Initial ME training

[warthog1984]

Question for the crowd:

I'm looking at adding a ME rating after I finish the TW endorsement (should be next time we can find X-winds).

I'm a 100hr VFR pilot who would either get the IR before (Part 61) or concurrent with the twin training (Part 141). End goal is going interesting places and being a part-time CFI. There's an outside chance of switching careers if I can find something better than late-night box hauling and pickup the HP/complex endorsements cheap. My options are below. Thoughts?

*Duchess/Seminole @ Part 61- $260/hr
*Seneca @ Part 61- $230/hr + 90 min drive
*B-55 @ Part 141- $300/hr + 120 minute drive
*DA-42 @ Part 61 - $375/hr with instructor + 120 minute drive
*DA-42 Level 5 FTD @ Part 61 - $110/hr + 120 minute drive
*SIMCOM/FlightSafety/RTC/CAE resident program?

 

[Ted]

Do you have your instrument rating? If not, do that. Otherwise you'll have to take two separate instrument check rides. And if the goal is commercial, the best bet is to do instrument CP-ASEL-IA, and then do your CP-AMEL-IA.

But if you want to get the VFR multi now for fun, I'd probably go with whatever is cheapest.

 

[Cpt_Kirk]

I recently finished my Multi. 8.8 total in a Duchess (including the ride). Easy airplane to fly. Speeds are easy to memorize. Big rudder, flies easily on one engine.

Personally, I'd do the IR first. That way, it's only one checkride for the ME addon, like the guy above me said.

 

[James331]

I recently finished my Multi. 8.8 total in a Duchess (including the ride). Easy airplane to fly. Speeds are easy to memorize. Big rudder, flies easily on one engine.

Personally, I'd do the IR first. That way, it's only one checkride for the ME addon, like the guy above me said.

What they said, it's critical to find a good CFII though, I'd be looking for min 1000tt, 200 instrument (hood or actual) and 50 actual, ideally in a 135/121 setting.

Use a sim in the beginning and whenever you can't get IMC.

Best bet would be to find a current or ex Fedex feeder or ameraflight or EMS dude that can squeeze you in (flight time permitting).


As for the aircraft, whatever is cheapest, the instructor is FIRST AND FOREMOST of consideration for your instrument ticket.

Later for the multi, what ever is cheaper, trainer twin is a trainer twin, multi ain't that involved.

 

[frfly172]

Go for the IFR first ,then go for your multi,got mine in a duchess,very easy twin to fly.

 

[warthog1984]

Per the OP, if I go the Part 61 route I'll be doing the IR first- with either of several current or ex-121/135 captains. If I go 141 I'd probably try to combine the IR and ME since there is no checkride per se.

 

[DeeG]

Way back in the stone age (mid 90's) when I was learning to fly, I wanted a ME rating. Did PPSEL, then the instrument. Next step was Multi, commercial and multi IFR in one ride.

That way, the single commercial was just a quick ride in a HP single.

Was a lot cheaper for me to do it that way, as I was already going to have to shell out the $$ for the multi, and it saved a lot of $$ not having to spend time in a complex single.

 

[poadeleted20]

Do you have your instrument rating? If not, do that. Otherwise you'll have to take two separate instrument check rides.

Not if he does the IR in a twin. But he will have to take two CP rides (one in the twin and one in the single) on top of having take an initial PP in the twin and then an ME add-on at the PP level in the twin.

And if the goal is commercial, the best bet is to do instrument CP-ASEL-IA, and then do your CP-AMEL-IA.

Agreed if your goal is being a p/t CFI. Only reason I see for someone to get the ME at the PP level (especially before IR) is if you just want to fly your own twin around as a PP. In that situation, getting the ME first has the advantage of building ME PIC time while you're doing your IR, and the more ME PIC time, the cheaper the insurance on your twin.

 

[stratobee]

I've been ME VFR only for years. Not many of us around, but we do exist. I have much more ME time than I have SE time. My insurance keeps going down every year, they just lowered it with $400 this year. I pay $1400 with no hull. Don't know how much it would be with hull, but probably in the $2-2.5K range. So it's not a requirement that you need an IR - it's just fine to insure a VFR twin if you want to go down that route.

What is the FAA's logic when you get SE IR privileges on a ME IR ride, but not on a CPL ride? Makes zero sense to me. Or even less sense - AMEL ride does not give you ASEL privileges….

 

[rbridges]

I just got my ME rating at ATP. They use seminoles which are pretty easy judging from my minimal experience. Low HP (180) and the right side engine rotates counterclockwise, so there isn't a critical engine in this plane.

 

[Fearless Tower]

What is the FAA's logic when you get SE IR privileges on a ME IR ride, but not on a CPL ride? Makes zero sense to me. Or even less sense - AMEL ride does not give you ASEL privileges….

Here's why- safety. Because of safety concerns you can't do all of the required ASEL PTS requirements in a twin. As it was explained by a FAA ASI, they don't want to risk an engine failure in the middle of a chandelle or lazy 8.

You get ASEL privileges doing the IR ride in a twin because you can complete all if the ASEL PTS requirements while flying a twin.

 

[poadeleted20]

What is the FAA's logic when you get SE IR privileges on a ME IR ride, but not on a CPL ride? Makes zero sense to me. Or even less sense - AMEL ride does not give you ASEL privileges….

I'm not following you. You don't get IR privileges on a CP-AMEL ride, either, unless you already hold an IR earned in a single, but if you do, the ME IR privileges are included on the CP-AMEL additional class rating ride. OTOH, the CP-ASEL contains a number of tasks which are not part of the CP-AMEL PTS, and that's why you don't get ASEL privileges for a CP-AMEL ride.

 

[Ted]

I've been ME VFR only for years. Not many of us around, but we do exist. I have much more ME time than I have SE time. My insurance keeps going down every year, they just lowered it with $400 this year. I pay $1400 with no hull. Don't know how much it would be with hull, but probably in the $2-2.5K range. So it's not a requirement that you need an IR - it's just fine to insure a VFR twin if you want to go down that route.

What is the FAA's logic when you get SE IR privileges on a ME IR ride, but not on a CPL ride? Makes zero sense to me. Or even less sense - AMEL ride does not give you ASEL privileges….

Addition for hull will depend on your hull value. I'm somewhere around 1.5% of insured value per year, without an IR and with lower hours (and in pressurized/turbocharged, etc.) I'd figure you'd be somewhere in the 2-3% range.