cause you other heartache?
Did that puddle happen sitting in the hangar or at a time when it could cause you other heartache?
James_Dean
Pattern Altitude
Found in my hangar six days after last flight and four days after I had last been in the hangar. No way it would've been found on the prebuy and just one of those things that happens. We're just guessing, but the it has been some time since the plane was cold soaked at altitude and on the ground.
Half Fast
Touchdown! Greaser!
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Maybe it’s just marking its territory.....
Ted
Twin Engine Ted
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That will do it. As it's gotten colder, my bus has developed more air leaks. Happens every winter. It seemed that my landing gear seals also tended to go out around this time of year.
James_Dean
Pattern Altitude
Coming up on two months, and have had a few more issues to address. Landed a few weeks ago to find this -
Lots of looking and test runs to finally find that the oil cooler had developed a pinhole leak. It wouldn't leak on the ground, but only when airborne. No abnormal indications from the cockpit and oil was still above the add line on the dipstick, but could've been much worse. A few AMU's later now have a new oil cooler and another spare on the shelf.
I expected a sorting out period, but didn't anticipate two AOG situations this yearly. However, I continue to be impressed with the performance and capability of this airframe. Pushing a lot of fuel to do this, but eventually worked up to 289 ktas at 12k coming home yesterday on a short hop. Only took 660 lbs/hr to get there....
Lots of looking and test runs to finally find that the oil cooler had developed a pinhole leak. It wouldn't leak on the ground, but only when airborne. No abnormal indications from the cockpit and oil was still above the add line on the dipstick, but could've been much worse. A few AMU's later now have a new oil cooler and another spare on the shelf.
I expected a sorting out period, but didn't anticipate two AOG situations this yearly. However, I continue to be impressed with the performance and capability of this airframe. Pushing a lot of fuel to do this, but eventually worked up to 289 ktas at 12k coming home yesterday on a short hop. Only took 660 lbs/hr to get there....
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schmookeeg
Final Approach
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Hi neighbor. Sorry it wasn't memorable for you like it was for me. The distaste lingers.
We have similar wingspans (oddly, actually, your plane is a lot larger than mine) -- so it would be 21 feet per side if we're doing maths, which I can't figure out the relevance of -- I agree determining AGL from the road would be imperfect. Would 100 AGL make it any better? I dunno wtf you were doing that day. I assumed a motor packed it in and I pulled over on Dolittle Rd to observe. Instead it was just a "shanked it" low hotdog departure I guess. At least you saved my fellow Alameda residents a noise complaint.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
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Any recent updates, James? I've got a contract on a 441 out of Houston and looking forward to joining the 441 club.
James_Dean
Pattern Altitude
The plane and I are starting to become more comfortable together and flows and habits are becoming ingrained. I continue to be impressed by the performance it has and what it can do. It really is in a different class than the 425 that I had last. I'm still working through the new RVSM authorization and so haven't explored that part of the envelope yet, but am looking forward to the efficiency it will bring on longer trips. In the mid teens it will true at 300kts on 85gph and at FL280 I'm seeing 305 - 310kts on 65gph. The approach and landing phase are very different from the 425 due to the differences between the TPE-331's and the PT-6s and the different style flaps. When you pull the power back on the 425 and the blades go flat you have two giant speed brakes. The fixed shaft garrets are still driving the props and offer very little deceleration. The split flaps on the 425 are lots of drag and the fowlers on the 441 not so much. I could come screaming down final in the 425 and not worry about landing distance. Speed control on the 441 is much more like the jets. Come in 15 knots fast and you're going to float forever. I'm still getting used to 90kts over the fence for landing. With 475 gallons of fuel and a 4000 lb useful it isn't hard to imagine that it is two rather different performance profiles fat vs. skinny. If its just me and half fuel you could do 3000fpm through the low teens if you want to with a steep deck angle. Full up I'm seeing 1900 - 2000 fpm through the low teens and still 1000fpm above FL250. Full fuel and 800 lbs in the cabin I think max range is >2000nm with RVSM.
Two significant MX items as outlined above. They were addressed fairly quickly and parts weren't an issue. I've got a few mx items to work through, but nothing significant. We're going to get it on the pressurization cart in the next few weeks and chase down some minor leaks, and I've got an O2 leak somewhere that is probably going to have to wait until the next 2,3,D to find when we pull out the interior.
My only complaint is noise up front. Pax seem to have it better and mine aren't wearing headsets, but in my seat I'm seeing 85 - 90db depending upon altitude. The 2000 rpm prop drone gets annoying. I want to fly in one with the MT props for a comparison sometime. The ACM works really well for heat and AC, however the vent between the front seats dumps too much heat up front and not enough in the back. I ended up 3d printing a duct to cover it in flight to blow air into the rear cabin which worked like a charm. Without it it seems like there is a 20 degree difference between cockpit and cabin. SWMBO was adding layers and I was sweating. This is also my first plane with a digital autopilot which I've found to be a nice workload reduction.
/inhales deeply/
I paid cash for the plane and own my hangar. So far, all in including insurance, PPI, legal to set up the ownership entities, leases and filings, supplies, instructors, Iowa use tax, fuel, maintenance, databases, etc I've spent $63,214 in five months and about 55 hours of flight time. Excluding one time set up costs including the legal, PPI, use tax, and insurance it has been $31,048. The MLG and oil cooler issues ended up being about $6k total.
This flight to vegas has been a highlight so far.
Great update. Thanks. Mind sharing the 3d printer file for the duct? I can see that becoming an issue as well. Great pic of Vegas. I made that flight one time in my SR22. Was a blast and can't wait to fly it again!
So running about $500/hr OPEX then
So running about $500/hr OPEX then
James_Dean
Pattern Altitude
Coming up on 120 hours so far after about 7 months in service and getting the gremlins worked out. All in the opex is closer to $700/hr with current fuel costs and ongoing MX. I've been expanding the envelope and a recent flight home required going to FL350 for the first time to top weather. Just under 400 lbs/hr to run 295ktas is pretty sporty for a plane with that cabin, and after a 3.5 hour flight and landed with over 1500 lbs in the tanks. Ridiculous capability, but I wish FL350 didn't come with a 11.5k cabin.
I asked the controller to climb from FL330 to FL350 and he asked if I could do better than 500fpm for traffic. Heck yes we can!
I asked the controller to climb from FL330 to FL350 and he asked if I could do better than 500fpm for traffic. Heck yes we can!
Attachments
Abram
Pre-takeoff checklist
That is a beautiful airplane! There is nothing better than really getting to know you airplane and it looks like you are having a blast. I am curious; have you been able to fit the family in it and how do they like it?
Abram Finkelstein,
N685AS
Abram Finkelstein,
N685AS
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I don’t like to brag, but I was able to maintain a 9,830 cabin today. At 10,000 MSL. Until they gave me a new altimeter setting.
How much is the psi to do 11.5 at FL350? I don’t have a high altitude endorsement so I haven’t committed that formula to memory. Your numbers are pretty impressive in my book.
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James_Dean
Pattern Altitude
I'm still working on finding any leaks, but 6.1psi at FL350.