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Discussion in 'Hangar Talk' started by flhrci, Feb 21, 2021 at 4:17 PM.
And they do support our troops, the USO, and our first responders. ^
I think I've been there...might have been somewhere else.
I don't get over to greenville much, so my places are centered more south of Raleigh
Danny's in Cary
Stephenson's near McGee's Crossroads
Stubbs in Sanford
I think Wilbur's has gone down hill, it was great in the 80s, but it's still one of the oldest spots in NC.
Out west, Ralphs in Troutman is pretty good, Gary's in China Grove, Stamey's in Greensboro. But there are so many places out there, I think it's really hard to pick a winner.
It occurs to me - once we're through Covid, there is a weekend BBQ class in NC. I'm thinking a BBQ / POA meet up.
I am fond of Bert's barbecue, on 24th street; I assume Gary's still there (second generation owner, his dad started it on MLK long ago, but the original burned down). Oops, 24th St. location closed, victim of Covid. Still open on Far West:
3563 Far West Blvd
Austin, Texas 78731
The other Austin BBQ place I have found to be VERY good is Stiles Switch BBQ, 6610 N. Lamar. Consistently good, without the cult-wait of Franklin's (whose brisket I have found to be decent, but hardly worth any meaningful waiting).
Yup, To my mind a great barbecue joint is more than just the meat. it’s also the sides. Good barbecue and then baked beans out of a can, yeah not so much.
With all due respect, if barbecue is the focus then let’s try something other than Pik n pig. Nice place to visit and hang out and watch airplanes but...
Added to my list. Thanks!
One of the best BBQ stands was somewhere between Calvert and Reagan on State Highway 6 in Texas, a little south of Highway 14. I passed by that little place for a number of years, then one time in 1980 we decided to try it. It was not a sit down place, just order at the window and eat on the tailgate of the truck and parking was at risk next to the highway, sort of like an old fireworks stand.
We got sliced beef sandwiches, potato salad and pinto beans. And when we bit into those sandwiches we just rolled our eyes. After that every time I was close I would pull over and get at least 3 or 4 sandwiches. Last time I was through the area the highway had been widened and that little stand was gone, along with the huge live oak that it was under. I saw that truckers still pull over in that spot to.... check their tires....
Another place was near Elgin, TX. My dad took me there when I was about 9 or 10 years old. Old wood shack, sawdust floor and wood tables built out of 2X4 and plywood. All of it looked like it had been there a hundred years. No menu. Customers just walk in, sit at a table and the waitress (who was no spring chicken) would roll out a sheet of butcher paper on the table. They bring sliced brisket, sausage, potato salad and plop it on the paper. The pinto beans came in a paper bowl. You did have a choice of drinks, Dr Pepper or iced tea. Desert was usually black berry pie which was called dewberry where I grew up. I only ate there maybe a dozen times over the years, but I have great memories of that place. By '79 or '80 it was gone.
Chain BBQ joints.?? No thanks.
Last time I checked I was informed Wilbur’s had closed. Not verified though...
Gawd I hope you're kidding.
OK, ok, I don't judge.
Some people do that, and are good with it, and that's their perogative. I don't do them that way, and it isn't Q if it hasn't been smoked. Some people grill them, and it does give a different taste/texture, but that's not Q either.
I haven't been down that way recently. Website is still up and everything seems to indicate it's open.
The "bark" is half the point of BBQ ribs. I don't have a problem with using the boiling/slow-cooking as part of the process, but they have to end up getting exposed to woof-fired heat/smoke at some point.
The only contest I've judged that was outside the KC area was Pigfest in Lakeland, FL 2 years ago. That was interesting: It's a KCBS sanctioned contest, so I did expect the KC style version of all 4 meats: chicken, pork ribs, pork butt, and brisket. I was disappointed a couple times.
In a few of the entries, the pork butt was chopped like you would see in what would be called Carolina-style. That's perfectly OK for KCBS, there's no rule on how it's presented. Usually it's pulled either into fine pieces or into chunks and sometimes both, most times the money muscle is sliced and added in.
What got me though, and I had to score it pretty low, was a rib entry that had obviously been grilled. I can imagine this scenario: Someone does ribs for the family and friends, everyone likes it, he gets talked into entering a contest, then does ribs the only way he knows how. They did taste pretty good, but they weren't smoked and it threw off a lot of the profiles we judge on. Appearance (lowest weighted score): They appeared grilled vs smoked, so a low score. But they did actually look OK. They weren't burned, they had a good color, but they did have grill/sear marks that gave it away. Taste: No smoke flavor because they hadn't been smoked, so a low score. Tenderness (highest weighting): Because they had been grilled, they lacked the tenderness that a slow cooked rib would have. This can sometimes happen on a smoked slab of ribs when then end pieces get too hot and the teams forget to leave them out of the judge's samples.
The thing I did like about that contest was that there was a really wide variety of seasonings and even sauces that were part of the samples. In KC, we will see the same thing, every time. But even under KCBS standards, the regional differences were able come through.
As a longtime contest cook, a lot of times I can know ahead of time what to expect with the pork and brisket when I judge. I always check the wx before I show up to judge. Pork butts and briskets need to cook all night (unless you are using those drum smokers that burn pretty hot). And rain or cold winds can really mess up smokers and heat retention. The teams then have to crank up the heat and finish those entries in a hurry and it usually ends up overdone. Sometimes you can taste the raw charcoal flavor that you get when you add charcoal straight out of the bag instead of getting it started first (Note: lump charcoal is way more tolerant of that than something like Kingsford briquettes). Sometimes it's underdone, like that one brisket I nearly pulled my own teeth out when I was trying to tear off a bite. It never had a chance to get tender.
I could go on for hours on this, and now I'm hungry.
I have one close to me like that and the BBQ is really good. Cook it in the parking lost and take it inside to sell it. And the gas station directly across the street from it does the same thing.
One of the positives about Okie BBQ is that it seems to be a melting pot of sorts for Memphis/KC/TX styles. Not much of the Carolina stuff though, and I've only eaten at one North Carolina rib-house to reference against it anyway. There's always a few BBQ competitions around to see everyone's different take on it. You're definitely right on the charcoal, lump is the only way to go. Had a friend grill some burgers using Matchlight and the meat tasted like lighter fluid, lol.
I’ll use Kingsford as a base to get things started. Once the main coals ate going there isn’t much left of the Kingsford. There are “100% wood” briquettes out there and I’ve used them when I’ve run out of lump. Matchlight is right out, unless you are starting a fire pit or camp fire.
My own success to ribs lies in how it is packaged. If I'm doing two racks, I use the turkey roaster and prop the ribs on a couple Weber coal holders to keep them at an angle and out of the fat. This works nicely, as there is air space so there can be a little charring without drying them out. Otherwise, with only one rack, a tightly sealed foil wrap on a baking sheet (it will leak) yields pretty good results.
Hate to say it, but lately I've been rocking the cook in the bag pre seasoned spare ribs. Tiny slit in the plastic to vent steam, and five hours and 250 degrees later, they are awesome. Not as good as ribs smoked in a proper smoker, but good enough and a hell of a lot less work.
Being from the north, my access to good barbecue is limited. I ended up in Raleigh for work and asked the folks there to find me some authentic NC barbecue. They took me to a place called Ole Time Barbecue and it was some of the best I’ve ever had.
Have you heard of it? Is it good or am I just starving?
Whatever works for you is just fine.
Sam’s had pork butts for $1/lb the other day so I got one for the freezer. This weekend might be a little busy but weekend after next might work out. I should have bought 3. I can get 4 on my smoker but 3 works best. Our contest smoker can hold 32, but even my “go big or go home” mantra has limits.
I thought we weren't supposed to discuss religions here.
You can make good ribs in the oven. They won't have a wood smoke taste, and they're not barbecue, but they can still be good, especially if you want sauced ribs. We make St. Louis cut ribs in the oven, and they're one of my daughter's favorite foods, and a damn sight cheaper than the bacon wrapped prime filet that is one of her other favorite foods.
What makes for good barbecue? Simple, it tastes like it's been smoked. Most chain restaurant barbecue has no smoke flavor at all. However, I have found one limitation to smoky barbecue: It's my observation that most women and girls don't like it. The best barbecue I've had in Atlanta was at a place called Chef Pete's, who was from Louisiana. Every morning on my way into work, I'd see him outside tending to his smoker. It was in a shopping center, you went up to the place and it looked like an actual restaurant, sign on the door said, "You don't need teeth to eat Pete's meat". Every bit of barbecue served there was unquestionably smoky tasting, and the clientele was very disproportionately male. I brought some home once to share with a barbecue loving neighbor, he was impressed, my wife and daughters were not. We go out to dinner (carry out for now) once a week, and we rotate the pick among whomever's home these days, which for now is the two adults and daughter #2. We do have barbecue restaurants in the area, some are pretty well regarded. We never go to any of them, because I'm the only one who's interested, and the others will complain. I think it may be that women's taste buds are more sensitive than are men's, and strong smoky barbecue is too strong for their tastes. My other observation is that women enjoy eating more than men do. You know the old saying about "the way to a man's heart is through his stomach"? Nah, that's the way to a woman's heart. The way to a man's heart is a little farther down the anatomy.
About five years ago, there was a part of my daughters' spring break where my wife and both daughters were gone, it was just me and the dog. I'd been thinking about trying to make barbecue. I don't have a smoker, but I do have a gas grill with three burners, and that will work, but the end result won't be very smoky, because the amount of heat needed to get smoke makes the grill warmer than ideal and the outside of the meat (in my case, pork shoulder, or as it's called here, Boston butt) gets cooked relatively quickly, after which the meat doesn't absorb smoke. At my household, that's more of a feature than a bug as three quarters of the audience doesn't want smoky meat. I do go with a lot of rub, which is granulated garlic, onion powder, salt, pepper, and paprika. My goal here is to make something that tastes good without sauce. Five years on , I'm still experimenting, and one time last summer I got one that came out really well. It was a bit salty, but amazingly good. I'm having a little trouble reproducing it, but even those that aren't exactly right are still very good.
So that's my take on this.
You can get an ok smoke flavor on a gas grill. Use a smoke box or foil packet and use wood chunks instead of chips. Chips will burn up too quickly. Set it on a burner, then get it hot enough to start smoldering, and then turn that burner down low. Adjust the burners for indirect heat and put on the ribs or butt. Cook it in indirect heat until the wood is used up and then you can finish in the oven. Butts probably won’t ever finish in a gas grill but some folks have had good results with ribs all the way through.
I can get a five pound butt to finish in the gas grill, it's usually around 11 hours to 190 degrees. I do bring the temperature up a bit towards the end of the run, at which time the roast is foil wrapped. It's certainly not a contest winner, but we like it a lot, whereas my wife and daughters would rather not have barbecue from our local BBQ establishments.
Also, I've found they prefer pecan or apple wood in the smoke box. It gives a light, almost nutty flavor that goes well with the rub. I have two tricks for getting a little more smoke. I bought a piece of angle iron and cut it in two pieces. I use it to get the smoker box centered over the burner that's lit. The other thing I do is to load the water pan with ice so the temperature inside the grill stays lower while the smoke is happening.
Next time I'll try wood chunks.
I’m never sure how much gas I have. 11 hrs is probably too long for me.
On the BBQ circuit it’s generally considered that after 4 hrs the meat isn’t going to absorb much more smoke flavor. So after 4 hrs you could foil wrap it, move it into the oven, or not worry about adding more wood. I like apple and cherry for pork (butts and ribs).
The roast goes on around 7 or 7:30, and I wrap it around lunchtime, so that's about 4 or 4.5 hours unwrapped. With just the smoker box, the smoke's long gone anyway.
We have our grill plumbed into the natural gas, so no worries running out. We probably use it 100 times a year, I probably cook 40 dinners a year on it, plus my wife uses it to plank salmon for lunches. We probably cook bacon 30 times a year, always in a sheet pan on the grill. During the hot part of the summer it gets used three or four times a week. It's on our deck right outside of the kitchen, and it's at least as much of a part of the kitchen as is the oven.
Since I'm 100% WFH and my wife still has to go in, I cook four dinners a week, and having the grill sure helps add variety. I'm doing pork chops tomorrow night, and they always get grilled.
I went to the biggest hole in the wall BBQ place with @simtech, @Velocity173 and @ktup-flyer in Tullahoma, TN a couple of years ago called Highway 55 BBQ. Despite the appearance of the building, it was actually some good food - and cheap!
I’m sorry to report that it has since gone out of business, fellas. Apparently they moved to another location and renamed it.
That said, I may be a little biased, but I think we have some of the best BBQ here in Chattanooga. Rib & Loin is one of my favorites and their sauce is by far some of the best I’ve had. What do you think @Bill? I do need to sample some ‘Q’ from the Midwest one of these days...
I am sorry, but the words "red meat" and "healthy" don't belong in the same sentence, unless it goes something like "everybody with an IQ higher than their body temperature knows read meat definitely isn't healthy". Something like that.
I've only been there a couple of times and I thought it wasn't very good. What I had was dry and bordering on crunchy(!). I'm sure it was something weird the days I was there, might give it another try.
If you're back this way again, Clyde Coopers in downtown Raleigh is supposed to be very good too, but parking is bothersome downtown so we tend not to go down there. "The Pit" is a barbecue restaurant started by a famous local old-school pitmaster and later sold, but the restaurant got glamped up and the food suffered. Like I said, there are so many places that it's hard to pick a winner. There's a place in a little town south of me (Angier) that does a Texas level good brisket, but their pork is only so so.
For day to day when I just want something, I just to go to the Smithfield Bar-B-Q chain nearby and get a pint of barbecue. Even that is adequate, although they're absolutely having it made offsite and heating it up in the restaurant - no wood outside, no smoke, no smell.
But unhealthiness tastes so good!
Is life without barbecue or bacon worth the extra couple of years of being old.? I would say not. I am happy to have your portion.
"everybody"? I've got a few relatives in their late 90's on a steady diet of red meat that can serve as counterexamples.
Maybe it's because they eat their meat instead of reading it.
It reminds me of the joke about the guy who worked hard to be healthy - he ate kale every day, worked out to keep in shape and in fact, was incredibly healthy. Then he lived his last 30 years in an old folks home, finally realizing that all this extra life was the reward for his discipline and hard work all his life.
I'm in the barbecue and bacon camp.
oh, I've also lost about 40lbs in the past 2 years and my doctor says my blood chemistry is really good.
And for dessert, a BBQ Sundae!
BB's Lawnside BBQ in KC has live music indoors and outdoors (wx permitting).
I have no idea who you replied to but your response validated the contents of my ignore list
Bacon AND BBQ - it's the perfect combination.
Pork belly burnt ends are outstanding snacks - try them sometime. There are lots of recipes. I can't remember which ones I've used, but they are very similar to this one:
Fox Brothers barbecue here in Atlanta has them as a special on the menu every Saturday.
+1 for Rib & Loin. Stop by the Hixson store every time I visit my folks in CHA. BBQ is great and the banana pudding should be sold by the barrel. Also kind of miss Waycrazies, which used to also be available by boat at Shady Grove Marina ~ 20 years ago. So, maybe I just put it on the childhood memory pedestal.
Fox Brothers is great. Fat Matt's is pretty solid, too, but I live near Piedmont so maybe I'm just biased because its easier for us to get to.
Moved back south from upstate New York a couple of years ago - I used to have to make do with this upstate chain called Dinosaur BBQ. It was fine, not great, for the BBQ fix - any port in a storm, don't get me wrong, but it's great to be back south.
Rib &Loin is quite good, and I used to love going to Porkers down town back in the day, but they closed up years ago. Another long lost BBQ joint was Sportsman’s BBQ, great pulled pork sandwiches.
Glad Rib & Loin is still around, last of the old school places.
Sometimes it seems that anything enjoyable in life is unhealthy, illegal, immoral, or dangerous. The really fun stuff is "all the above."
I remember hearing about Porker’s, but I don’t recall ever going there. Too bad it went out!
I agree, their banana pudding is really good!