Jet A or 100LL

AKBill

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AKBill
IMG_1090.JPG Had a nice flight this morning. I needed fuel and asked the FBO to stop by and fill the tanks. When the fuel man showed up "he asked me if I wanted Jet A?" I said no were did you get that idea? He replied that's what the dispatcher told him and that she was new. Well we topped the Baby Beech off with 100LL and all was good.

Guess that's why I'm always present when I get fuel. Would have been a bad day if I took off with a mix of Jet A and 100LL...o_O

Pics are Sisters Island VOR and hills west of town

IMG_1088.JPG
 
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This incident should be reported to the FBO or the entity responsible for the fueling. This could have been a very expensive mistake for him. -Skip
 
Thanks for the pictures.!!!

I wanted to go to Eldred Rock for a picnic with my wife.

And the hills aren't that tall, going over in a loaded 207 was only a problem if they were covered with clouds.
 
So I just got back from another nice flight. I again asked for fuel to be delivered and talked to the dispatcher. She said "we have a problem with your account the I have been unable to correct". Well they have my Beech B19 listed as a Beech 1900C. Wish I could afford the fuel for a B-1900....:) Bet the wife would like the upgrade, probably room for a head....
 
Landed recently in California in the A*, and the line guy couldn't believe how quiet it was. Kept mentioning it as he was driving me to the terminal. It seemed so odd, because the A* actually has a bit of a reputation for being loud, and outside the plane, it sounds just a normal big-bore twin. When he asked me how many gallons of Jet-A I needed, we then both understood why he was so impressed. :)
 
I generally don't supervise people who are paid to fuel my planes. Just as I don't supervise the A&P's who work on them.

The 100LL placards are in place and I assume they are competent. I sump the tanks after having been fueled. Like water, Jet A has a higher specific gravity than 100ll. There's also the color.
 
I generally don't supervise people who are paid to fuel my planes. Just as I don't supervise the A&P's who work on them.
Well they were training the guy that fueled me today. The supervisor had to tell him to put chocks down. Don't think this kid would know what the placard meant.. :(
 
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Who needed choking? Perhaps chocks? And Doubt rather than drought.

And he was supervised. For good reason.

I'm curious what @overdrive148 thinks about the topic.
 
I generally don't supervise people who are paid to fuel my planes. Just as I don't supervise the A&P's who work on them.

The 100LL placards are in place and I assume they are competent. I sump the tanks after having been fueled. Like water, Jet A has a higher specific gravity than 100ll. There's also the color.
 
If this were a perfect world, the jet nozzle would not have fit in your 100LL fuel receptacle.

At least, that is how they are SUPPOSED to be designed.
You would think so! The duckbill/hoover nozzle is wider than most (not nearly all) 100LL fuel ports. A few months ago a JetPROP conversion Malibu came in and he still had the 100LL size ports and I had to put jet into it. The most unnerving feeling defeating a safety against misfueling on purpose.

Until the lineman asks for a funnel to fill the 172 with Jet A. o_O
Just wait until Diesel catches on!

I generally don't supervise people who are paid to fuel my planes. Just as I don't supervise the A&P's who work on them.

The 100LL placards are in place and I assume they are competent. I sump the tanks after having been fueled. Like water, Jet A has a higher specific gravity than 100ll. There's also the color.
Yep, but remember the testing I did - you can't see it. Always do the paper test if you're not sure ;)

Well they were training the guy that fueled me today. The supervisor had to tell him to put chocks down. Don't think this kid would know what the placard meant.. :(

Who needed choking? Perhaps chocks? And Doubt rather than drought.

And he was supervised. For good reason.

I'm curious what @overdrive148 thinks about the topic.
Not even going to lie, on my first week of line service ever I clamped the bonding cable (with teeth) to the vent underneath a Baron's engine (which was painted). Then again, I had a Cirrus that pulled up to the self service pump who had literally never fueled his own airplane and asked me for help. It's a learning experience. Bonus points on him for asking instead of just going for it and fueling you with what he thought was the correct fuel.

Now I'm NATA Safety 1st / Professional Line Service trained and certificated. And even did the Advanced Workshop in Houston a few months ago.

Check out the accident chain on this one -
http://www.bst-tsb.gc.ca/eng/rapports-reports/aviation/2015/a15c0134/a15c0134.asp
Bonus points at the end, you can put the TSB file numbers into google and read reports about it. A lot of LST's throwing fuel into planes they aren't sure of. In the NATA training, you have to have 3 pieces of info for a fuel order:

Tail Number
Fuel Quantity (Pilot)
Fuel Grade (Placard or Pilot)

Chocks are usually a company thing, I only chocked 1 of the wheels in Shawnee and often none if I verified the brakes were set. At my current job it's mandatory 2+.You don't even chock the nose on some aircraft like the Eclipse jet because of the heated pitot tube right above you, and you have to make sure the chocks aren't under the gear doors because when you fuel it the doors will come down on the chocks. Tow pins and presets and checks and all kinds of things you have to learn for towing and line service.

I made this when I started the job in Fort Worth and it's posted in the office.

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You don't think it's possible until you get a regular customer Cessna 425 (Jet A) and then a 421 rolls in with almost the same paint job and literally one number different (421XX vs 425XX). It almost caught even me by surprise.
 
I generally don't supervise people who are paid to fuel my planes. Just as I don't supervise the A&P's who work on them.

The 100LL placards are in place and I assume they are competent. I sump the tanks after having been fueled. Like water, Jet A has a higher specific gravity than 100ll. There's also the color.

Your A&P is a well trained professional and should not require your supervision. The guy pumping the gas in your plane might have just left his job at the local burger joint for this job and received minimal training. Assuming competence in professionals can be risky. Assuming competence in non pros is unwise.
 
Assuming competence in professionals can be risky. Assuming competence in non pros is unwise.

The verification step is sumping the tanks. Anything else needed?

Don't underestimate the line guys... They can make more flipping burgers but choose not to.
 
Yes. Without any doubt. Physically be there to monitor the fueling or risk death. And, you can't get laid if you're dead.

Your statement is a bit odd. Are there things I can do if I'm dead?

Meanwhile, for renters... do they supervise fueling? and for club plane owners, do you supervise fueling?

Sure, my E-AB I usually fuel myself. But truth be told that doesn't help me against the fuel truck guy screwing up. You can supervise the guy pumping it in to your wing but you have no clue what happened about putting the stuff in the ground or truck tank.

But you can love thinking it, right?
 
At the advanced line service workshop, there was a presentation on fuel quality that was an eye opener.

Basically, when a fuel load arrives, you have procedures and tests to complete to ensure what you are getting is correct and not contaminated fuel. Refinery to the truck, truck to the farm, farm to the fuel truck, fuel truck to the aircraft. I get a sample of fuel and match it to lab tests for that batch, measure API gravity and temperature, use a whiz wheel and correct it to the standard of 60*F. The number has to match + or - 1.0. Each batch has the same API, but different batches have different APIs (within a certain range of course). If you get a number outside that range, you have contamination (i.e. truck wasn't cleaned out between loads).

For example, the jet fuel from Wichita Falls is almost as clear as water while the jet fuel from Tyler is a deep straw color. The driver said it had to do with the raw products each refinery started with.

Long story short, a refinery had to cut a batch in half for some reason and the API gravity changed without the lab paperwork changing. The head guy responsible was presenting at the workshop and said that all but 4 of the distributors (FBOs) had pencil whipped the lab API gravity instead of finding the API to be wrong like they should have.

Trust but verify is my advice, I work with a pretty great group of guys but at the same time I've seen/met guys who I would not be comfortable with around my airplane (if I had one).

Our fuel is triple filtered from arrival at the farm to the plane. Once on the way in to the farm, once on the way out, and once from the truck to your plane but your FBO may be different. I learned a lot in my first year of line service and to be honest I was pretty lucky. Now I know better and try to teach better too.
 
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