Helpful Hints on Airplane Purchase

[fiveoboy01]

Priority is airframe condition, corrosion is ungodly expensive, takes forever to fix, and often leaves planes as salvage. Any airframe money spent is money down the tubes with a chaser of resale value. Engine overhaul money on the other hand is nearly perfectly prorated down to core value at 75% TBO. The greatest value comes buying at 75% TBO with a solid running, clean oil analysis, core value engine, and then running it until the oil analysis or other indicators say you are about to lose your core value, then you overhaul it. The hours you flew the engine in between were 'free'. In a 182 or a Dakota, it would not be rare at all to see a 'free' 1000 hours, a 172, Archer, or Warrior, there are plenty of examples of 2000 free hours.

I didn't say the engine was the only priority.

Your numbers make sense, but that all goes out the window when something unexpected happens. Opening a mid time engine can be a big can of worms.

If I could do it again, I'd buy the plane that had the 0 SMOH engine.

 

[Henning]

I didn't say the engine was the only priority.

Your numbers make sense, but that all goes out the window when something unexpected happens. Opening a mid time engine can be a big can of worms.

If I could do it again, I'd buy the plane that had the 0 SMOH engine.

Look at the real failure statistics, the highest risk time operating the engine is the first 100 hrs, by 200 hrs the infant mortality line flattens and runs that way past TBO. The real indicator is how old the engine is per hour, around 100hrs a year use or more minimizes the risk of expensive pre TBO issues, less than 25 hrs a year is a warning, and stretches of years unused is almost always a death knell even on a low time engine unless it was in the desert or properly preserved, and even then you may have dry seal issues to address.

Buying a used plane with no warranty is a gamble like any other. There are many systems, and any of them have the potential to pay or to fail on any given deal, but the smart gambler plays the odds.

 

[James331]

I still don't understand the affinity for that plane. There are a few people who can make use of its beneficial properties, while everyone is squeezed into that tiny cabin. Unless you need to get the maximum load of in the minum distance on tundra tires, there are better choices than a 185. Not to mention if you do full power take offs you become pariah at many airports for your noise foot print.

If I want a piston Cessna on floats or a runway, I want a 206.

Bah, 185s rock.

Great speed on tiny tires.

Great utility on big tundras

Great utility on skis

On floats or amphibs.

Good IFR platform and load hauling, and it has manual flaps.

And it's a tail wheel, many folks (myself included) won't own a trike.

They also hold their value rather well, especially a factory seaplane.

This is within your budget, and will do every thing you want better than any other suggested here.

http://www.trade-a-plane.com/detail/2086343.html

The panel is lacking for a 185, I'd want to see a GNS430 and so type of autopilot, I'd also ideally want to see a HSI.

 

[Fearless Tower]

If I could do it again, I'd buy the plane that had the 0 SMOH engine.

That isn't a bad idea IF you happen to know/like the shop that did the overhaul.

All things being equal, I'd prefer to find a very well maintained airframe with the panel I want and timed out engines (priced accordingly) and then send the engines to the shop of my choice.

 

[James331]

That isn't a bad idea IF you happen to know/like the shop that did the overhaul.

All things being equal, I'd prefer to find a very well maintained airframe with the panel I want and timed out engines (priced accordingly) and then send the engines to the shop of my choice.

I'd prefer a nicely overhauled engine with 300ish hours on it. Let someone else take the $$ hit and low hour failure risk

 

[Henning]

Bah, 185s rock.

Great speed on tiny tires.

Great utility on big tundras

Great utility on skis

On floats or amphibs.

Good IFR platform and load hauling, and it has manual flaps.

And it's a tail wheel, many folks (myself included) won't own a trike.

They also hold their value rather well, especially a factory seaplane.





The panel is lacking for a 185, I'd want to see a GNS430 and so type of autopilot, I'd also ideally want to see a HSI.

And still the passenger space is that of a 172...

 

[Fearless Tower]

I'd prefer a nicely overhauled engine with 300ish hours on it. Let someone else take the $$ hit and low hour failure risk

There's pros and cons to both.

 

[Rick Wallace]

I have had both a da20 and da40 and i love them both. The da40 is just a little more well rounded. I can agree on the seats not being great, but i just did 4 hours of hard windy imc and it didnt really bother me.

I love the stick. Your arm rest in your lap and just touch it with your finger tips or rudder pedals to keep it straight. Its a really fun plane to fly.

I will get 140 knots ground speed if i am 7000-9000'. Heck i would get 135 knots ground speed on my da20 with the mt prop on 7gph

I like both cirrus and diamond bc you are not flying 1960s aerodynamics, but if you dump any money into avionics witb a cirrus i dont know how much of it you will get back.

 

[asicer]

I love the stick. Your arm rest in your lap and just touch it with your finger tips or rudder pedals to keep it straight.

Can you fly it with your knees?

 

[Fearless Tower]

I like both cirrus and diamond bc you are not flying 1960s aerodynamics,

I fly 1930s aerodynamics.....and love every minute of it!

 

[coloradobluesky]

The only negative about a DA40 Diamond is it wont really fit in a 40' wide hangar door. And around here, thats what there are, mostly, not all.

 

[Blueangel]

My top picks would be a nicely updated Beechcraft Bonanza F33 or Socata TB21 in your budget as they look great, fun to fly, super comfortable and good useful load. That's what I'm planning to get as soon as my local buyer agent finds the right one for me.

Scott

 

[fiveoboy01]

That isn't a bad idea IF you happen to know/like the shop that did the overhaul.

All things being equal, I'd prefer to find a very well maintained airframe with the panel I want and timed out engines (priced accordingly) and then send the engines to the shop of my choice.

The airplane in question had a Poplar Grove overhaul.

I elected to go for 850 SMOH with a little bit better panel, paint and interior, the other airplane didn't have much of an autopilot either.

I knew it would need engine work sometime, just didn't think it would be 100 hours after I bought it. The crack in the case is nobody's fault, but a lot of rejected parts on the inside, once torn down... well... As Henning said, there's risk there and sometimes you get unlucky.

Either the new engine or as you said, get one that's run out as you get the price discount for that.

It's what it is. Lesson learned

 

[bluerooster]

Look at the real failure statistics, the highest risk time operating the engine is the first 100 hrs, by 200 hrs the infant mortality line flattens and runs that way past TBO. The real indicator is how old the engine is per hour, around 100hrs a year use or more minimizes the risk of expensive pre TBO issues, less than 25 hrs a year is a warning, and stretches of years unused is almost always a death knell even on a low time engine unless it was in the desert or properly preserved, and even then you may have dry seal issues to address.

Buying a used plane with no warranty is a gamble like any other. There are many systems, and any of them have the potential to pay or to fail on any given deal, but the smart gambler plays the odds.

^ This. The reason I'm buying the airplane I'm buying is due to engine SMOH times, and who did the OH.
I elected to buy the ugly duckling with 500smoh over 5 years, OH'd by a reputable shop, over the swan, with 25smoh, in 2 years, OH'd by the seller (non A&P).
25 SMOH kinda gives me the heebie jeebies, then add to it owner performed. I know it's perfectly legal, "under the supervision...." But still.

 

[txflyer]

$150K or less should get you a 182RG if you don't mind the added retract costs.

Then you're giving Bo's and Mooney's a run for their money and you have payload.

Later if you swapped in an IO-550 it would be a Bo smoker.

 

[Henning]

$150K or less should get you a 182RG if you don't mind the added retract costs.

Then you're giving Bo's and Mooney's a run for their money and you have payload.

Later if you swapped in an IO-550 it would be a Bo smoker.

The thing I don't understand about the 182RG is why it sells? Costs pretty much the same to buy and operate as a 210, and you get less performance and wing struts. By the time you swap a 550 into it, you've got near twice in it what you can have a nice 210 with a bigger cabin and better performance.