landing tips? please

[einepilotin]

Hello, i'm confused with different landings, i have got different instructions from different instructors. Just would like to make sure how people do it. I read those theory with books and materials to find the answers but i couldn't.. so i'm posting here!

1. soft field landing
-when do you power idle? some instructor told me don't power idle and some told me do it before touch down.
- do you slow down and lose altitude earlier than normal landing?


2. short field landing
- do you assume there is any obstacle in front of the threshold or not?
one instructor told me imagine 50' obstacle in front of threshold and the other said no obstacle.

thanks a lot in advance,, i asked my instructors (i have more than 1) and those parts above are the parts i got different instructions. I gotta pass the checkride so i'm trying to get an answer of how ppl generally do it thanks

 

[jordane93]

Take a look at the Airplane Flying Handbook. It's an FAA publication and it breaks down the different types of landings.

 

[AggieMike88]

+1 on using the AFM. Lots of awesome information there

https://www.faa.gov/regulations_pol...e_handbook/media/airplane_flying_handbook.pdf

 

[einepilotin]

thanks, actually i got that book and i read it already, just would like know how you people actually do it and how you make differently from normal landing?

 

[retpd2001]

Good advice above, and I would say if they are not doing it (or trying to), or teaching it by the book, you are being led astray.

 

[cweinacker]

...here is where most instructors fail!!! I have 3000 hours in ultra-light..and that's how to fly/land. For now, forget about landing..learn how to fly...50 hours... during 50 hours, you should accomp 50 landings...when you can stop the plane in 500 feet...your getting close to short field...but not today...it comes with time...learn to fly first!!...in landing...with power back...hold the plane off (1foot) the runway...until it falls...throttle up and do it again...about 5 million times...then you'll catch on!!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[einepilotin]

...here is where most instructors fail!!! I have 3000 hours in ultra-light..and that's how to fly/land. For now, forget about landing..learn how to fly...50 hours... during 50 hours, you should accomp 50 landings...when you can stop the plane in 500 feet...your getting close to short field...but not today...it comes with time...learn to fly first!!...in landing...with power back...hold the plane off (1foot) the runway...until it falls...throttle up and do it again...about 5 million times...then you'll catch on!!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I'm sure the experience will teach me more and more but i have to pass the stage check and get the license before i do 5 million times of t/d and l/d.

 

[Skates97]

Hello, i'm confused with different landings, i have got different instructions from different instructors. Just would like to make sure how people do it. I read those theory with books and materials to find the answers but i couldn't.. so i'm posting here!

1. soft field landing
-when do you power idle? some instructor told me don't power idle and some told me do it before touch down.
- do you slow down and lose altitude earlier than normal landing?


2. short field landing
- do you assume there is any obstacle in front of the threshold or not?
one instructor told me imagine 50' obstacle in front of threshold and the other said no obstacle.

thanks a lot in advance,, i asked my instructors (i have more than 1) and those parts above are the parts i got different instructions. I gotta pass the checkride so i'm trying to get an answer of how ppl generally do it thanks

Soft Field = set it down as gently as possible. Whether that means you carry a little power and "fly it on" or if you cut power and flare it out just above the runway. You will figure out what works best for both you and whatever type of plane you are flying.

Short Field = Pick your landing point and plant it there. Get a copy of the ACS Airman Certification Standards and become familiar with the requirements. (You should also make notes in it as the oral portion of the check-ride is open book). Take a look at page 35-36. There is no mention of a 50' obstacle, only that you understand obstacles on approach and landing paths, and that you consider the wind conditions, landing surface and obstructions to select a suitable touchdown point.

The most important thing to remember is if you don't like your approach, go around. If you are floating in ground effect and are going to miss your selected touch down point by more than 200', go around. If you end up going around 2-3 times to make sure you nail that short field landing that's fine.

 

[FlySince9]

You know, its kind of funny how everything requires a set of rules or How to's... Here's one to crack your cocoa-nut... How do you do a short, soft-field landing? Oh the Horror! Think about it. Shouldn't all landings be as short and soft as possible? I've never been sure what the difference was. This thing about "I have a 5000' runway, why not use it" is ridiculous and sloppy IMHO. A stable, full flap, approach at 5 kts below best glide speed will more times than not result in a soft, short landing...the stall warning should be at least chirping when the wheels touch. Remember, its easier (and safer) to bleed excessive speed while still airborne (nose high) than to try to stop with brakes once on the ground. Let the examiner call it either one, because they will virtually look the same. The significant differences are after touchdown. For the short field, get the nose wheel down, the flaps up (gets the weight on the wheels) and the brakes on, quickly... the soft field, keep the nose wheel off as long as possible (yoke against your chest) and be light on the brakes, maybe no brakes at all....just let it run out of energy on its own...

 

[luvflyin]

Both instructors are probably giving you good stuff. Evaluate the different ways and see what the results are. You may use one way at field A someday and the other way at field B. As far as the checkride goes you should talk to the instructors about it. They both should know what to expect from the local examiners. You're likely to find out it ain't no thang as far as the checkride goes.

 

[luvflyin]

You know, its kind of funny how everything requires a set of rules or How to's... Here's one to crack your cocoa-nut... How do you do a short, soft-field landing? Oh the Horror! Think about it. Shouldn't all landings be as short and soft as possible? I've never been sure what the difference was. This thing about "I have a 5000' runway, why not use it" is ridiculous and sloppy IMHO. A stable, full flap, approach at 5 kts below best glide speed will more times than not result in a soft, short landing...the stall warning should be at least chirping when the wheels touch. Remember, its easier (and safer) to bleed excessive speed while still airborne (nose high) than to try to stop with brakes once on the ground. Let the examiner call it either one, because they will virtually look the same. The significant differences are after touchdown. For the short field, get the nose wheel down, the flaps up (gets the weight on the wheels) and the brakes on, quickly... the soft field, keep the nose wheel off as long as possible (yoke against your chest) and be light on the brakes, maybe no brakes at all....just let it run out of energy on its own...

But what about soft short runways? Pass the salt

 

[RyanB]

The soft field landing assumes the same airspeed as a normal landing, the only difference is you're touching down as softly as possible on the main gear, while holding the nose wheel off as long as possible. For most trainers, you'll keep just a smidge of power in until you're in the round out, but that's something you'll have to figure out.

As for the short field landing, you are flying the airplane down final using a steeper approach at a slower airspeed. For this maneuver, you'll typically begin to slow a little sooner than you would on a normal landing. So as the CFI said, imagine an obstacle such as a row of 50' trees near the runway and plan the decent path to be steeper. This is a maneuver where airspeed will be key.

Although many of us can dish out the advice, these questions are something that you'll have to practice in the airplane to get any real answers.

 

[James331]

Hello, i'm confused with different landings, i have got different instructions from different instructors. Just would like to make sure how people do it. I read those theory with books and materials to find the answers but i couldn't.. so i'm posting here!

1. soft field landing
-when do you power idle? some instructor told me don't power idle and some told me do it before touch down.
- do you slow down and lose altitude earlier than normal landing?


2. short field landing
- do you assume there is any obstacle in front of the threshold or not?
one instructor told me imagine 50' obstacle in front of threshold and the other said no obstacle.

thanks a lot in advance,, i asked my instructors (i have more than 1) and those parts above are the parts i got different instructions. I gotta pass the checkride so i'm trying to get an answer of how ppl generally do it thanks

1
Power out when you're you have your landing spot made, remember to keep the stick back to keep weight off the nose wheel (if you're flying a trike), easy on the brakes

2
Yes, since most real short fields are often short due to stuff often being at both ends of the strip


Also don't be afraid to slip

 

[Caramon13]

You know, its kind of funny how everything requires a set of rules or How to's... Here's one to crack your cocoa-nut... How do you do a short, soft-field landing? Oh the Horror! Think about it. Shouldn't all landings be as short and soft as possible? I've never been sure what the difference was. This thing about "I have a 5000' runway, why not use it" is ridiculous and sloppy IMHO. A stable, full flap, approach at 5 kts below best glide speed will more times than not result in a soft, short landing...the stall warning should be at least chirping when the wheels touch. Remember, its easier (and safer) to bleed excessive speed while still airborne (nose high) than to try to stop with brakes once on the ground. Let the examiner call it either one, because they will virtually look the same. The significant differences are after touchdown. For the short field, get the nose wheel down, the flaps up (gets the weight on the wheels) and the brakes on, quickly... the soft field, keep the nose wheel off as long as possible (yoke against your chest) and be light on the brakes, maybe no brakes at all....just let it run out of energy on its own...

Didn't realize it at the time, but the funniest thing was the first time I did a "soft landing" my instructor said "Great job, now you can do that all the time!".

I enthusiastically agreed, but now that I look back on it, I think that was an insult lol...

 

[jnbcfi]

Don't trust your checkride to what you read in an online aviation forum! 12 of the 13 responses above contain errors.
Do go to your instructor(s) ask them to justify their recommended procedures and techniques with references to the appropriate POH and FAA publications. Then ask them to demonstrate. Then follow their instruction.That is what the examiner will accept. Congratulations on passing your checkride!

 

[James331]

Don't trust your checkride to what you read in an online aviation forum! 12 of the 13 responses above contain errors.
Do go to your instructor(s) ask them to justify their recommended procedures and techniques with references to the appropriate POH and FAA publications. Then ask them to demonstrate. Then follow their instruction.That is what the examiner will accept. Congratulations on passing your checkride!

Well ya can't go say everyone else's posts "contain errors" without pointing them out.

 

[Clark1961]

Landing tips? Make sure them rollie things underneath the aircraft are the first things to alight ever so gently on the designated firmament. Try real hard to avoid scraping noises after that. Bangs are generally also bad.

No need to thank me and glad I could help.

 

[arkvet]

Not necessarily specific to soft or short field techniques but landings really get easier when you realize that your goal isn't to "land" the plane. Your goal is to put that plane just above the runway at a speed above stall and finesse the "flight path" until the plane decides to land itself. Do NOT force the plane down. Short field techniques require you approach to the flare at a slower airspeed to expedite the plane deciding not to fly anymore. Soft field (they're often short too) usually requires leaving a little power in (if possible) to keep that pressure off the nose wheel.

Like someone already mentioned above I kind of treat all landings as semi soft/short. Not to the extremes but the less time I have to fight the plane 1' off the ground the better the landing. Also, when the time comes to put my Saratoga into a short field I just do my normal thing. The exception is really windy / gusty conditions when a little extra airspeed is nice.

 

[RyanB]

Don't trust your checkride to what you read in an online aviation forum! 12 of the 13 responses above contain errors.

In other words, if it's not the way you perform the maneuver, it's wrong.

 

[bluerooster]

You know, its kind of funny how everything requires a set of rules or How to's... Here's one to crack your cocoa-nut... How do you do a short, soft-field landing? Oh the Horror! Think about it. Shouldn't all landings be as short and soft as possible? I've never been sure what the difference was. This thing about "I have a 5000' runway, why not use it" is ridiculous and sloppy IMHO. A stable, full flap, approach at 5 kts below best glide speed will more times than not result in a soft, short landing...the stall warning should be at least chirping when the wheels touch. Remember, its easier (and safer) to bleed excessive speed while still airborne (nose high) than to try to stop with brakes once on the ground. Let the examiner call it either one, because they will virtually look the same. The significant differences are after touchdown. For the short field, get the nose wheel down, the flaps up (gets the weight on the wheels) and the brakes on, quickly... the soft field, keep the nose wheel off as long as possible (yoke against your chest) and be light on the brakes, maybe no brakes at all....just let it run out of energy on its own...

ALL my landings are short soft field landings. Some more so than others. But I strive to get down, and planted, very softly, in the first 50 feet of runway, and be stopped by 500', (if need be). I also have fun by riding the mains keeping the training wheel off, for as long as possible.
Then, just for spits and giggles, I'll sometimes plant one main, and just ride on it for a while, before swapping to the other main, and ride it for a while, then pour the coal to it for a go around. I try to challenge myself with something different from time to time. And some of the maneuvers
will instill rudder use for folks who have never flown, much less landed, a TW airplane.

 

[MAKG1]

Landing tips? Make sure them rollie things underneath the aircraft are the first things to alight ever so gently on the designated firmament. Try real hard to avoid scraping noises after that. Bangs are generally also bad.

No need to thank me and glad I could help.

Splashing noises aren't very good either. At least not with rolling things on the bottom.

Neither is an "Oh s**t" noise from the right seat.

And you REALLY don't want to hear this sound:

 

[gismo]

Hello, i'm confused with different landings, i have got different instructions from different instructors. Just would like to make sure how people do it. I read those theory with books and materials to find the answers but i couldn't.. so i'm posting here!

1. soft field landing
-when do you power idle? some instructor told me don't power idle and some told me do it before touch down.
- do you slow down and lose altitude earlier than normal landing?

The goal for a soft field landing is to touch down as slowly as possible, not as soft as possible. Aside from landing in deep slush or snow, most "real" soft field landings are made on a fairly rough surface so there's really not much point in greasing it on. But the low speed is crucial as is touching down with the nosewheel well off the ground and keeping it there until you're really slow. You should have the stick/wheel all the way back when the mains touch and you need to keep it there other than a slight relaxation of back pressure when you finally let the nosewheel touch, then go right back to full up elevator. Most soft field landing practice is done on surfaces that are not all that soft so you probably don't need any power on after you land but on a truly soft surface you might need a very high power setting to keep the plane rolling without getting stuck.

And Unless you're combining a short field with a soft field (a bad idea IMO until you've got a lot of experience landing on hard short strips) you shouldn't touch the brakes until you park. Carrying power through the landing does allow you to land at a slower speed but it will also result in touching down significantly further from your aim point.

2. short field landing
- do you assume there is any obstacle in front of the threshold or not?
one instructor told me imagine 50' obstacle in front of threshold and the other said no obstacle.

Obstacles are often present at the ends of short runways and a lot of them are much taller than 50ft. You should be able to deal with either situation and IIRC the examiner can specify an imaginary one if he chooses. The key to any short field landing is energy control. You want to get to a point as close to the near end of the runway with just enough energy to get the nose up before the mains touch. If you're even five knots too fast you'll float more than necessary. A smooth touchdown is definitely not appropriate for a short landing, and you don't have to almost stalled before touching down either in a tricycle gear airplane. Just make sure you don't let the nosewheel touch at the same time or (shudder) before the mains. Be ready to get on the brakes but don't lock the wheels up. You'll need considerably less brake pressure at first then more and more as you slow down and lose lift.

I do strongly recommend finding out as much as you can WRT your DE's expectations on these landings. They're all supposed to be following the same script but it's likely some will have very different ideas about how you're supposed to do them. Chances are your CFI knows what the DE want's to see.