First annual....

gitmo234

gitmo234

Line Up and Wait
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gitmo234
I've heard horror stories of owners and their first annual. Mine just finished up and I was pleasantly surprised. No major issues.

I had the generator problem which I mentioned in another thread. It was diagnosed and being completely dead. It was barely producing and actually failed completely during testing of some sort. Also, I had noticed increased oil burn and he said the gasket around the generator was completely worn out and causing a sizeable oil leak. One screw in the starter had vibrated very very loose (almost out) and the other wasnt even hand-tight, so that was adjusted.

They had to treat the inside of the wings with corrosion-X, but I knew this was an issue. I was going to have it done at annual when I bought it. Other than that, compressions were all mid to very high 70s (lowest 75), and they had to make a couple minor adjustments to things (parking brake, etc).

All in all it took 3.5 days, and I'm awaiting a generator replacement until I decide how long i'm keeping it vs upgrading which will determine if I upgrade to an alternator.


Anyone have any big first annual horror or success stories? I was actually worried this was going to be nuts.
 
I've heard of guys taking a generator the the local shop and having it reworked for not much.
 
My first annuals usually went well,with no big surprises,but I have always had a thorough pre buy inspection.
 
I had a pretty good pre-buy as well. It identified the same corrosion issues I mentioned above. I still couldnt believe it though. I guess eventually I'll stop trying to find something wrong with it. I cant drop that feeling that I simply must have gotten ripped off somehow. A handful of A&Ps and many flight hours have said otherwise.
 
I read where Gustave Whitehead was actually the first person ever to get an annual.
 
A first annual has the potential to bring surprises when unknowns are involved both with regard to the plane and the A&P.
 
I had a friend who bought a $30K plane and had a $30K annual. Of course that included all the new parts and labor that was required. Another friend had a C-206 and had an annual that was even higher. My blown engines announced themselves between annuals or I could be right up there with them. Little will ruin your day like an unexpected $35K+ phone call from your mechanic.
 
Sort of interested in how that conversation takes place. I guess one benefit of the old O-300 is I'm under the $35k mark
 
"Uhh, there's a rod sticking through a big hole in your crankcase. It made lots of metal before it quit so the prop and governor are toast. No core value in the engine. The good news is it didn't crash. The bad new is it's pulled up on a sandbar on a glacial river a half hour's flight from here and the sun's shining so we know the river will come up. Gotta go move it before the bone pickers steal the radios or it washes away."

Good times.
 
Wow. Yeah that conversation only gets better if it ends with a "just kidding"
 
Worse case, it took 11 years, and near 100K to get it thru its first annual.
 

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My opinion is starting to change.

We're now pushing into the 3rd week without my airplane. A&P ordered a used generator, sees it needs brushes, sends it off, been 5 days and he should just be getting it back this afternoon, and tells me today the voltage regulator received wasnt good. So we have to get a new one of those.

Last week I was told I'd be flying by friday. I made business trip plans and other plans for the weekend and this week. Now I have to push everything for a chance it might be done tomorrow afternoon. Between overbooking at the mechanics shop, delay with the generator and not getting any priority work since I've been down so long, I'm really getting ****ed off.
 
gitmo234 said:
My opinion is starting to change.

We're now pushing into the 3rd week without my airplane. A&P ordered a used generator, sees it needs brushes, sends it off, been 5 days and he should just be getting it back this afternoon, and tells me today the voltage regulator received wasnt good. So we have to get a new one of those.

Last week I was told I'd be flying by friday. I made business trip plans and other plans for the weekend and this week. Now I have to push everything for a chance it might be done tomorrow afternoon. Between overbooking at the mechanics shop, delay with the generator and not getting any priority work since I've been down so long, I'm really getting ****ed off.
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The joys of owning old airplanes....
 
Tom-D said:
Worse case, it took 11 years, and near 100K to get it thru its first annual.
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Photoshoped. No oil in the pan. I have never seen a working radial engine that didn't leak. :D
 
Well, I feel better knowing its not entirely abnormal. I'm supposed to be meeting with an aviation group at fort eustis. At least there's some irony in not being able to meet with them due to mechanical issues
 
gitmo234 said:
My opinion is starting to change.

We're now pushing into the 3rd week without my airplane. A&P ordered a used generator, sees it needs brushes, sends it off, been 5 days and he should just be getting it back this afternoon, and tells me today the voltage regulator received wasnt good. So we have to get a new one of those.

I'm really getting ****ed off.
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Well, we told you to take your generator down to the local automotive electrical shop, tell them it is off of a Ford tractor and let them do a really first class overhaul for about a quarter of the cost of a "licensed shop". But you didn't listen. Too bad for you. Maybe next time.

Jim
 
Actually, that's more or less what happened but there were serious issues in the old one that made it more expensive to overhaul it and I got the used 30 amp one for $100.

Thanks for the assumptions
 
gitmo234 said:
Actually, that's more or less what happened but there were serious issues in the old one that made it more expensive to overhaul it and I got the used 30 amp one for $100.

Thanks for the assumptions
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You should visit a repair station trying to fly aircraft for a living. They spend thousands of dollars on expedite fees and overnight shipping.

Sometimes really stupid things happen like ordering two $15k parts incase one doesn't show up on time meaning one will have a huge restocking fee when the unused part is returned.

The opposite being they ordered only one special $100 bolt and it gets damaged on installation. To avoid delay they order another $100 bolt counter-to-counter shipping ($200+) when they could have order two $100 bolts and paid a very small restocking fee to return it.

Or they pay a $1k expedite fee for one part to make delivery day, then a completely unrelated box fails on the outgoing runs and they delay several days to avoid expensive shipping & expedite fees on the replacement.
 
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Yeah, I get that and its a pain. I was responding to weirdjim in my last post, because exactly what he said I should've done and that I didn't listen, was exactly what happened. Rather than ask, we'll just assume. The insides were damaged/worn enough that it wasn't cost effective, but was able to get a better generator (slightly used) for less than the overhaul would have cost anyway.

I'm just getting frustrated because every other day I'm hearing "should be ready tomorrow", and making plans for both work and personal life on that only to hear there's been no progress and one of the reasons I'm told it cant be done today is "we got so much work in right now". I would think that since I've been on the roster going on 3 weeks, I would take priority over work that came in yesterday.
 
gitmo234 said:
Yeah, I get that and its a pain. I was responding to weirdjim in my last post, because exactly what he said I should've done and that I didn't listen, was exactly what happened. Rather than ask, we'll just assume. The insides were damaged/worn enough that it wasn't cost effective, but was able to get a better generator (slightly used) for less than the overhaul would have cost anyway.

I'm just getting frustrated because every other day I'm hearing "should be ready tomorrow", and making plans for both work and personal life on that only to hear there's been no progress and one of the reasons I'm told it cant be done today is "we got so much work in right now". I would think that since I've been on the roster going on 3 weeks, I would take priority over work that came in yesterday.
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could use "call me when its done" :lol:
 
Well unfortunately, I really need it done. I have vacation plans, I fly for meetings at work... all in all about 4 trips, two of which are personal, that I've had to push off a time or two.

Next attempt at work travel is Friday. We shall see
 
gitmo234 said:
Actually, that's more or less what happened but there were serious issues in the old one that made it more expensive to overhaul it and I got the used 30 amp one for $100.
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Yeah, but the used 30 amp one needed brushes (you said). Now was it that much of a bargain? And did you really take the old one down to the local automotive electric shop to ask the cost of overhaul? And did the overhaul include new bearings and a commutator cleanup like the used one doesn't have?'

Lots of tradeoffs for "saving money".

Jim
 
I couldn't see what type of airplane this is but I had a 1966 C172G that was born with a 35-amp (IIRC) generator. After having multiple in-flight electrical failures I upgraded to a 60-amp alternator (as was installed in the 1967 C172s with the same engine) and never looked back. I did that in 1997 and there is even more electrical demand in aircraft now. Those little generators don't cut it.
 
weirdjim said:
Yeah, but the used 30 amp one needed brushes (you said). Now was it that much of a bargain? And did you really take the old one down to the local automotive electric shop to ask the cost of overhaul? And did the overhaul include new bearings and a commutator cleanup like the used one doesn't have?'

Lots of tradeoffs for "saving money".

Jim
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Once again, as I said twice before, the old one was beyond repair. It made its way to a generator shop and short of ripping everything out and just reusing the case, it was bad.

Rumor has it the used one is there now because my shop said they would just replace the brushes on their own then got too booked up.
 
petrolero said:
I couldn't see what type of airplane this is but I had a 1966 C172G that was born with a 35-amp (IIRC) generator. After having multiple in-flight electrical failures I upgraded to a 60-amp alternator (as was installed in the 1967 C172s with the same engine) and never looked back. I did that in 1997 and there is even more electrical demand in aircraft now. Those little generators don't cut it.
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I'm looking at that, depending on how quick my wife demands I sell for an upgrade. Im basically going to list it at a higher price and wait, not in a hurry to sell it at all, and if it sells, it sells. If not I'll throw in an alternator and eventually lower the price a notch or two
 
DFH65 said:
Photoshoped. No oil in the pan. I have never seen a working radial engine that didn't leak. :D
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You are but a newby, warners never leak.
 
gitmo234 said:
Once again, as I said twice before, the old one was beyond repair. It made its way to a generator shop and short of ripping everything out and just reusing the case, it was bad.

Rumor has it the used one is there now because my shop said they would just replace the brushes on their own then got too booked up.
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Um, a rebuild shop will often only reuse the case. Everything inside goes away, replaced with new.

My alternator was done by our local shop in Corpus Christi. They do a dozen a day, have for over 80 years. Yes, it cost more than a new one, but my alternator is a weird size, and I could not find the damned thing anywhere in the U.S.

+2 on the Zeftronics VR.
 
gitmo234 said:
Once again, as I said twice before, the old one was beyond repair. It made its way to a generator shop and short of ripping everything out and just reusing the case, it was bad.

Rumor has it the used one is there now because my shop said they would just replace the brushes on their own then got too booked up.
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Aaaargh. "Your shop" is your A&P shop, yes? Your local auto electric shop could have rebrushed that sucker in 15 minutes flat while you waited.

You said it made its way to a "generator shop". Describe what kind of a shop, please.

Jim
 
Well, she's all wrapped up. I called yesterday and was told the gasket and voltage regulator were on an overnight express order and out for delivery and it would be done today by noon.

Stopped by today after work in the overcast with passing showers weather, did a pretty good inspection and took her on two laps in the pattern.

The damn thing felt impossible to keep on the ground. I know not much was done that would alter the power and it was probably just because I havent flown in awhile but it felt like new.

The new generator and voltage regulator make a huge difference. No draw on power when I turn on the landing light, etc.

I was a bit upset the gasket and VR wasnt ordered until 2 days ago, since we knew that was needed awhile back, but I am very pleased with the results. Just in time to fly to a meeting tomorrow in Newport News VA, saving me 6-8 hours in traffic.
 
FORANE said:
A first annual has the potential to bring surprises when unknowns are involved both with regard to the plane and the A&P.
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If you had a bad prebuy, or damaged the aircraft, yes.

I've never had a huge first annual, I've met a few scammer APs, but if you stick to honest knowledgable mechanics, get involved in your own mx, order your own parts, know your aircraft, you shouldn't have surprises
 
James331 said:
If you had a bad prebuy, or damaged the aircraft, yes.

I've never had a huge first annual, I've met a few scammer APs, but if you stick to honest knowledgable mechanics, get involved in your own mx, order your own parts, know your aircraft, you shouldn't have surprises
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So for the most part, I'm not seeing much different that wasnt in the prebuy here so I think mine was pretty good. Some things you just cant find. Not implying you were saying I could though, just stressing that I think my pre-buy was good and sometimes stuff happens. In fact, there were no surprises based on the prebuy. So for me it was $500 (from what I remember) well spent.

I do have someone who could make it easier potentially. BTW my wife loves it when I send her this picture when she sends me random questions via text message
 

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