Have You Ever Paid Anyone to Interview them for a Job?

[guzziguy]

Your statement that I was responding to was that a CFI is not paid for his time, but for the instruction provided. And I disagree. In my example you responded to, there was 1.5 hours of instruction, and 0.5 of standing around doing nothing. During that time, in that scenario, I would not be providing instruction. However, I would expect to be paid for my time, since you are the one using my time. Notice I'm not talking about me showing up and chatting with the girl at the FBO desk when I should be with you. I'm talking about doing nothing because you didn't get there ahead of time and get things ready so that we can start when I arrive. That's it. No instruction, but I'm there at your request, available for you, so I'm charging. NOT necessarily related to the OP's scenario.

Yes, I understand that and agree with you completely. I deal with this very scenario twice a week with my CFII. He charges me for the full time of his being present with me during my lesson: unpacking the plane (removing covers, etc.), flight planning, the flight itself and then putting the covers back on again and the debrief afterwards. I have no issue paying the CFII for his time with me, even when not actively "instructing" because the whole purpose of him being there was attached to the lesson itself.
Granted, not all CFI's will charge you for all the non-instruction time, some do. And that's fine. We all have bills to pay.
So, I suspect you and I agree here.
However, the OP's experience was not tied to 'instruction' per se. And in that, there is the distinction.

 

[Larry in TN]

Another factor is the rate charged for ground time.

When I was actively teaching ten years ago, the school was billing $50/hr for me as a 'senior' instructor which was $10/hr more than most of the school's instructors. That rate applied to both flight and ground time. Other schools may have a lower ground instruction hourly rate. I tended to charge somewhat less time for ground time than the actual time spent because of this. If we were billing at a reduced rate for the ground time I likely would have billed a higher percentage of my ground time.

Bottom line was that I wanted the student to feel that he was getting his money's worth for what he spent for my time. Over the long-term, I'd make more money by having students who were happy with the value they were receiving and continued with me through the completion of their training than I would by maximizing the amount billed on each lesson.

 

[HighCountry]

As an update, I now have more than three hours check ride prep, so all bullet item requirements are met. I’m pretty constantly studying material for the oral and flying when I can.

Just wanted to say best wishes on getting it done! Also you made the right choice walking away from that instructor. Glad you found one you're compatible with.

 

[MBDiagMan]

Of course, it’s always something. I’ now trying to get weather to get to an appt at the avionics shop. Once pitostatic check and NAV1 is fixed, the plane is checkride ready.

I will keep flying and practicing when I can and fly with the instructor once the NAV is fixed.

I have never been confident that I would make it but I finally am at that point.

 

[denverpilot]

Reading the story I smell a CFII who did NOT check someone’s logs and got burnt by it. Now they’re overreacting.

Ever think about that possibility?

Still, a number of communication problems. Both ways. That the CFI ultimately needed to rectify.

Be curious whether you’ve been able to give them this feedback afterward too.

I can imagine a scenario where he hands you a refund — and I understand you paid and didn’t want to rock the boat — but the CFI needs that feedback to learn they need to be VERY clear where “talking” stops and “instruction” starts whether they think there’s a question or not.

Anyway ... interesting story. Definitely not how I would have done that but I can think of some reasons it may have ended up going that sideways.

The FAA doesn’t teach customer service skills or test them on the CFI ride. That’s for sure.

 

[Larry in TN]

Reading the story I smell a CFII who did NOT check someone’s logs and got burnt by it. Now they’re overreacting.

He said that this instructor got his CFII "not long ago". That led me to suspect that the thoroughness might be due to IFR training being relatively new to him. He may not have signed anyone off for an IR checkride yet.

I never charged my students, or prospective students, for the time I spent brushing up on something when I needed to do that in order to be prepared for their training.

 

[MBDiagMan]

Reading the story I smell a CFII who did NOT check someone’s logs and got burnt by it. Now they’re overreacting.

Ever think about that possibility?

Still, a number of communication problems. Both ways. That the CFI ultimately needed to rectify.

Be curious whether you’ve been able to give them this feedback afterward too.

I can imagine a scenario where he hands you a refund — and I understand you paid and didn’t want to rock the boat — but the CFI needs that feedback to learn they need to be VERY clear where “talking” stops and “instruction” starts whether they think there’s a question or not.

Anyway ... interesting story. Definitely not how I would have done that but I can think of some reasons it may have ended up going that sideways.

The FAA doesn’t teach customer service skills or test them on the CFI ride. That’s for sure.

If the correct time and situation presents itself I will indeed give him the feedback if given an opportunity to do it in a respectful way. It’s one of those things that should be discussed at the right time under the right circumstances.

He has done other types of flight instruction for a long time, but things like pilot checkouts, BFR’s and the like for pilots within the organization he worked for many years. He has zero customer relation experience. I factored that in when I dealt with this.

I don’t like to be indirectly accused of lying or ignorance which is what happened. He is a good person. He just has limited skills dealing with customers. I think maybe his background as well as how one of his associates deals with customers does not take into account that they are being paid by the student. Their instruction experience has been from a perspective of the student being subservient to them thus subject to their orders.