Fort Hood in Texas attacked

The Associated Press identified the deceased gunman as Maj. Malik Nadal Hasan. A defense official, speaking on condition of anonymity, said Hasan was a mental health professional -- an Army psychologist or psychiatrist. It was not known whether he was treating people at the base.

A major?
 
Geico266 said:
The Associated Press identified the deceased gunman as Maj. Malik Nadal Hasan. A defense official, speaking on condition of anonymity, said Hasan was a mental health professional -- an Army psychologist or psychiatrist. It was not known whether he was treating people at the base.

A major?
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And a mental health specialist.
 
Obi Heed Kenobi said:
I don't think anyone is immune....
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Do you have any sources to back that up? :rofl: (I'm kidding)

This is the only incident I can think of (without spending an hour Goggling) that involved an officer. Lt. William Calley comes to mind, but that was a massacre against civilians during war operations, and he was convicted (as a scapegoat) as giving the orders.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/My_Lai_Massacre
 
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Geico266 said:
Do you have any sources to back that up? :rofl: (I'm kidding)

This is the only incident I can think of (without spending an hour Googleing) that involved an officer. Lt. William Calley comes to mind, but that is debatable.
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The first one that comes to mind other than Calley is Dr. MacDonald who was a Green Beret Capt. When he murdered his wife and child.
 
People who go into the mental health profession are usually trying to sort out their own problems. My last girlfriend was an Air Force combat stress specialist. After the five years that I spent with her, I am convinced that it is a fact. She was a whole lot crazier than any of her patients, I am sure. She ended up in a funny farm herself, back in Pennsylvania. Very pretty, very crazy.

John
 
SkyHog said:
That name says it all, doesn't it?
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Why would we jump to that conclusion? Yes the guy didn't want to deploy, he wanted out. Why wouldn't we just let him back to civilian life and be done with it? I've seen no evidence to this point to prove any terror link or anything of that nature. Why don' we let the folks that do the investigating come up with the answers? Just sayin.
 
We'll see when he goes to trial for mass murder. He was captured, alive, though he had been reported as killed.

HR
 
I thought officers could simply resign their commission and walk away from it if they wanted? I was a grunt in my military years so I don't know all that much about it.

John
 
John Baker said:
I thought officers could simply resign their commission and walk away from it if they wanted? I was a grunt in my military years so I don't know all that much about it.

John
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It depends. He was a doctor and may have had a service commitment due to the Army funding his education.
 
EppyGA said:
Yes the guy didn't want to deploy, he wanted out. Why wouldn't we just let him back to civilian life and be done with it?
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That's not the way the military works. If he didn't want to deploy, he shouldn't have joined the Army.
 
SkyHog said:
That name says it all, doesn't it?
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I happen to agree. Anyone remembers a similar accident in 2003 in US base in Kuwait where Sgt. Hasan Akbar killed his fellow army soldiers (ultimately got death penalty)? There is a pattern here... even Hasan appears twice ...

Disagree? Fine, but spare me your PC BS.
 
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olasek said:
I happen to agree. Anyone remembers a similar accident in 2003 in US base in Kuwait where Sgt. Hasan Akbar killed his fellow army soldiers (ultimately got death penalty)? There is a pattern here... even Hasan appears twice ...

Disagree? Fine, but spare me your PC BS.
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Yep, a pattern. "John M. Russell" just fits right in there too. Oh, and let's not forget Alberto B. Martinez either. Obviously not 'murican with a name like that, sounds straight out of Palestine.

Or Armano Baca, Jared Lee Bottorff, and Jody Wirawan.

And then there was Michael Leonard Dorsett and Bradley P. Glover. Fortunately they didn't get a chance to complete their massacre. Allah be praised.
 
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John Baker said:
People who go into the mental health profession are usually trying to sort out their own problems. My last girlfriend was an Air Force combat stress specialist. After the five years that I spent with her, I am convinced that it is a fact. She was a whole lot crazier than any of her patients, I am sure. She ended up in a funny farm herself, back in Pennsylvania. Very pretty, very crazy.

John
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John,

I have found this to be true for many mental health professionals also. Not all, but many.
 
The guy's name is an interesting abstraction, but since there are thousands of soldiers, sailors and airmen in uniformed service and serving honorably, I think I'll just ignore it.

I wonder where Timothy McVeigh went to church?
 
SCCutler said:
I wonder where Timothy McVeigh went to church?
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Wiki said:
Throughout his childhood, he and his father were Roman Catholics and often attended daily Mass. In a recorded interview with Time magazine[14] McVeigh professed his belief in "a God", although he said he had "sort of lost touch with" Catholicism and "I never really picked it up, however I do maintain core beliefs." The Guardian reported that McVeigh wrote a letter to them claiming to be an agnostic.[15] McVeigh at one time said that he believed the universe was guided by natural law, energized by some universal higher power that showed each person right from wrong if they paid attention to what was going on inside them. He had also said, "Science is my religion."[16]
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It is all science's fault. I say we round up all the scientists!!! :mad2: :mad2: :mad2: :mad2:
 
It was intended to be an ironic joke, but I do have to wonder why Muslims (or Muslimish names) have caused so many problems lately.
 
SkyHog said:
It was intended to be an ironic joke, but I do have to wonder why Muslims (or Muslimish names) have caused so many problems lately.
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Nah, that's not it at all. Look for people with the middle name Wayne:


It only occurred to me in the early 1990s that "Wayne" was a popular middle name among a few of the most heinous murderers of our time, e.g., the clown John Wayne Gacy (who killed almost three dozen boys and young men in the late 1970s and buried most of them beneath the floorboards of his Des Plaines, Ill., home) and Elmer Wayne Henley (sentenced to six consecutive life terms in 1974 in Houston for his role, with ringleader Dean Allen Corll, in the murders of 27 young men). I began to publish periodic lists in 1996, and soon readers made sure I never missed a one that made the news.

http://www.newsoftheweird.com/wayne.html


Trapper John
 
If we decide that any one group must be the cause of all our problems, then allow it to become a nationally accepted truth, we can then be assured our country is in decline.

The biggest question that such thinking raises is, who is next?

John
 
John Baker said:
If we decide that any one group must be the cause of all our problems, then allow it to become a nationally accepted truth, we can then be assured our country is in decline.

The biggest question that such thinking raises is, who is next?

John
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Good post John!!


Something that seems to have been missed in this thread.

That is 13 people are dead.

These are people who had volunteered to serve their country. Let us remember that today the families of those 13 are now dealing with significant loss. Furthermore, that the 30+ who were wounded will now be starting what may be a long recovery process. While we search for the real answers as to why this occurred do not do a disservice to those that are suffering by creating hate.
 
John Baker said:
If we decide that any one group must be the cause of all our problems, then allow it to become a nationally accepted truth, we can then be assured our country is in decline.

The biggest question that such thinking raises is, who is next?

John
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+1000000
 
smigaldi said:
Good post John!!


Something that seems to have been missed in this thread.

That is 13 people are dead.

These are people who had volunteered to serve their country. Let us remember that today the families of those 13 are now dealing with significant loss. Furthermore, that the 30+ who were wounded will now be starting what may be a long recovery process. While we search for the real answers as to why this occurred do not do a disservice to those that are suffering by creating hate.
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I was with you up until the "creating hate" phrase.

While some comments in this thread were in poor taste, the only "hater" so far has been Major Nidal Malik Hasan, who shot unsuspecting, unarmed soldiers and civilians.

What motivated his rampage may never be known. But there may be a common thread that can not and should not be ignored by invesitigators due to sensitivity concerns.

Let the light shine where it needs to, no matter who or what is exposed.
 
dmccormack said:
What motivated his rampage may never be known. But there may be a common thread that can not and should not be ignored by invesitigators due to sensitivity concerns.
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No one is saying it should be ignored. But the condemnation of an entire people based on their religious beliefs is spreading hate. Some here have advocated that viewpoint.

As for the major, well, we do not know what his motivation to do this despicable thing was yet. I am not ready to say it was a crime of hate. He could have had some sort of mental break down, or perhaps got really frustrated with a new crew scheduling software package, or some other motivation.
 
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If someone can demonstrate the existence of a plot or conspiracy here in the US to commit such acts then shine the light. Otherwise you're just indulging in bigotry. Plenty of murders have been committed with Christian motives as well. Doesn't mean there is a cabal.
 
steingar said:
If someone can demonstrate the existence of a plot or conspiracy here in the US to commit such acts then shine the light. Otherwise you're just indulging in bigotry. Plenty of murders have been committed with Christian motives as well. Doesn't mean there is a cabal.
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I'm not an investigator.

My sincere hope is that the motivations are exposed.

We'll see.
 
Our country has been on the receiving end of "hate" for more than a few years, it was brought to our immediate attention on 9/11. Through our own shock and horror, we saw on television, millions of people in the middle east rejoicing at what happened to us.

Now we once again have what might be another attack on our own soil by a religious fanatic, or perhaps just someone who lost it and went out of control.

During all of our postulating and retaliatory strikes, our flag waving, and countless news stories, the one thing that seems of little interest to most people is "why" do these people hate us?

What are the things we have done that makes a whole section of the planet, the Middle East, hate us to the point of wanting to destroy us?

What have we done, what can we do to change these peoples perception of us?

Would we rather continue sending our troops over there to be maimed and killed for who knows how long? We are not allowed to actually win any wars over there, so we don't want to send more canon fodder it seems. Our Commander in Chief seems frozen with indecision, so we can not look to him for answers.

Fostering hate at home is for sure not a solution, undoing the hate over there would definitely be the solution. But how?

John
 
Originally Posted by thepetrostate
Too near Waco, that's the problem. :redface:


smigaldi said:
If you are going to make that comparision you should have noted that Ft. Hood is in Killean where the largest shooting massacre until VT had taken place. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luby's_massacre
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Perhaps but we have Hood, Waco, the UTexas tower shootings...it must be in the water. :eek:
 
John Baker said:
Our country has been on the receiving end of "hate" for more than a few years, it was brought to our immediate attention on 9/11. Through our own shock and horror, we saw on television, millions of people in the middle east rejoicing at what happened to us.

Now we once again have what might be another attack on our own soil by a religious fanatic, or perhaps just someone who lost it and went out of control.

During all of our postulating and retaliatory strikes, our flag waving, and countless news stories, the one thing that seems of little interest to most people is "why" do these people hate us?
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I'll assume that was a rhetorical question.

What are the things we have done that makes a whole section of the planet, the Middle East, hate us to the point of wanting to destroy us?

What have we done, what can we do to change these peoples perception of us?
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Assumption extended.

Would we rather continue sending our troops over there to be maimed and killed for who knows how long? We are not allowed to actually win any wars over there, so we don't want to send more canon fodder it seems. Our Commander in Chief seems frozen with indecision, so we can not look to him for answers.
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Or you could call it careful consideration before making a major decision.

YMMV.

Fostering hate at home is for sure not a solution, undoing the hate over there would definitely be the solution. But how?

John
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What took decades to accomplish will take decades to undo. :yesnod:
 
John Baker said:
People who go into the mental health profession are usually trying to sort out their own problems. My last girlfriend was an Air Force combat stress specialist. After the five years that I spent with her, I am convinced that it is a fact. She was a whole lot crazier than any of her patients, I am sure. She ended up in a funny farm herself, back in Pennsylvania. Very pretty, very crazy.

John
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Five years?

:eek:
 
John Baker said:
...

During all of our postulating and retaliatory strikes, our flag waving, and countless news stories, the one thing that seems of little interest to most people is "why" do these people hate us?

What are the things we have done that makes a whole section of the planet, the Middle East, hate us to the point of wanting to destroy us?

What have we done, what can we do to change these peoples perception of us?

....
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Those are excellent questions to ask.

But, it's an us-them world, and it's never us that's wrong.

I heard once that a true sign of intelligence is the knowledge that you might fail, that you might make mistakes, that you're fallible. The inverse of that is, of course, obvious.

Take Pearl Harbor. That's when WWII started for most Americans (and as I'm fond of saying, it only ended when John Elway threw the dinosaur that created Communism to China, but it was a swimming dinosaur and it came back to the US, so then John Elway harnessed it to a plow and carved out the Grand Canyon, and then the dinosaur learned its lesson and was on our side and was used to scare the Japanese into surrendering).

At any rate, there was a whole bunch of history that happened between about 1870 and 1941. When you look at that history, you'll find that the United States, while not actually being an aggressor, didn't exactly treat any country from Asia, including Japan, in a manner that could be called "decent", "fair", or "upstanding."

While that certainly didn't justify a war of aggression on the part of the Japanese, it also means that World War II, at least in the Pacific, wouldn't have happened.

So, as you so rightly suggest, it's a good idea to have a degree of introspection once in a while.

But, don't expect it to happen. "We're right and they're wrong" explains a good two-thirds of the human condition.


[edit:] I thought this was in Spin Zone. I got the threads mixed up. If this needs to be deleted, feel free to do so (I'd do it myself, but I figured it's right on the bubble of needing to go). Sorry....
 
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SkyHog said:
It was intended to be an ironic joke, but I do have to wonder why Muslims (or Muslimish names) have caused so many problems lately.
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Sand fleas. Everyone knows that. I'm surprised you don't. :blush:
 
thepetrostate said:
Five years?

:eek:
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"Very pretty" was the main reason, I met her through one of her old professors, a friend of mine. She lived with me for five years, I met her about a year earlier. At first, she was great, very intelligent, which made me wonder what she ever saw in me.

Her family had her committed when she went home for a visit. I never protested, that is exactly what she needed. I never saw her again, although I did receive one of those, "we aren't getting any younger" letters from her a few years ago. I ignored it and that seems to be the end of it.

John
 
Obi Heed Kenobi said:
it also means that World War II, at least in the Pacific, wouldn't have happened.
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I don't have much patience for such historical relativism and 'what ifs'. I heard similar claims that World War II in Europe would have never happened if only Poland was a bit 'nicer' and 'congenial' and allowed Hitler to build its corridor to Danzig (Gdansk), such a reasonable demand!. So in fact Poles were indirectly guilty of starting World War II. :mad3:
 
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