How to get from here to there (training-wise)

[Rykymus]

So, I'm a PPL w/Instrument, flying an Archer. About 500 hrs PIC, 160 XC, maybe 7 of actual IMC. My goal is to own and fly a pressurized twin, along the lines of a Cessna 340A. This would be for personal use, flying myself and my family, and a few times a month flying my brother to business meetings. (No cash involved, just an excuse for me to fly and rack up hours.)

The question is the what is best progression to get from where I am now, to where I need to be to be able to legally fly a pressurized twin, SAFELY fly it, and get INSURED to fly it. I'm not looking for shortcuts, I want to be qualified. I'm not looking for "on the cheap", although I have no desire to waste money unnecessarily. I've got at least a couple years to prepare, and I'm just trying to figure out the best way to progress. So far, all I've come up is:

1. Get my ME add on via the local flight school, (same place I got all my training) using their Seneca
2. After I get ME, regularly rent their Seneca to build twin time
3. Possibly attend some sim training for whatever plane I intend on buying. (Again, the current leader is the Cessna 340A)

I'm not sure that the above will be enough to avoid some of the outrageous insurance quotes I've seen for relatively low time ME pilots stepping up to a pressurized twin. (Like $15k-$20k annually) I know I'll likely have to hire a pilot to ride with me for a while, which is fine.

I'm not looking for a debate on twin vs single safety, etc..., nor am I looking for a debate on which twin is best. I know I want to fly a pressurized twin. Whether or not I need it is not the issue. I just want to start training and preparing for that eventuality now, and am seeking advice on how best to prepare, and be a good, safe pressurized twin pilot when I get to the point of buying the plane. (Again, anywhere from 2-5 years out.)

Thanks

 

[KA550]

0. Learn to plan flights

 

[mscard88]

Too long of a post. I'll try later maybe. Nate you should be worried!

 

[asicer]

Too long of a post. I'll try later maybe. Nate you should be worried!

TL;DR - 500hr PP-ASEL-IA is buying a C340A. Wants to know what needs to happen before he can fly solo/pax.

 

[mscard88]

TL;DR - 500hr PP-ASEL-IA is buying a C340A. Wants to know what needs to happen before he can fly solo/pax.

First, get a MEL rating, then talk to the insurance company and see what they require. But after finally reading the OP's post, looks like he already knows all this. Might be a way if the insurance buys off on flying with another pilot (who is qualified in the 340 for instance) until you gained the required hours to fly by yourself, or as PIC without another pilot.

 

[RyanB]

Think about Simcom or training from somewhere similar for proficiency.

 

[mondtster]

3. Possibly attend some sim training for whatever plane I intend on buying. (Again, the current leader is the Cessna 340A)

There's no possibly about this step. Insurance will likely require an initial course as a condition of being insured in whatever pressurized, cabin class twin you end up with.

As for the rest of the plan, I'd probably just buy something like an Aztec or 310 to get your rating in then fly it for a year or two. Once you have an adequate amount of multi time you can sell it to the next person and move on to your 340.

 

[Rykymus]

There's no possibly about this step. Insurance will likely require an initial course as a condition of being insured in whatever pressurized, cabin class twin you end up with.

As for the rest of the plan, I'd probably just buy something like an Aztec or 310 to get your rating in then fly it for a year or two. Once you have an adequate amount of multi time you can sell it to the next person and move on to your 340.

An interesting idea, but I have to wonder about the costs of renting the twin locally ($260/hr wet) vs selling the Archer and buying something to build twin time. I hate the idea of buying an interim twin, when the cost of acquiring the target twin is not much more. It might be cheaper to buy the target twin and pay a qualified (per insurance) instructor to fly with me in the target twin until I have enough experience. (This all assumes that I will take the sim training as well.)

 

[mondtster]

An interesting idea, but I have to wonder about the costs of renting the twin locally ($260/hr wet) vs selling the Archer and buying something to build twin time. I hate the idea of buying an interim twin, when the cost of acquiring the target twin is not much more. It might be cheaper to buy the target twin and pay a qualified (per insurance) instructor to fly with me in the target twin until I have enough experience. (This all assumes that I will take the sim training as well.)

If you can rent a decent twin for $260/hour it is probably about the same price that you could own and operate one for. I figure a privately owned Aztec at $250-300/hour depending on how it is operated and maintained, plus slight variances in fixed costs. Do you know whether the flight school or FBO will actually rent the twin without having one of their instructors sitting in it? Some won't.

If I remember right the open pilot clause on a 414 insurance policy I saw a while back had requirements of 1,000 total time, 250 multi, and 25 time in type. You can likely get insurance for a pressurized cabin class twin with less time than that but it serves as a reasonable benchmark for where you might want to try and be.

 

[GRG55]

An interesting idea, but I have to wonder about the costs of renting the twin locally ($260/hr wet) vs selling the Archer and buying something to build twin time. I hate the idea of buying an interim twin, when the cost of acquiring the target twin is not much more. It might be cheaper to buy the target twin and pay a qualified (per insurance) instructor to fly with me in the target twin until I have enough experience. (This all assumes that I will take the sim training as well.)

I will second what mondtster posted.
You'll find folks like Ted and eggman bought non-pressurized twins like an Aztec or 310, then stepped up. Part of it might be economics, but I am on the same progression and I think it is the best and safest way to do it. You are unlikely to get the concentration of flying experience renting a twin. Buy one and fly the hell out of it. Everywhere.

After evaluating everything out there I think a 414 will likely be the next plane for me. I still have to negotiate the budget allocation with the family Minister of Finance however.

 

[Rykymus]

I will second what mondtster posted.
You'll find folks like Ted and eggman bought non-pressurized twins like an Aztec or 310, then stepped up. Part of it might be economics, but I am on the same progression and I think it is the best and safest way to do it. You are unlikely to get the concentration of flying experience renting a twin. Buy one and fly the hell out of it. Everywhere.

After evaluating everything out there I think a 414 will likely be the next plane for me. I still have to negotiate the budget allocation with the family Minister of Finance however.

I hadn't thought of that. And it's very true. Buying my Archer in the middle of my PPL really helped as I was free to fly the hell out of it, and I did. (Racked up nearly 100 hrs of solo time before I even did my checkride. I went nuts.) Learned a lot that way.

I think I may just go that route.