How does KSJC deal with stadium TFRs at Levi's Stadium?

colojo

colojo

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Colojo
Levi's Stadium, the site of Super Bowl 50, is roughly 2.5 statute miles off the departure end of runways 30L and 30R at KSJC. Prevailing winds favor these runways most of the time, so departures must be interesting when the stadium TFR is in effect. Arrivals on 12L and 12R would be even more interesting.

Does anyone here at POA know how they deal with this? The stadium TFR basically envelopes the field when it's in effect. Plus it's really going to be an aerial circus out there with SB50 going on. I did some Googling on this but found nothing.

Go Broncos!
 
Stadium TFRs are no big deal as long as you are talking to ATC. This might not necessarily be the case with the super bowl though.
 
Not sure how they will handle the super bowl, specifically....but, when watching the 9ers play, there's a constant stream of aircraft flying directly overhead. As a matter of fact, if you read enough Yelp reviews of the stadium, you'll see people constantly complain about the "distracting noise from planes taking off from the airport."

So, to answer your question, nothing special.
 
colojo said:
Levi's Stadium, the site of Super Bowl 50, is roughly 2.5 statute miles off the departure end of runways 30L and 30R at KSJC. Prevailing winds favor these runways most of the time, so departures must be interesting when the stadium TFR is in effect. Arrivals on 12L and 12R would be even more interesting.

Does anyone here at POA know how they deal with this? The stadium TFR basically envelopes the field when it's in effect. Plus it's really going to be an aerial circus out there with SB50 going on. I did some Googling on this but found nothing.
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If you're working with ATC Stadium TFRs are inconsequential and the airport is in a Class C surface area so everybody is working with ATC.
 
Regularly scheduled commercial air operations are permitted to operate within the TFR inner ring, provided they adhere to one of a couple of specific security programs.

It's much more like a VIP TFR than a stadium TFR. Normal stadium TFRs within Class C are nonevents (like A's games if you've ever flown out of Oakland), except for some wild traffic.

Note that the TFR effectively closes Palo Alto and Reid Hillview.
 
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vkhosid said:
Not sure how they will handle the super bowl, specifically....but, when watching the 9ers play, there's a constant stream of aircraft flying directly overhead. As a matter of fact, if you read enough Yelp reviews of the stadium, you'll see people constantly complain about the "distracting noise from planes taking off from the airport."...
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I was wondering about that as I looked at the stadium from overhead KSJC recently. Judging by the complaints you've read, it sounds like it was a pretty dumb place to build a stadium. It will be interesting to see if it gets mentioned during the broadcast.
 
We took off from KSJC once during a game. We were told to watch out for the 5 banner tow planes. Good thing we have an excellent climb rate...
 
I flew in to KEYE last May on INDY 500 day. Banner tow planes, the sky typers, etc. all buzzing around; crossing the airport at pattern altitude...three & four at a time while others are doing overhead breaks; NORDO; etc.

It reminded me of a few fly-ins that I'll never return to.

I love KEYE but will never be there on that day again.
 
I live near this whole mess. Having my aircraft locked away on the Superbowl is a little annoying, since it lives at Reid-Hillview. That said, the Bay Area is pretty dense and finding a place to put a stadium that works is nearly impossible. This location is about as good as it was going to get. The location is right next to Santa Clara's convention center and our local amusement park. As a result, there's large areas for parking and a transit center already nearby. There's several hotels nearby. What it lacks is significant retail close by. So, no walking to a bar after the game.

It's not actually that close to KSJC. There's residential zoning between it and the airport, ferchrissake!

I think building the stadium at all was a dumb thing to do, but I can't fault the location. Stadiums and sports teams never pay back to a city, but we keep doing it, don't we? Given that, the location was about as good as it was going to get in the Santa Clara.
 
arnoha said:
I think building the stadium at all was a dumb thing to do, but I can't fault the location. Stadiums and sports teams never pay back to a city, but we keep doing it, don't we? Given that, the location was about as good as it was going to get in the Santa Clara.
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I don't follow sports, so don't really care too much about football, or the 49ers.

But, I think it's stupid that a football team plays in a stadium in Santa Clara, which is about 50 miles south of San Francisco, and yet still calls themselves the "San Francisco" 49ers.

If I was a city/county/taxpayers footing millions of dollars for building a stadium, one of the conditions would be they change their damn name to reflect the city they play in. If you want to keep your name, then go build a stadium in your own damn city and play there.
 
Shawn said:
Why do you think you are on lockdown and grounded? You just can't go do a Bay Tour. Read the TFR. Taking to ATC and filing a flight plan ain't all that hard.
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KRHV is in the inner core. :(

Only exceptions I see are:
* Military
* Law enforcement
* Emergency
* Scheduled passenger
* Commercial air cargo

ALL AIRCRAFT OPERATIONS WITHIN THE 10 NMR
AREA(S) LISTED ABOVE, KNOWN AS THE INNER CORE(S),
ARE PROHIBITED EXCEPT FOR: APPROVED LAW
ENFORCEMENT, MILITARY AIRCRAFT, APPROVED AIR
AMBULANCE FLIGHTS, AND REGULARLY SCHEDULED
COMMERCIAL PASSENGER AND ALL-CARGO CARRIERS
OPERATING UNDER ONE OF THE FOLLOWING TSA-APPROVED
STANDARD SECURITY PROGRAMS/PROCEDURES: AIRCRAFT
OPERATOR STANDARD SECURITY PROGRAM (AOSSP), FULL
ALL-CARGO AIRCRAFT OPERATOR STANDARD SECURITY
PROGRAM (FACAOSSP), MODEL SECURITY PROGRAM (MSP),
TWELVE FIVE STANDARD SECURITY PROGRAM (TFSSP) ALL
CARGO, OR ALL-CARGO INTERNATIONAL SECURITY
PROCEDURE (ACISP) AND ARE ARRIVING INTO AND/OR
DEPARTING FROM 14 CFR PART 139 AIRPORTS. ALL
EMERGENCY/LIFESAVING FLIGHTS (AIR AMBULANCE/LAW
ENFORCEMENT/FIREFIGHTING) AND DOD FLIGHTS MUST
COORDINATE WITH THE JOINT OPERATIONS CENTER (JOC)
PRIOR TO THEIR DEPARTURE AT 650-604-3623 TO AVOID
POTENTIAL DELAYS.
Click to expand...
 
LoneAspen said:
I don't follow sports, so don't really care too much about football, or the 49ers.

But, I think it's stupid that a football team plays in a stadium in Santa Clara, which is about 50 miles south of San Francisco, and yet still calls themselves the "San Francisco" 49ers.

If I was a city/county/taxpayers footing millions of dollars for building a stadium, one of the conditions would be they change their damn name to reflect the city they play in. If you want to keep your name, then go build a stadium in your own damn city and play there.
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Santa Clara is not a very big city. I suspect they were happy just to get the Stadium.
 
LoneAspen said:
I don't follow sports, so don't really care too much about football, or the 49ers.

But, I think it's stupid that a football team plays in a stadium in Santa Clara, which is about 50 miles south of San Francisco, and yet still calls themselves the "San Francisco" 49ers.

If I was a city/county/taxpayers footing millions of dollars for building a stadium, one of the conditions would be they change their damn name to reflect the city they play in. If you want to keep your name, then go build a stadium in your own damn city and play there.
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Then you would really think it's stupid that the New York Giants' (and the Jets too) stadium is not only not in New York City; it's not even in the state. They play in New Jersey. :D
 
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MAKG1 said:
I beg to differ. There is a much better place for that stadium. Candlestick Point.
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I'm not sure if you're making a joke or are serious. From my point of view, I think you're right...it gets that stadium right out of the way of just about everything. I can just ignore the hell out of it there, like I did with the old Candlestick. Well, except for flights. It's as close to SFO as Levi Stadium is to SJC.

But as a place to see a football game? Holy hell does it suck. It suffered from an overabundance of "character". Windy and cold, the experience wasn't great. It's not near any sort of transit, so getting there is a mess. There's no retail anywhere nearby. It's only really in San Francisco on a technicality, and there's no good way to get to the city proper. The old stadium was a generic multi-use mess, not good for football or baseball, but I'm assuming you're talking about a new one, so we can discard that complaint. So, it's a great out-of-the-way corner to stuff something you don't want to see, but not a great place for a center-of-mind stadium.

Of course, the real problem is that SF didn't really have the will to engage the team. They just didn't care enough. So it had to move. Santa Clara stepped up, which means finding a location inside those city limits. Limiting yourself to Santa Clara, where else would you put it?

Moving forward, it looks like SF made the right choice and Santa Clara pooped the bed. (Boy, that phrase just doesn't work without the right word.) NFL and football look like they're heading the way of smoking and calling people by the n-word as the whole CTE thing plays out.
 
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Everskyward said:
Then you would really think it's stupid that the New York Giants' (and the Jets too) stadium is not only not in New York City; it's not even in the state. They play in New Jersey. :D
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Same with the Redskins. (Maryland)
 
ifly4fun said:
Same with the Redskins. (Maryland)
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Yeah, that's one of the great stupidities of all times. FedEx field (or the Jack) is one of the biggest armpits in the league. About the only plus it had over RFK (DC Stadium) was luxury boxes (I've watched a few USFL games from the owner's box at RFK, it's kind of a joke) which the Skins haven't had a whole lot of luck selling anyhow (along with their club level seats). Almost universally it was a worse experience. My parents ditched their season's tickets after one year of the Jack.

Now they're thinking about building a new stadium back on the RFK site. RFK really was a better baseball stadium, but since the Nats got their own place, it really doesn't serve a purpose (other than an soccer and an occasional concert though since the Dead stopped touring I don't even know if they've had one of those in a while).

The Meadowlands have the distinction to not only hosting the two NY football teams, but Rutgers used to play some of their games there. The general rule was if the team had artificial turf at home they'd play at the Rutgers stadium (which had grass) and if they had grass they'd play at the Meadowlands. This ****ed off Syracuse something awful (which I guess was the point). I joked that Rutgers was the only college where homecoming was an away game.
 
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arnoha said:
I'm not sure if you're making a joke or are serious. From my point of view, I think you're right...it gets that stadium right out of the way of just about everything. I can just ignore the hell out of it there, like I did with the old Candlestick. Well, except for flights. It's as close to SFO as Levi Stadium is to SJC.

But as a place to see a football game? Holy hell does it suck. It suffered from an overabundance of "character". Windy and cold, the experience wasn't great. It's not near any sort of transit, so getting there is a mess. There's no retail anywhere nearby. It's only really in San Francisco on a technicality, and there's no good way to get to the city proper. The old stadium was a generic multi-use mess, not good for football or baseball, but I'm assuming you're talking about a new one, so we can discard that complaint. So, it's a great out-of-the-way corner to stuff something you don't want to see, but not a great place for a center-of-mind stadium.

Of course, the real problem is that SF didn't really have the will to engage the team. They just didn't care enough. So it had to move. Santa Clara stepped up, which means finding a location inside those city limits. Limiting yourself to Santa Clara, where else would you put it?

Moving forward, it looks like SF made the right choice and Santa Clara pooped the bed. (Boy, that phrase just doesn't work without the right word.) NFL and football look like they're heading the way of smoking and calling people by the n-word as the whole CBE thing plays out.
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The Stick was fine for football and day baseball games. It really sucked at night, but who plays night football?

I just think it's really stupid to leave abandoned stadiums all over the place. Levi is MUCH harder to get to than the Stick ever was. It only has about half as much parking as it needs and it makes a mess of the whole South Bay.

Not that it would be much fun for PAO, but they really could have shared that huge Stanford Stadium just like the Raiders used to do with USC. But it's more important to build luxury boxes at taxpayer expense, it seems.
 
MAKG1 said:
The Stick was fine for football and day baseball games. It really sucked at night, but who plays night football?



I just think it's really stupid to leave abandoned stadiums all over the place. Levi is MUCH harder to get to than the Stick ever was. It only has about half as much parking as it needs and it makes a mess of the whole South Bay.



Not that it would be much fun for PAO, but they really could have shared that huge Stanford Stadium just like the Raiders used to do with USC. But it's more important to build luxury boxes at taxpayer expense, it seems.
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Well,if the Niners were any good, they would play night games on Monday Night Football and on Sunday Night Football. Big ratings for those games, and the NFL moves the best games to the night.

I can remember going to a big Monday Night game at Candlestick with Chicago Bears and Mike Ditka throwing gum at Niner fans after getting beat by Joe Montana.and Company.

Candlestick was a horrible stadium for football, seats sat at angles to the field, long distance from sidelines to seats, etc.

And Baseball was just as bad.

The Giants organization loves their new stadium, and, so do the fans, based on attendance.

Other than earning the Croix du Candlestick, their is nothing to be missed from that stadium.
 
Candlestick was one of those abominations where they tried to make both football and baseball happy and succeeded at neither. This was in contrast to parks like RFK and Memorial stadium in Baltimore which were effectively baseball parks that did football to various levels of suckage.
 
roncachamp said:
The NFL plays night football.
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Yep, better TV viewership. Even SF which is in an earlier time zone starts a lot of their games late. Regular season games at Levi's started at: 7:20, 1:25, 1:25, 5:25, 5:25, 1:05, 1:05, 6:30, and 1:25. The Redskins on the other hand here only had 1 night home game. The rest started at 1PM.

Frankly, I miss weekday day baseball, but such is the change in the way people live their lives and corporate greed.
 
MAKG1 said:
The Stick was fine for football and day baseball games. It really sucked at night, but who plays night football?

I just think it's really stupid to leave abandoned stadiums all over the place. Levi is MUCH harder to get to than the Stick ever was. It only has about half as much parking as it needs and it makes a mess of the whole South Bay.

Not that it would be much fun for PAO, but they really could have shared that huge Stanford Stadium just like the Raiders used to do with USC. But it's more important to build luxury boxes at taxpayer expense, it seems.
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Candlestick was easy to drive to, I'll give you that. Right by 101 and plenty of parking. And, yeah, Levi isn't great for parking and does make a mess of the place. But it would do that nearly anywhere you put it in the South Bay. Also, we pretend like this is planned for a whole metro area, but it really happens at the city level. First a city comes up with money, then they find a spot inside the city limits. So, in this case, you gotta find a better place in Santa Clara. It's the best of any of the bad choices.

They didn't leave Candlestick. If you haven't been by recently, it's GONE. Razed and leveled. They're already starting to build up the new stuff. As much as I didn't like Candlestick on a factual level...it's weird to see a part of my childhood disappear. The new stuff in its place has a definite lack of character that Candlestick had an abundance of. No more autocrossing in the break-your-suspension-bumpy parking lot. No more freezing my butt off during games or weird floating fly balls as they catch the air currents over the top of the stadium.

Not defending it at all, but I will note the luxury boxes are pretty nice at Levi. My company had its holiday party there in 2014, immediately after it opened. One of the few places that could accommodate all 5000 of us. It's actually really nice. Three years prior we had had the party at AT&T Park, and as much as I like that stadium for baseball, it sucked balls for the party. (Although the new stadium itself...WTF? They took the post-industrial look a little too far...looks completely unfinished.)

Yeah, I don't get the tax money thing either. NFL franchises are not charities, right? Let them pay for the privilege to play in my city. I would expect the franchise to pay for not only the stadium, but also improvements to the infrastructure around it to support it. You see that all the time with retail establishments. Cities demand funds to change roads and signage. Why do entertainment venues like stadiums get a pass and even subsidies?

OK, OK, rant off. I think we're actually mostly in agreement, MAKG. I'm OK with seeing Candlestick go. I'm unhappy that Levi showed up. But if it was going to be in Santa Clara, I think it went into the best spot it could have.
 
flyingron said:
Yep, better TV viewership. Even SF which is in an earlier time zone starts a lot of their games late. Regular season games at Levi's started at: 7:20, 1:25, 1:25, 5:25, 5:25, 1:05, 1:05, 6:30, and 1:25. The Redskins on the other hand here only had 1 night home game. The rest started at 1PM.
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It's money, naturally. The night games tend to go to the better draws and the better draws tend to be the better teams. Sometimes the teams that were assumed to be a better draw when the schedule is set turn out not to be so good. But that's just an early season issue, when flex scheduling kicks in later in the season the games with teams that aren't doing so hot will be booted off the night schedule.
 
The 49ers should go back to Kezar. <jk> No way I would want to see them there.
 
Going to have increased security for the super bowl,would expect a larger tighter TFR to be in effect.
 
frfly172 said:
Going to have increased security for the super bowl,would expect a larger tighter TFR to be in effect.
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No excrement, Xavier. The FAA official word on that was in the link I posted on the first page of this silly thread.
 
Some jet fighters zooming around today. Getting the lay of the land, I guess.
 
JoseCuervo said:
Well,if the Niners were any good, they would play night games on Monday Night Football and on Sunday Night Football. Big ratings for those games, and the NFL moves the best games to the night.

I can remember going to a big Monday Night game at Candlestick with Chicago Bears and Mike Ditka throwing gum at Niner fans after getting beat by Joe Montana.and Company.

Candlestick was a horrible stadium for football, seats sat at angles to the field, long distance from sidelines to seats, etc.

And Baseball was just as bad.

The Giants organization loves their new stadium, and, so do the fans, based on attendance.

Other than earning the Croix du Candlestick, their is nothing to be missed from that stadium.
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The first couple of MLB games I went to were at the Stick. When I was a kid. SF vs the Houston Colt 45s (how's that for dating back?) and SF vs the LA Dodgers. I don't remember the year, but my grandfather took me.

Went to another Giants game with our Boy Scout troop when my son was in Scouts. I sure remember that mess of a parking lot.

Ah, memories...
 
TFR's don't apply to IFR traffic. You know, like airliners that could be hijacked.
 
tonycondon said:
TFR's don't apply to IFR traffic. You know, like airliners that could be hijacked.
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The usual stadium TFR doesn't apply to IFR traffic. This one does, as do many others. The exemption in this case is for scheduled traffic conforming to specific security programs. Not even air taxis are allowed in the inner ring, according to the TFR text.
 
Palmpilot said:
Some jet fighters zooming around today. Getting the lay of the land, I guess.
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Blue Angels are here too. Listened to ATC and watched Angel 7 going in and out of Moffett. So cool
 
MetalCloud said:
Blue Angels are here too. Listened to ATC and watched Angel 7 going in and out of Moffett. So cool
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That must be what I saw. They were blue and it sounded like they took off from Moffett.
 
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