Do FBOs charge multiple landing fees?

Discussion in 'Flight Following' started by DMD3., Jul 10, 2018.

  1. DMD3.

    DMD3. Pre-takeoff checklist

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    Im planning to fly to KJAX for the weekend. I'll land there Friday and leave out Sunday. During my stay there, if I takeoff and then land again, would I get charged another landing fee? I'll be parking at Sheltair. Sig's overnight fees are outrageous ($33 a night vs. $12 a night for a C150).

    Saturday I hope to take someone up.
     
  2. Tarheelpilot

    Tarheelpilot En-Route

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    Some do. Most don’t. Have to ask the FBO in question.
     
  3. Clip4

    Clip4 En-Route

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    You are using three terms, Landing fee, overnight fee and ramp fee. A landing fee is charged by the airport for each time you land. A ramp fee is charged by the FBO for the stop and a tie down fee is for overnight.

    It is common for aircraft to arrive at an FBO and be used for serveral days or weeks from that location.

    A ramp fee is not charged multiple times a day and usually not charged for multiple days because the aircraft is generally buying fuel and paying the down or hangar charges.

    Most FBOs will have the customer put a credit card on file for fuel and other fees and you settle up when you leave.

    If you are uncertain, call the FBO and ask. Every business does not have the same policies. Also if you are going to any descent FBO for several days, you will be very happy with the service and maybe not as objecting to the fees as some on this board are.
     
    Last edited: Jul 11, 2018
  4. frfly172

    frfly172 Touchdown! Greaser!

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    Landing fees are assessed by the airport management. Call ahead for the fee schedule.
     
  5. paflyer

    paflyer Final Approach

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    Why aren't the fees posted on the FBO website and EFBs? Phone/email ineffective if you need/want to divert.

    Most objections are to the secrecy of fees until you are committed and having no other choice than to pay a private business whatever they want for access to a publicly funded airport (that pilots feel like they already paid for.)
     
  6. steingar

    steingar Taxi to Parking

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    I don't think I'd land at an airport where i actually have to ask the question. Florida is wall to wall airports.
     
  7. JOhnH

    JOhnH Touchdown! Greaser!

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    How would you know if you don't ask the question?
     
  8. steingar

    steingar Taxi to Parking

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    Most smaller GA airports, which were numerous in Florida on my last visit, don't try and chase away pilots with onerous fees.
     
  9. TheFB

    TheFB Pre-Flight

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    Location specific airports in FL are getting stupid. KECP, which is really the only airport within an hour of Panama City Beach, charges $12 a day and $7 avgas. No amount of fuel purchase waives daily fee. You pay both. I’m landing with plenty of fuel to return therefore.
     
  10. Clip4

    Clip4 En-Route

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    I can’t argue with that, but most of the services you buy do not have fees posted on the internet.

    With that said, if occasional ramp fees are breaking your piggy aviation may not be for you.
     
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  11. EdFred

    EdFred Touchdown! Greaser!

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    Numerous private strips in the area. Call and see f you can get permission to land.
    54J doesn't look to be an hour away.
     
  12. TheFB

    TheFB Pre-Flight

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    Nobody is claiming bankruptcy over the fees. The complaint is that you can (sometimes) only know you owe them after the fact. Plenty of services post their fees including gov't, travel, etc.
     
  13. EdFred

    EdFred Touchdown! Greaser!

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    Public parking ramps always post rates and fees BEFORE you pull in. Imagine if they only decided to let you know what you owed when you went to leave. But somehow this is OK when FBO's do it.
     
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  14. Clip4

    Clip4 En-Route

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    I find it amazing the people who pay $25 for a spark plug, bitch of a $25 ramp fee.
     
  15. SaltH2OHokie

    SaltH2OHokie Pre-takeoff checklist

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    It is fairly analogous to either a parking garage or a toll road. Neither of which have I ever experienced not knowing the fee structure, clearly, and upfront.

    I may not agree with the fees, but that is a separate argument. And one that I can have internally, while I still have the choice on whether or not to utilize the service.
     
  16. steingar

    steingar Taxi to Parking

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    By the way, last time I felt in danger of paying fees (needed proximity) I called ahead. Took two minutes.
     
  17. EdFred

    EdFred Touchdown! Greaser!

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    Funny thing about Signature is they literally have their fees hidden on their site. If you look at the CSS for the site, they have the div with the hidden property. They are that blatant about being *******s. Edit; it's display: none not hidden

    and WTF is a "piston infrastructure fee" ?
     
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  18. JOhnH

    JOhnH Touchdown! Greaser!

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    I've read that a couple of times and I can't quite discern exactly what you are trying to say.
     
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  19. 172andyou

    172andyou Line Up and Wait

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    I find it amazing that someone who doesn't care about paying ramp fees would bitch about someone who does. Which FBO has you on their payroll anyway...
     
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  20. Kansas Flyer

    Kansas Flyer Pre-takeoff checklist

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    Its more the principle of the matter. I don't mind paying a few bucks to park somewhere for a day, I do mind if there's no way to easily find out what the fee will be in advance.
     
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  21. EdFred

    EdFred Touchdown! Greaser!

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    Most websites now have divisions or in code <div>. Those divisions can have properties that establish the height the width the color of the font type Etc. On the signature site the division that contains the fees is set to "display: none" meaning they are making a concerted effort to hide the fees so you cannot find out what they are. If you open up your developer tools on your browser you can set the display to a couple different types which then makes it visible on the website. If you do you will find out that they have fees that they blatantly try to hide from the public.

    $5 piston infrastructure fee - WTF does that even mean?
    $29 single handling fee
    $79!!!!!! Light twin handling fee
    $99 heavy twin.

    Here's the stupid thing about the light twin handling fee if I have a single-engine Comanche versus a twin engine Comanche are going to charge me an extra 50 bucks just to look at the airplane. Even though it has the same wingspan the same height the same length and pretty dang close on ramp weight. In fact I would pay more for a twin Comanche then I would for a single that's heavier has a wider wingspan costs more and has longer length. And of course they want to hide this from the public until it's too late for you to say no thanks.
     
    Last edited: Jul 11, 2018
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  22. trenton

    trenton Pre-Flight

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    That's a new low. They're publishing their prices... in invisible ink.
     
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  23. N747JB

    N747JB Final Approach

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    Come over to Destin!! $95 per night on my Conquest! I finally made a deal to be a base customer.
     
  24. Palmpilot

    Palmpilot Touchdown! Greaser!

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    Let them eat cake.
     
  25. Anymouse

    Anymouse En-Route

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    Don't have an answer for you, but you might want to look at Herlong or St. Augustine if either of those might work.
     
  26. Clip4

    Clip4 En-Route

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    The ramp ceased to be public when the airport leased it to the FBO.

    AOPA can be successful in their free ramp push and you all will be paying landing fees at those airports.

    Then if you need an FBO, you will be paying both for the “free” parking and the FBO ramp.
     
    Last edited: Jul 11, 2018
  27. PaulMillner

    PaulMillner Pre-takeoff checklist

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    Or, www.rampfee.me

    Paul
     
  28. flyingcheesehead

    flyingcheesehead Touchdown! Greaser!

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    Generally, I pay one set of fees and can come and go as I please during my stay - This is at airports that charge fees in general only, I have no experience at KJAX.

    However, I did just have a very bad experience at KJAC which is the one and only place I've been charged repeated fees during my stay, so I have a bad experience with airports that start with JA.

    *Landing* fees are assessed by airport management and are relatively rare except at B and busy C airports if you're flying a piston single.

    Handling/Ramp fees are assessed by the FBO, not the airport. But, the FBO will be collecting the $$ for all of the above, so the best thing to do is call the FBO and ask about all the fees. Be forewarned that there have been times I didn't get a straight answer. "Oh, well, the SECURITY fee is charged by the airport, not us. We told you all of OUR fees." or "Well, our fuel price is $4.50/gal, but there's a $1.20 flowage fee charged by the airport..."

    Because the places that charge fees don't want you to make an informed decision so that you can avoid paying them a fee. Free market at work.

    If I spend $25 on a spark plug, I have a spark plug. If I spend $25 on a ramp fee, I have nothing.
     
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  29. paflyer

    paflyer Final Approach

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    What kind of airplane do you own?
     
  30. Clip4

    Clip4 En-Route

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    I owned part of a 182RG and I have traveled all over US and Canada in it. Currently flying a Cirrus, although I do not own it.

    Like I have said, I do not like paying ramp fees, but FBO rents, including the rented FBO ramps support the airports. Some of you want a free lunch, that is not reality.
     
  31. JOhnH

    JOhnH Touchdown! Greaser!

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    I hate to say this, but I agree with Clip. TANSTAAFL. Nobody has the right to tell a business how or how much to charge. If you have a problem with their fees, and they aren't doing anything illegal, then you take your business elsewhere. After hearing @flyingcheesehead ' story, I won't be going to KJAC on my next trip out West. If it is a public airport controlled by politicians, then vote against the politicians. I don't like the high fees, but I do like it when I receive good service. And good employees aren't cheap. The money to pay them has to come from somewhere. The thing that surprises me the most is how so many FBOs stay in business without charging more than they do. But that is why so many go out of business, or sell out to the big guys that know how to run a business.

    Oh, and my spark plugs were $79 each.
     
  32. Palmpilot

    Palmpilot Touchdown! Greaser!

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    I think it would be better for airport expenses to be paid through fuel taxes. That way, costs would be more predictable for the user.
     
  33. paflyer

    paflyer Final Approach

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    You shouldn't have to pay to drop off or pick up pax.
     
  34. Palmpilot

    Palmpilot Touchdown! Greaser!

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    That kind of blows a hole in the argument that "all you have to do is call."

    Web site postings can be proofread, and once corrected, they tend to stay corrected without human intervention. When a person answering the phone forgets to mention certain costs, if errors get corrected at all there's no guarantee that they will stay corrected.
     
    Last edited: Jul 11, 2018
  35. Clip4

    Clip4 En-Route

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    Dude, somebody is paying for the daily up keep of that ramp you want to use for free. Lights, snow trash removal, ect. To qualify for those grants that you claim came from your money, the airport must show they have an economic plan that is self supporting. The general tax payers don’t want to pay for your hobby.
     
  36. Brian Priest

    Brian Priest Pre-Flight

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    It’s funny, one place I went to, there was a minimum $15 fuel purchase to use their facilities. So I told them to top it off. The per gallon rate was 50 cents less than home field. Since I rent, I’m like sure I’m doing the owner a favor, the FBO is happy (ended up being $40 I got in fuel), and I got fat on ice cream sandwiches!! Talk about everybody winning!!!
     
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  37. Palmpilot

    Palmpilot Touchdown! Greaser!

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    The argument could be made that granting FBOs the exclusive right to control parking at certain airports gives the FBOs a free lunch, because there is no incentive for them to care whether the fees charged to small-potatoes GA pilots are commensurate with the services used.

    True, but the public does have a right to consideration of their opinions on what kind of agreements are entered into between publicly-funded airports and private businesses.
     
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  38. paflyer

    paflyer Final Approach

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    Dude, a person should not be forced to patronize a monopoly.
     
  39. Clip4

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    Nobody is forcing you to do anything. If you don’t like the ramp fee drive.
     
  40. EdFred

    EdFred Touchdown! Greaser!

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    It's easy to run a business when you have a Monopoly. I have no problem paying for services I have a problem fpaying when I don't get services and I have more of a problem when they won't tell me what those are before I arrive and then I'm stuck once I get there.
     
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