Hey girl, how much do you weigh?

Calculate your maximum weight load. Then calculate your load with full fuel but without the girls. Tell them how much weight you have to spare for them and ask them to tell you how much fuel you need to lose before takeoff.

Eg: With full fuel, we won;t die if you two weigh less than 250 pounds combined. How many pounds of fuel should I dump?

Then lose that amount of fuel, plus about 30 pounds.
 
I explain the issue, and then ask for their weight. If I doubt them, the scale comes out. Then it's "no step, no flight".

I've NEVER had to pull out the scale. Everyone I've flown with has understood when I explained the need to have an accurate tally.
 
AirDC said:
I don't know. I'm a 150tt pilot, so I'm assuming that 1lb over gross and we are going to crash.

Andrew
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You are not that dim. Think back to the 4 forces acting on a plane in flight...now increase weight...what happens? Over gross you will climb slower and have a lower ceiling than book.

I am not recommending it by any means, just pointing out that 1 lb over gross is not an instant death ray.

What is more likely to crash your plane? Sluggish climb or fuel exhaustion? Get gas...unless you are on fire...
 
I just had a better idea. All four of you take your luggage to a truck stop. Have one of the girls ask the attendant if he would mind if all four of you and your luggage get on the scale to get a combined weight. There is not a truck stop attendant in the world that would deny a girl a request like that.

If there are no truck stops around, our local landfill has a vehicle scale. They weigh you when you enter and they weigh you when you leave and charge you by the pound for how much stuff you dumped. I am sure you could talk them into weighing your group.
 
There is no way out of this cleanly. The blood on your hands will be your own if you don't go about this descretly. I just don't think that there is a right answer to this one.
 
Rant on:
Ok, I am thinking that women who won't own up to their weight for the purposes of loading an aircraft are vacuous, superficial, silly and not worth the time to haul anywhere.
Rant off.

Are vacuous and superficial synonyms?
 
Jeanie said:
Rant on:
Ok, I am thinking that women who won't own up to their weight for the purposes of loading an aircraft are vacuous, superficial, silly and not worth the time to haul anywhere.
Rant off.

Are vacuous and superficial synonyms?
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No they are not. And the world is full of silly women. They don't all live at the playboy mansion.

It's full of silly men too. They don't all live in the frathouses.

Sent from my ADR6300 using Tapatalk 2
 
pilot117 said:
Take your best guess and call it good. It's a 182 for goodness sake. I know many here will crucify me for my suggestion or call me reckless or dangerous. I didn't say to take the matter lightly or forget about it all together, but lets be realistic here. I think you've dated enough women in your life to guess the weight of the passenger and be within 10-20 pounds. Do you really think even a 20 pound error is enough to have a significant impact on the performance of your 182?
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This. The W&B of the empty plane is probably out by 50 lbs or more.
 
Just start a casual conversation on weight loss and comment how you were able to drop to your current weight of XXXXX lbs recently. You will be surprised at how honest the responses are when it comes to your passengers' weights.
 
AirDC said:
That was my first thought. But the guy would be up front with me and the girls in the back. I'd prob be out of rear CG with couples seating.
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In a 182T....I doubt it seriously....consider the luggage...and its position in the aircraft...
 
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pericynthion said:
This. The W&B of the empty plane is probably out by 50 lbs or more.
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Is the W&B signed by the appropriate party and a part of the aircraft records? If the pilot loads the plane based on that data, is he legal?
 
timwinters said:
One other approach that keeps everything confidential.

First, as others have said, express the importance of honesty..."you lie, you die". Also, let them know that they need to give you their weight fully clothed. That can be 10# right there.

Then write down a number on a piece of paper that is your weight plus...say 150#

Hand it to a passenger, tell them to add their weight and write new total down on a new piece of paper, toss the old one, and pass the new total on to the next person.

This process goes through all four people, the total number is returned to you, you subtract 150# and that's the total weight of you and your passengers. Then later, you can ask your buddy in private what he weighs and it becomes an easy calculation to determine what the girls weigh in the back seat.

You might want to pass the paper a second time with a different fictitious starting total just to make sure you wind up with the same answer and thus confirming that everyone is capable of simple addition...which is not a given these days.

You might also want to still add a fudge factor.
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Tim I like the thought you have put into this but man... I don't think I can seriously tell any of my passengers 'you lie, you die' or start playing secret telephone with the total weight card.

I said earlier to guess with the 182. I literally did break out the scales with my 152 earlier this year for a passenger who brought 60+ lbs of luggage, but that 152 is way more sensitive than your 182, it was a hot day and I was going to use a short runway.
 
Henning's right. Yup. I've done that at KBPK, Mountain Home. Clipboard, bathroom scale. Everyone complies.
 
bbchien said:
Henning's right. Yup. I've done that at KBPK, Mountain Home. Clipboard, bathroom scale. Everyone complies.
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Easy for you to say, you are a Doctor.
Some people I know would bend over and cough if a doctor tells them to. :)
 
I have to add here that anyone who can't just tell me what they weigh, I probably don't like 'em enough to offer them a ride in my airplane anyway.

Long before we ever got near the plane, you already know if they have the "crazy" gene. A well tuned BS meter helps. :)

You know the type: They post on their Facebook page all the awful stuff they bring upon themselves daily. And you think, "Why the **** did you do THAT again? Oh... Because you never learn. Or you want the attention."

I willing to be discreet and not ask in front of everyone else if you've got the mild crazy gene. But start playing games and you can stay here at the airport. See ya!
 
I've got to chime in here-- I've been asked my weight for weights and balances purposes and I have not lied-- and this goes back to college, even. I think if they understand the importance of knowing the correct number (and doing W&B for an aircraft falls under that category), they'll tell "da truf."
 
Tracey said:
I've got to chime in here-- I've been asked my weight for weights and balances purposes and I have not lied-- and this goes back to college, even. I think if they understand the importance of knowing the correct number (and doing W&B for an aircraft falls under that category), they'll tell "da truf."
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I trust, but verify.

I promised my wife to not do anything stupid and crashing for being out of Cg fits the bill in my book. If I have ANY reason to ask, the scale comes out and I see the number myself. Period.
 
I have allocated 250 lbs for you and your luggage.

Unless you prove to me that you weigh under 250 lbs, you aren't bringing any luggage. There is a scale right here that you can use.

Thank you for your cooperation.
 
Morne said:
You are not that dim. Think back to the 4 forces acting on a plane in flight...now increase weight...what happens? Over gross you will climb slower and have a lower ceiling than book.

I am not recommending it by any means, just pointing out that 1 lb over gross is not an instant death ray.

What is more likely to crash your plane? Sluggish climb or fuel exhaustion? Get gas...unless you are on fire...
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Being overgross isn't immediately an issue. If you're trying to take off on a 1,000' runway and really need 1,500, that will get you. That would be the same as taking off with a high density altitude and not enough runway.
Both can be done but that's the reason for W&B. So you know!
 
Estimate, ask or weigh depending on the situation. Precision is not normally required. The weight of the fuel is a variable based on temperature, usually 6 pounds per gallon is conservative. I doubt the empty weight of most airplanes is known within 50 to 100 pounds, particularly if it has been modified since new. In fact, many manufacturers don't even weigh each aircraft at the factory. Don't forget all that junk you carry in the airplane that is not part of the empty weight, such as your portable GPS, cameras, portable computers and iPads, manuals, headsets, extra oil, the tow bar, tools, etc. Everybody's weight will vary throughout the day and will depend on their choice of clothes. I have found that men have been more of a weight issue than most women although woman can be carrying a lot of extra weight in their accessories such as their purse. I have been asked to carry my wife's purse in the past and now know why her shoulder hurts so often.

My point of all this is that the weight and balance is an estimate and rarely equals exactly what the combination of aircraft, passengers, baggage and fuel weigh, so small errors should not be a safety hazard. Do the weight and balance, and if you are within calculated limits, you are good to go. If you have to fly with a lower fuel load, 5 or 10 gallons difference should not put the flight at risk for running out of fuel or you have cut things too close in my opinion. PS, don't forget to take advantage of the fuel burned on the ramp prior to takeoff.
 
silver-eagle said:
Being overgross isn't immediately an issue. If you're trying to take off on a 1,000' runway and really need 1,500, that will get you. That would be the same as taking off with a high density altitude and not enough runway.
Both can be done but that's the reason for W&B. So you know!
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The weight is important, but an accurate CG is more important, in my opinion.
 
Jeanie said:
Rant on:
Ok, I am thinking that women who won't own up to their weight for the purposes of loading an aircraft are vacuous, superficial, silly and not worth the time to haul anywhere.
Rant off.

Are vacuous and superficial synonyms?
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Some times they are pax though, gotta deal with it. This IS where dork bars and Ice Cream Suits earn their embarrassment. "Gotta know, we charge by the pound"... They can't hit you if you have dork bars on no matter what.
 
Has anyone actually had a bad experience asking someone their weight or is it just embarrassment and queasiness about the subject on the part of the asker?
 
I accepted a friend's word for it once. The climb out when I picked her up was scary slow. We had only my flight bag and two folding bicycles, plus full tanks (this was a 172S).

She is even bigger now and continues to give her weight in the same range as then. I have not offered to take her anywhere since I bought my airplane.
 
Shortly after my checkride, I went to the FBO with two adult passengers and my 5 y.o. son. One adult was probably 170ish and the other was my wife's aunt, a heavier set woman, maybe 250lbs. I'm around (cough) 200.

Before I flew, I asked my wife, an RN who weighs patients all the time, to estimate her aunt's weight.

I knew all of this in advance and ran the numbers with fuel at tabs and full fuel (Piper Warrior). I had asked for the plane to be left at tabs when I made the reservation but they fully fueled it. I ran the numbers one more time to be sure, and it was near max gross but not over.

So I loaded everyone in the plane and was starting my pre-start checklist when the FBO's chief pilot and my checkride examiner came out to the plane. She asked if I was over weight and if I'd checked the W&B. I told her I had, we were under max gross, the weather was cool and the runway was long. I was kinda peeved at first but I guess I can understand that she didn't want a new pilot (that she'd passed) auguring in with 3 pax. (We didn't).

Anyway, here's a photo that some random guy took after that flight...just as I was flaring for a landing.

warrior.jpg
 
Everskyward said:
Has anyone actually had a bad experience asking someone their weight or is it just embarrassment and queasiness about the subject on the part of the asker?
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My cousin is in shape. Round is a shape. Taking off from a short(ish) strip with trees and a hill in front of us was memorable.
 
steingar said:
My cousin is in shape. Round is a shape. Taking off from a short(ish) strip with trees and a hill in front of us was memorable.
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That's not what I meant. I was wondering if anyone has been read the riot act after asking someone their weight.
 
Everskyward said:
That's not what I meant. I was wondering if anyone has been read the riot act after asking someone their weight.
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I simply don't let it get to that point... Everyone that I take flying, I know in advance... if they are heavy , they don't get asked.. :nonod::nonod::wink2:
 
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Gee, how hard can it be? Grab your form and a pencil. Ask people for their weight with clothes on. Ask for weight of their bags. Do the math. Make the decision.
 
Jack Spectre said:
Shortly after my checkride, I went to the FBO with two adult passengers and my 5 y.o. son. One adult was probably 170ish and the other was my wife's aunt, a heavier set woman, maybe 250lbs. I'm around (cough) 200.
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In the warriors that I fly, you would be 200-300lbs under gross there..
 
TMetzinger said:
The weight is important, but an accurate CG is more important, in my opinion.
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One of the reasons for doing the weight and balance is CG; another is gross weight. You have to start somewhere. Without knowing the weight, you can't find the CG.
But then, you knew that.
 
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