Dilbert on my business--RE

Dave Siciliano

Final Approach
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Feb 27, 2005
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Display Name
Dave Siciliano
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Addison, ADS
Almost too funny to be true right now.

Best,

Dave
 
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I can find Dilbert in every madness in my job.

"Mike, we allowed the usual 3 weeks for the accountants to agree to fund the project, but there was a lot of back and forth but I expect that we'll have the money a week from Wednesday. Once we have that can you place the 12 orders within the hour? You know. The project is way behind schedule now."
 
I can find Dilbert in every madness in my job.

"Mike, we allowed the usual 3 weeks for the accountants to agree to fund the project, but there was a lot of back and forth but I expect that we'll have the money a week from Wednesday. Once we have that can you place the 12 orders within the hour? You know. The project is way behind schedule now."


I had to intentionally avoid reading Dilbert if I wanted to maintain some semblence of morale in my previous job.
 
Dilbert is copyrighted -- you can attach a link, but not the strip itself.

Don't you think that editing other peoples posts is a dangerous game to start playing? Delete it or move it. To me, editing content of member posts by MC should be off limits.
 
From the PoA Rules:
Posting of pornography, racist or otherwise discriminating remarks, threats to cause physical or mental harm, extreme offensive language, material that breaks any law or otherwise totally unacceptable posts or links to pages that contain the aforementioned material may result in an immediate ban from the forums.
...
Pilots of America shall have the right and sole discretion to edit, to refuse to port or to remove any content whatsoever which it finds to be in violation of the provisions hereof or which it finds in its sole discretion to be otherwise objectionable for any reason.
See also http://www.pilotsofamerica.com/forum/showthread.php?t=21971&highlight=copyright and http://www.pilotsofamerica.com/forum/showthread.php?t=9528&highlight=copyright.
 
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I vote for a rule change. You can delete my posts if you want, but an edit by a member of the MC leaves no indication of what was changed. Perhaps the edit changed the intent of the posts.
 
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Dilbert is copyrighted -- you can attach a link, but not the strip itself.

Sorry Ron. I thought I was giving the author credit by posting the strip with his authorship displayed. Thanks for keeping me out of trouble.

Best,

Dave
 
Sorry Ron. I thought I was giving the author credit by posting the strip with his authorship displayed. Thanks for keeping me out of trouble.

Best,

Dave
One of the ways to stay in compliance with PoA's wishes is to import via reference or hot linking. By using the IMG tags you point to the original location of the content and it is merely displayed with a POA shell around it without actually moving the content.

Sort of like this

copyright.jpg


That image is still at the location, http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/copyright.jpg, it is NOT on PoA, yet you can see it, by reference, here within this thread.

Some sites do not like hot linking but there is no law being broken by hot linking.
 
I vote for a rule change. You can delete my posts if you want, but an edit by a member of the MC leaves no indication of what was changed. Perhaps the edit changed the intent of the posts.
If you don't like the rules, you can ask the MC to do so by a PM to Pilots of America Management or by a post on the Site Feedback forum. The only people who vote on rule changes are the MC members. If you have further discussion on this issue, please put it in the Site Feedback forum.
 
That's a very thin line. There's quite a few cases where the courts didn't make that distinction. It's far from "safe"...
I'd like to see one, have a reference?

It has been my experience that most case law has yet to be written on this. Since the image has not moved it was not copied. if a site allows hotlinking there is an implied license by the copyright holder to allow the image to be used in such a way. The Google case started to look into this area but was not clear. One thing is for sure when hotlinking never try to represent the material as your own.

Hotlinking content and then commenting on it also starts to get into Fair Use area. In that are the courts have always ruled for the Fair Use person and against the copyright holder.
 
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Thanks Scott. Unfortunately, this was attached to an e-mail I received; it's not on a site of which I'm aware. But, I will keep all of this in mind for future posts.

Best,

Dave
 
Thanks Scott. Unfortunately, this was attached to an e-mail I received; it's not on a site of which I'm aware. But, I will keep all of this in mind for future posts.

Best,

Dave
No problem Dave.

FYI the Dilbert.com website will actually generate the embedding code for people. While PoA does not allow html embedding this is very similar to the hotlinking i described above. If Dilbert.com allows for htm embedding they probably have no issue with hotlinking either.
 
Ahh, this brings back memories of my Cyberlaw class at Berkeley....I've forgotten most of it, unfortunately. Just come comments, and then I'm back to the original topic, I promise Dave :)

I'd like to see one, have a reference?
Not off hand, but there are a few cases. I seem to remember one in Washington State a few years ago. And of course you can look at the famous cases like Perfect 10 v. Google and take a guess how "hotlinking" would fare in the eyes of that court.

It has been my experience that most case law has yet to be written on this. Since the image has not moved it was not copied.
That's true, and not only is case law still emerging, current interpretations are far from consistent. That the image hasn't technically "moved" doesn't necessarily mean that it wasn't copied. Copying aside, it would be rather easy to argue that you are infringing on the copyright holder's exclusive right to public display and I would think that arguing that you're making a derivitive work would be quite straightforward, too.

if a site allows hotlinking there is an implied license by the copyright holder to allow the image to be used in such a way. The Google case started to look into this area but was not clear.
That's probably not the way that courts will look at this. "Hotlinking" is inherently "allowed" by standard internet protocols. Yes, maybe the site could try to prevent people from doing it, but they certainly don't have to do anything to allow it. Just because something is possible doesn't mean you're allowed to do it.

Hotlinking content and then commenting on it also starts to get into Fair Use area. In that are the courts have always ruled for the Fair Use person and against the copyright holder.
I'd guess this would be your strongest argument. However, courts haven't, by any means, always ruled in favor of the fair use person. Remember the recent Harry Potter Lexicon case? Proportionality is important - based on that, I'd guess that posting a picture and then just a sentence might not be enough to qualify under fair use.

-Felix
 
Just because something is possible doesn't mean you're allowed to do it.

Good luck getting that point across. I tried a year or two ago and some folks just honestly think that if it's there, it's fair game.
 
There's quite a few cases where the courts didn't make that distinction. It's far from "safe"...

Not off hand, but there are a few cases.

Hmmm.

Like I said before, most case law on this has not yet been written. This is still a huge grey area. Given the ROI to go after PoA I doubt that anyone will make their legal stripes by pressing an issue of hotlinking on a newsgroup site.
 
One of the ways to stay in compliance with PoA's wishes is to import via reference or hot linking. By using the IMG tags you point to the original location of the content and it is merely displayed with a POA shell around it without actually moving the content.

Sort of like this

copyright.jpg


That image is still at the location, http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/copyright.jpg, it is NOT on PoA, yet you can see it, by reference, here within this thread.

Some sites do not like hot linking but there is no law being broken by hot linking.
That is not supported by previous MC actions regarding copyrights. Specifically, a picture I posted was hotlinked from the MAG site and was removed.

Copyright law on an aviation forum? Everyone has an opinion, and most of the people that have the power to do something about it are wrong. I've learned to accept it and have really throttled back some of my posting because of it.
 
Hmmm.

Like I said before, most case law on this has not yet been written. This is still a huge grey area. Given the ROI to go after PoA I doubt that anyone will make their legal stripes by pressing an issue of hotlinking on a newsgroup site.
Scott, I agreed with you that case law is still emerging in this area. If you researched this, however, you'd find quite a few applicable cases. Just pointing that out :)
 
FWIW, http://www.dilbert.com has an embed button on their strips, which gives consent to use their images elsewhere on the internet.

This was an inappropriate censor.
It would also appear that what was posted was one of the Dilbert mashups. In these you can add the last frame of text and save the comic. When I read what was posted here it seemed like one of those as the last frame was targeted to a group that Scott Adams normally does not go after. Since the Dilbert site allows for mashups and for them to be saved those might be ok to upload.
 
It would also appear that what was posted was one of the Dilbert mashups. In these you can add the last frame of text and save the comic. When I read what was posted here it seemed like one of those as the last frame was targeted to a group that Scott Adams normally does not go after. Since the Dilbert site allows for mashups and for them to be saved those might be ok to upload.

Hard to say now though, since unilateral action was taken by someone that doesn't quite "get" copyright law.
 
<deleted by me because post was out of line. Discussion moved to thread in "site support and feedback">
 
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Uhh guys. It was my post and I'm over it.

Could I kindly ask that you begin a new thread to stomp the MCs if that's were this is going?

Best regards,

Dave
 
Apologies, Dave. I didn't mean to hijack your thread and I also didn't intend to "stomp the MCs". Quite the opposite. I have stated before (and will continue to say) that the job of the MC is thankless and often undervalued. My frustration here is with this specific action and the general attitude surrounding the ensuing discussion. I'll take any further discussion of board policies elsewhere.
 
I can find Dilbert in every madness in my job.

"Mike, we allowed the usual 3 weeks for the accountants to agree to fund the project, but there was a lot of back and forth but I expect that we'll have the money a week from Wednesday. Once we have that can you place the 12 orders within the hour? You know. The project is way behind schedule now."

Yeah, we hear that in legal ALL the time. "We want to sign this multi-party, multi-national contract with a software vendor and oh yeah, they want it to be signed by the end of the quarter". "That's next week". "Is that a problem?"

:mad2:
 
Don't fret folks. Just didn't mean for this to be a point of contention. I get enough of that all day. Keith says he can link it somehow.

Best,

Dave
 
Let's try this...

Dilbert_as_RE_developer.jpg


It works! :)
 
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Yeah, we hear that in legal ALL the time. "We want to sign this multi-party, multi-national contract with a software vendor and oh yeah, they want it to be signed by the end of the quarter". "That's next week". "Is that a problem?"

:mad2:

I think every job has similar occurrences that mostly are caused by a lack of understanding of what's involved in what's going on. When I was a mechanic, one customer we had came in to pay for his car. I'd just put an alternator on it, which was in a major PITA location. I was covered in grease up to my elbows, and the guy said (to my boss) "Was that job really difficult? Because I don't really want to pay for it if it was easy." The guy had us put a used alternator he found off eBay for $5, too.

We didn't give him a hearty invitation to return.

And yes, I read signatures. :)
 
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