Mooney gone?

Discussion in 'Flight Following' started by steingar, Nov 12, 2019.

  1. steingar

    steingar Taxi to Parking

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    According to the local paper, Mooney has closed it's doors and furloughed it's workforce. Could this be it for the storied manufacturer?
     
  2. ktup-flyer

    ktup-flyer En-Route

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  3. Velocity173

    Velocity173 Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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  4. FormerHangie

    FormerHangie En-Route

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    Last edited: Nov 12, 2019
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  5. AggieMike88

    AggieMike88 Touchdown! Greaser!

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    The original "I don't know it all" of aviation.
    Ah Soooo.... like the food, even after you consume all the Chinese money, you’re still hungry for more?
     
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  6. Velocity173

    Velocity173 Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    Top story on my Yahoo page. I did used to be a regular viewer but that’s beside the point.
     
  7. NordicDave

    NordicDave Cleared for Takeoff

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  8. Volzalum

    Volzalum Pre-Flight

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    It was originally posted as a week long furlough while "others" were on site. Supposedly there are two potential buyers (of the company) on site this week seeing the overall capabilities (not just the two planes).
     
  9. Shuswap BC

    Shuswap BC Pre-takeoff checklist

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    They were still taking orders last month, so cannot see them shutting down.
     
  10. AGLyme

    AGLyme Pre-takeoff checklist

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    it could be a seasonal or demand-blip thing... happens in manufacturing all the time.
     
  11. jimhorner

    jimhorner Line Up and Wait

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  12. wheaties

    wheaties Pre-Flight

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    I still remember that AVWeb article that said, "Cool plane but no parachute?" Sad to see them go. Hopefully someone picks up the parts replacement cause there's just too many of them still flying about.
     
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  13. murphey

    murphey Final Approach PoA Supporter

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  14. hindsight2020

    hindsight2020 En-Route

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    *hurries to the space of moonies with a popcorn bag to see what kind of show they're putting over there*
     
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  15. denverpilot

    denverpilot Tied Down

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    Someone posted elsewhere they only sold 4 aircraft this quarter. Cirrus sold 120.
     
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  16. Croomrider

    Croomrider Pre-takeoff checklist

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    The market has spoken!
     
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  17. GRG55

    GRG55 Final Approach

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    I think 14 sold in FY 2018, only 7 in each of the previous two years.
    The very definition of a cottage industry.

    But then, how many times has Mooney been through this?
     
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  18. NordicDave

    NordicDave Cleared for Takeoff

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    Cramped, hard to work on, expensive; but fast plane.

    Hard to compete with a Cirrus for about the same price.
     
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  19. DaleB

    DaleB En-Route

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    Didn’t Mooney get bought by a Chinese company a few years back? Those guys aren’t stupid... I have to wonder what it was that they wanted that was worth what they paid.
     
  20. Pascal Forget

    Pascal Forget Pre-takeoff checklist

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    I'm very sad to see Mooney go. Hopefully someone picks up the type certificate and keeps manufacturing parts for the existing fleet.
     
  21. GRG55

    GRG55 Final Approach

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    Really? My line of work is in the hydrocarbon energy sector, and I've seen more utterly uneconomic, stupid deals done by the Chinese in the past decade+ than even the Japanese did buying golf courses and Rockefeller Center back in their heyday in the late 1980s.
     
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  22. MountainDude

    MountainDude Pre-takeoff checklist

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    This is a predictable outcome, IMO. Not having a parachute is the key issue.
     
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  23. Shuswap BC

    Shuswap BC Pre-takeoff checklist

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    The article said they kept on 90 employees.
    So it hasn't shut the doors.
     
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  24. IK04

    IK04 Pattern Altitude

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    They built four airplanes in the last reporting period. Textron/Beechcraft sold nine(?) single engine airplanes in the same period, but they have their other business groups (jets!)to keep them alive.
     
  25. pigpenracing

    pigpenracing Pattern Altitude

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    I have always thought Mooney is the ugliest airplane ever produced! Glad I don't have to see anymore new ones :D
     
  26. DaleB

    DaleB En-Route

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    Yeah... I suppose you’re right. In general they’re not stupid, but in general neither are Americans. We sure do have standout exceptions, though... and I’m sure they do, too.
     
  27. jordane93

    jordane93 Final Approach

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    Not surprising. Cirrus is pretty much the only relevant manufacturer making single engine pistons.
     
  28. GRG55

    GRG55 Final Approach

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    Not the only "relevant" manufacturer.
    Cessna and Piper pretty well have the important training market sewn up. And that's seems to be doing quite well these days.
     
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  29. pigpenracing

    pigpenracing Pattern Altitude

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    If I could afford a new plane it would be a Maule, Cessna or Beechcraft. I wouldn't even think about a Cirrus...
    Different strokes for different folks I guess. I usually laugh at the people that think they are high class when they roll up in a Cirrus. LOL!
     
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  30. Shuswap BC

    Shuswap BC Pre-takeoff checklist

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    I don't have anything against Cirrus, or any other brand of new plane. But when it came time to order my first "new" plane ever, despite the incredibly long wait time to get it, I went with Cessna aka Textron.
     
  31. skier

    skier Line Up and Wait

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    How many times has Mooney closed and then reopened? 4 or 5 over their history?
     
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  32. Caramon13

    Caramon13 Pattern Altitude

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    Exactly, this may be no different.
     
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  33. SixPapaCharlie

    SixPapaCharlie May the force be with you

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    How is this possible? They sold 7 planes last year.
    The upcoming recession will have no love for GA

    Also, If they put a BRS on that plane, they might have stood a chance.
    That's a lot of money to spend for a 2nd door.
     
  34. Mtns2Skies

    Mtns2Skies Super Moderator Management Council Member PoA Supporter

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    What'd you get??? 206?
     
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  35. JOhnH

    JOhnH Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    What upcoming recession? Who told you that?
     
  36. JOhnH

    JOhnH Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    What did you buy?
     
  37. MBDiagMan

    MBDiagMan En-Route

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    I was at a Mooney event a little over a year ago where the Manufacturing/Engineering VP spoke. He told us that the new owners had poured several million into serious refurbishment of their buildings and infrastructure. I was amazed that they would pour in that much money while sales were at the single digit units per year level. If someone could figure a way to make a new Mooney competitive in the market, the fire sale value of the company could be a bargain, but many have tried.

    As an aircraft the Mooney is not often understood in the market place. In the used, sub six figure market, speed and fuel efficiency are worthy of consideration, but does someone well heeled enough to lay out almost a million for a four place single engine plane really concerned about fuel economy?

    In my price range, with my list of likes and dislikes, I love having a Mooney, but if I were ready to lay out cash for a new plane neither a Cirrus or Mooney would be on the list. For a used plane however, my wife nor myself are overweight so we fit in a Mooney just fine. I appreciate the pushrod control handling precision, the steel safety cage and the solid feel and ruggedness. Since I didn’t listen to all the assessments of a Mooney voiced by those who had never flown one, I got into one and have never looked back. Wonderful aircraft!

    All that said, if past history is any indication, someone will bale out Mooney in one way or another and maybe they will have a run and sell a DOZEN planes next year.
     
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  38. GRG55

    GRG55 Final Approach

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    Mooney sold 14 airplanes last year (2018), seven Acclaims plus seven Ovations. It sold 7 airplanes total in each of 2016 and 2017.

    Like so many other piston airplane manufacturers, including Cirrus, over the decade+ since the financial crisis Mooney never recovered the sales volume it enjoyed prior (65 airplanes in 2008, a total of 61 airplanes in the ten years from 2009 to 2018, inclusive). GA is moving upscale to become a market of limited volume luxury products - even the lowly 182 is now an overweight, dolled up version of what it used to be. That's where the money for new airplanes is, apparently. ;)

    The "romance" of aviation strikes again. The GA industry has to be one of the most efficient destroyers of capital ever invented. The number of "successful" companies such as Cirrus are overwhelmed by the failures. And even in the case of Cirrus I am highly doubtful it has ever generated an acceptable ROCE - the Chinese tend to treat their cost of capital as zero.
     
    Last edited: Nov 13, 2019
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  39. 455 Bravo Uniform

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    The quarterly revenue vs labor expense doesn’t even work out on a cocktail napkin, let alone adding in raw material costs and facilities expenses (taxes, utilities, maintenance). Debt service? It’s got to be financially backed passion that keeps Mooney alive, not math.
     
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  40. AA5Bman

    AA5Bman Pre-takeoff checklist

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    I’m curious what you would buy. Mooney and Cirrus seem to occupy the same “go-fast” niche.