Go/No go decisions

Dave Siciliano

Dave Siciliano

Final Approach
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Feb 27, 2005
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Dave Siciliano
Just wanted to discuss what happened to us last weekend when we went through another go/no go decision. I was at Rocky Mountain Regional (BJC) with some friends skiing. We were scheduled to fly home to Addison (KADS) Sunday afternoon, but canceled when a large frontal system moved in. The METAR I saved is below.

KBJC 021851Z 01024G34KT 3/4SM SN BLSN VV004 M03/M04 A2995 We were flying a 58P which is a K-ice aircraft. I couldn’t save a lot of the weather info as I didn’t have an interned connection. While, it looked as if we might be able to depart, options for coming back to the airport would be a challenge (if we needed to return). When doing the planning that morning, we saw a major low coming our way; we would be just in front of it at planned departure time. No current PIREPS were available when we were making our decision. We didn’t know if we could climb up and get on top without encountering icing conditions. A frontal system with the low behind it was in front of us; so, if we did launch, we would fly into the large frontal system from the back side. OTOH, if we didn’t launch, that system was headed to our home airport at Addison (KADS) and it would be late the next day before we could fly in far enough behind it for the bad weather to be manageable.In any case, we decided to cancel, go skiing another day and fly in behind the frontal system on Monday. When we did depart on Monday, we had issues with a turbo charger on the takeoff roll. While we did manage the issue in a manner that allowed us to fly home, all I could think of after we climbed up to FL190 is how glad I was we had waited. Managing the turbo issue while departing in conditions described above wouldn’t be my first choice of things to do on the way home <g>. I guess what was driven home to me (again) was to not plan based on everything going perfectly on the departure (or the climb or cruise and descent). Leave a little room for something that might take some extra attention.Best,Dave
 
I bet it just broke your heart that you HAD to ski one more day.

Dan
 
I always enjoy reading the go/no-go writeups from the pilots on the board, whether they have more or less experience than I (most of you have more!!). Good learning discussions. Thanks for sharing, Dave.

How did the turbo issue manifest itself on takeoff? Was it an EGT or TIT indication? Since TIT is before the turbo, I don't think you'd see it there. Does the Baron take the EGT after the turbo?
 
When advancing the throttles on the takeoff roll, both MP gauges showed the same indication up to 30”, from 30 up, the right continued to advance normally, the left lagged, which cause the plane to yaw to the left. Just as I was about to retard the throttles, the left jumped up and the plane straightened out; I continued the departure. This airport’s elevation is just above 5,000 feet. OAT was 40F. Reflecting back, I would say the left MP lagged about 1 to 2 seconds, then, advanced to 38” for the takeoff. The takeoff was with mixtures full rich, full rpm and MP. RPM was 2700, fuel flow just above 30 per side when this problem occurred.

In the climb, with RPM at 2500, mixtures full rich, the left MP stayed about 38” while the right was over 39.

We leveled off at FL190 and took these readings: 2300 RPM; MP fully advances resulted in left MP 32”; right 38”; mixtures full rich: left 29.6 gph; right 29 gph. We had the same problem when we pulled the mixtures back to cruise LOP. 2300 rpm; left MP 34” right 38” with fuel flows of left and right 16.6.

Best,


Dave
 
Dave, was another day of skiing that tough of a no go decision :rolleyes:. Thanks for the write up. Hope the turbo problem is a minor one.
 
TangoWhiskey said:
I always enjoy reading the go/no-go writeups from the pilots on the board, whether they have more or less experience than I (most of you have more!!). Good learning discussions. Thanks for sharing, Dave.
Click to expand...

I second that motion.

I think I would have done the same - that limited vis and VV would give me pause. I think the turbo was acting up on purpose, just to make sure you learned the lesson!
 
At least in a twin, you can, in some sense, worry about a takeoff alternate, but, I agree with the others: It sounds like your no go decision.

My question is: would you have made the same decision if you had been in somewhere miserable, like Bakersfield, CA. I would like to think that I would not, but . . .

~ Christopher
 
Over the years, I've pretty well decided not to depart from somewhere if I can't come back and land (if not at the departure airport, at another close by airport). The ILS to this runway was to 29L. The winds were not down that runway. The ceiling may or may not have let me come back. Vis was close to minimums. I don't think it would have mattered from where I was departing.

Another factor I consider is just the number of challenges. Each individual issue may be dealt with, but, at some point there are too many issues. The above factor coupled with the fact I would have to get on top of the system while climbing through possible icing conditions sealed the deal for me.

In a single, or non-K-ice aircraft, I would have quit the decision process much earlier <g>

Best,

Dave
 
Dave, that's a great write-up on your go/no go decision. Definitely sounds like the prudent decision was made, as well.
 
There is absolutely nothing to second-guess there, but then again, my policy is that when you decide to scrub, there is no second-guessing.

I also agree with the "don't launch where you can't land" theory; when I launch at ADS in relatively low conditions, I always have DAL's ILS 13L dialed in on one NAV and the plate out. If I need it, it's close, easy, minimal vectoring and it ends at a big runway.
 
I remember the first cheif pilot that I flew with at a charter company. He was an older gentleman with a lot of experience flying. I remember him saying, "Bradford when you decide to go or not...you make a decision based on facts and experience. Then you act. Then you forget about it. Dont try and wonder what if." Sounds like you did just that. Cudos!
 
You ABSOLUTELY made the right choice in my opinion! Sunday morning I rolled over and looked out the window at 5:30 am ... cold, dark, snowing, blowing ... min viz and ceiling ...

go/no go? Go. but only as far as the kitchen to make coffee.

couple of hours later ... weather is same/same ... go/no go? Go. But only as far as the wood pile to stoke up the fireplace. Didn't go any further than that all day long.

Glad you made it home safely.
 
Great writeup! You absolutely made the right decision.

Spike, I like your tip about having the nearby ILS approach plate out when launching into IFR conditions... I'll have to remember that and make use of it when I start going for my IR.
 
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