Looking for someone to draw up a Field Approval + 337 for a B&C backup alternator

Discussion in 'Avionics and Upgrades' started by peter-h, Nov 10, 2017.

  1. peter-h

    peter-h Line Up and Wait

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    I have a European based N-reg aircraft and a field approval is the only way to do this. B&C have a few STCs but nothing applicable. Well, the content of an STC can be used to support a field approval, if not the STC (number) itself.

    I started a guy in the USA on this a couple of years ago but he got busy and never finished. He did some wiring diagram(s) and I paid him up to date for his time.

    There is a time slot in Jan+Feb 2018 when the aircraft will be in a heated hangar (for a TKS installation) and it would be the ideal time to do it. I don't think it is more than a day or two's work for someone who knows the process, followed by a meeting with his FSDO. You start with the B&C IM. The engine has a spare vac pump drive (currently blanked off) which is perfect for the alternator.

    I have asked loads of people and nobody has time, which is why I am posting here :)
     
  2. bradg33

    bradg33 Cleared for Takeoff

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    Good luck. In my experience, very few shops have any interest in the paperwork exercise involved in a field approval. On top of that, many FAA inspectors just don't want to do them anymore so they make the process harder than it should be. I recently obtained a field approval for a Garmin G5 and I ended up doing the paperwork and interactions with the FAA myself.
     
  3. takair

    takair Filing Flight Plan

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    Seems like the hard part would be the “field” approval part. In theory, the FSDO inspector may want to physically look at it. I’ve done numerous field approvals, but always within proximity to my region. Do you have an IA who will be signing off on the installation itself? Where is the aircraft physically located?
     
  4. peter-h

    peter-h Line Up and Wait

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    Yes; you need an IA to certify the finished installation for compliance with the 337. The paperwork then gets mailed to Oklahoma.

    The B&C installation is a very simple thing. They provide the wiring diagram. The voltage regulator is set to 27.5V so that if the main system (set to 28.0V) fails, as soon as the bus drops to 27.5V the backup comes online.

    This isn't a job for a company - most don't want to touch this.

    The other route is a DER 8110 but from here it is very expensive.
     
  5. Checkout_my_Six

    Checkout_my_Six Final Approach

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    An IA's privileges are local....you will need to find one in your area.
     
  6. Let'sgoflying!

    Let'sgoflying! Touchdown! Greaser!

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    Didnt we used to be able to make one from an existing 337? Seemed like the fsdo greatly preferred that, as it largely took the monkey off their back if something was already shown to work. We would make up the 337, and it would be largely identical to an existing one -- present both; done.
     
  7. Stewartb

    Stewartb En-Route

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    You can do the field approval paperwork before doing the work or buying the parts. Once the FA is approved you can do the work on your schedule. No more need for the FAA. I have a field approval for an installation that I've never gotten around to. If I choose to add the equipment, I can. If not, the paperwork will follow the airplane in case the next owner wants to do the mod.
     
  8. peter-h

    peter-h Line Up and Wait

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    I have an IA - that's no problem. I need one every year anyway to sign off the Annual inspection.

    My plan is indeed to do the FA before buying the parts. Can't really do it after the installation ;)

    It's a very good point about using another similar or identical FA. One can obtain the CD from the FAA for some small sum. I just need to find an aircraft which has one of these, but B&C are extremely hard to communicate with (you have to send an email several times to get any kind of reply) and they specifically don't want to get involved in assisting with approvals (they had some problems in the past with this so they don't do it). Maybe someone here has done it? This system is quite old (perhaps 20-30 years) so there must be many installed. The engine is an IO540-C4.
     
  9. Stewartb

    Stewartb En-Route

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    B&C tech support on the telephone has always been excellent. Try calling them.

    Whether an old FA is acceptable data to your current inspector is hard to know. The FA process has changed. The install itself is usually not as big a deal as the submitting mechanic's knowing how to write it up.
     
  10. Checkout_my_Six

    Checkout_my_Six Final Approach

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    btw.....I have an approved B&C installed on my aircraft. PM me if you'd like a copy of my 337.
     
  11. PaulMillner

    PaulMillner Pre-takeoff checklist

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    I’m in the same boat for my Cardinal... maybe we should collaborate. What type aircraft?

    Paul
     
  12. peter-h

    peter-h Line Up and Wait

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    I have sent you two guys a PM... or at least what I think is a PM :) It seems to be called a "conversation".

    The person who made a start on this previously produced a wiring diagram and a skeletal 337.

    I don't think there is anything unusual in the 337. The wiring is straight out of the B&C instructions and the 337 has just the standard sections.
     
  13. Checkout_my_Six

    Checkout_my_Six Final Approach

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    here is what's on block #8 for the B&C installed in my Bonanza.
    B&C 337 example.jpg
     
  14. PaulMillner

    PaulMillner Pre-takeoff checklist

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    Thanks... what is ant weight?

    Never mind... figured out it’s a typo for “and.”

    Paul
     
  15. Tom-D

    Tom-D Taxi to Parking

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    Your STC is good on a N numbered A/C, have your IA install and sign block 7 and 8 and send the 337 to OKC.

    that is all that needs to be done.
     
  16. Tom-D

    Tom-D Taxi to Parking

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    Big question ?

    does the B&C STC application list include your aircraft?
    If Not ask the NY FSDO for a deviation to the STC that comes closest to your aircraft.

    This is simply done on a 337, in block 8.
    your cover letter will ask for a deviation to STC # xxxxxxx to apply to A/C make model serial number

    block 8 will say :
    Installed B&C STC #xxxx on this aircraft IAW STC instructions.
     
  17. JAWS

    JAWS Line Up and Wait

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    Try reading B&C's own literature.
    http://www.bandc.aero/standbyaltern...erpa32cherokeesixlanceandsaratogastc-pma.aspx

    Specifically, the section titled "Aircraft Not Covered By STC".
     
  18. Tom-D

    Tom-D Taxi to Parking

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  19. peter-h

    peter-h Line Up and Wait

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    Yes; I am aware of that section of their website, and that is what one uses to get started on the FA.

    None of their STCs apply to my aircraft. I was not aware there was a process whereby one could ask an FSDO for a STC variation. Some years ago I met a pilot on here who was an FSDO inspector (now retired) and he helped me get a FA for a Sandel SN3500 EHSI. That was a real gold plated job, involving an ACO also for the AFMS. That FA referenced a Sandel STC for a Cessna 421C but referenced its content, not the STC by number.

    The NY FSDO is not functioning for this type of work and has not been for many years. When I was doing the Sandel STC they told me an EHSI is "EFIS" and cannot be done as a FA and needs an STC!

    I am not looking for a freebie. I would pay $1000 for the whole job.
     
    Last edited: Nov 12, 2017
  20. PaulMillner

    PaulMillner Pre-takeoff checklist

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    Hi Tom,
    I see you eventually read the first line of Peter's original post, where he explains that the STC does NOT apply to his aircraft. That's an interesting concept on deviation request in Block 8... I'll try that with our FSDO and see if they've ever heard of it.
    JAWS helpfully refers to the "Aircraft Not Covered By STC" section. Unfortunately, the Installation Instructions link is broken... I've asked B&C to fix that...

    Paul, seeking to do the same
     
  21. Tom-D

    Tom-D Taxi to Parking

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    Remember, you can ask for a deviation to a STC, it is done as a field approval, they do not have to give it to you.

    AC 43-120 shows how to do that .
     
  22. Tom-D

    Tom-D Taxi to Parking

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    The NY FSDO is notably the most messed up FSDO we must deal with.
     
  23. Tom-D

    Tom-D Taxi to Parking

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    I made the offer once.
     
  24. Checkout_my_Six

    Checkout_my_Six Final Approach

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    well....there's your sign. :D
     
  25. peter-h

    peter-h Line Up and Wait

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    Perhaps I should start a new thread entitled "$1000 to anyone who can process a field approval for a backup alternator" :)
     
  26. JAWS

    JAWS Line Up and Wait

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    Let the negotiations begin! Opening bid of $1000!