Developing story, 12/13/18: 1 dead at KVPZ crash

Discussion in 'Flight Following' started by GreatLakesFlying, Dec 13, 2018.

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  1. GreatLakesFlying

    GreatLakesFlying Pre-takeoff checklist

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  2. Todd82

    Todd82 Pre-takeoff checklist

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    VPZ hits home for me as a Valpo U alum so I was following this one a little closer than most.

    From the PA28 Facebook group so take with somewhat of a grain of salt, however they had screenshots of the prior incident report...
    Plane was a Comanche. Privately owned, and had bent metal in it before, while with a CFI doing insurance dual time, in a landing incident. CFI, at the time, had no Comanche time but was giving the dual to make the insurance man happy.
     
  3. EppyGA

    EppyGA Touchdown! Greaser!

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    Those single passenger Comanches
     
  4. SkyDog58

    SkyDog58 Touchdown! Greaser!

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    Pure BS. There is no need or requirement to wait until the FAA arrives to remove the body. In fact, most FAA inspectors prefer that it is gone when they arrive.
     
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  5. benyflyguy

    benyflyguy En-Route

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    Yikes. God bless. Will be interesting to hear a lot of the info surrounding this.
     
  6. TheTraveler

    TheTraveler Line Up and Wait

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    I was not, and am usually not command. I can only say that the guidance we have, and what happened on this scene, is that if there is someone to save, do whatever you have to do. But if there is no savable life and extrication is required, don't touch until the FAA arrives and gives the go ahead to start cutting. We had a crash a while back where we did get the two occupants out and they were ok. We sure didn't waste any time there. Because I am not command, I cannot tell you if those instructions come from the airport director or the FAA.
     
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  7. TheTraveler

    TheTraveler Line Up and Wait

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    He surely didn’t suffer, it was hard and fast. Our hangar security camera caught footage, it’s not even two seconds.

    It’s an honor to serve, but it for sure takes the ability to handle bad days, and the need for strong coping mechanisms and methods is real. Always a horrible day when you can’t help.
     
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  8. Morgan3820

    Morgan3820 Pattern Altitude

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    Wow, I have never seen one so damaged up so close. Wow
     
  9. Warlock

    Warlock Cleared for Takeoff PoA Supporter

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    I feel for all first responders who deal with this...never is it easy...
     
  10. James331

    James331 Ejection Handle Pulled

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    Damn!

    Wonder what the cause was

    Also doubt prior damage history had anything to do with anything.
     
  11. James331

    James331 Ejection Handle Pulled

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    Correct EMS and FD own it, once they make sure there is no one left to help and no hazard to others, than the FAA can play.
     
  12. TheTraveler

    TheTraveler Line Up and Wait

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    Is it not considerable that if the engine was worked on, that could have had something possibly to do with it? I’m not speculating, I would just think it would be possible.
     
  13. CC268

    CC268 Final Approach

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    That’s one reason why I could never be a first responder...brutal dealing with stuff like that.
     
  14. Stingray Don

    Stingray Don En-Route

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    Yeah, I couldn’t do it either. I’m glad there are folks like @TheTraveler that sign up for that duty.
     
  15. James331

    James331 Ejection Handle Pulled

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    If it was old damage, no
     
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  16. Chip Sylverne

    Chip Sylverne Final Approach

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    Fear is the poison of our lives.
    The portion about the engine stopped with no residual fuel on the ground is distressing. It doesn't jive with other reports of the aircraft having been fueled recently. Certainly that impact would've ruptured the bladders. The one in FL recently went in like that as well. Nasty business.
     
  17. TheTraveler

    TheTraveler Line Up and Wait

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    Just to clarify: there was fuel, and the smell was strong, but we had no puddles. The aircraft was in the swail, and it's pretty deep and wide. With a larger fuel spill I'd expect a puddle or pool, but there wasn't any. It is certainly possible with the unusually warm temps that it could have been sucked up and absorbed into the ground, but it's hard to say where that expectation or estimation is with the size of the area, the incline, the soft ground, and the tall grass.
     
  18. Lachlan

    Lachlan En-Route

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    It’s not like it was hundreds of gallons of fuel. Just using a fuel level of 20 gallons per side, with an impact as severe and steep as this one the tanks very likely ruptured and spilled most if it onto bare ground. Also, it was not done gently. It was scattered violently. It would not take long to soak into the ground and run down the hill a little bit, thereby increasing the surface area into which the spilled fuel soaked. No puddling needed.
     
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  19. Hank S

    Hank S En-Route

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    that's why the NTSB reports often mention areas of dead grass / underbrush (or the absence thereof) in the vicinity of the impact or airframe. So we should find out pretty soon.
     
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  20. 3393RP

    3393RP En-Route

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    The "professional umbrage crowd"...

    I'm gonna use that one.
     
  21. Sundancer

    Sundancer En-Route

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    NTSB invites the FAA? Or, if the FAA clearly isn't a possible contributer to the accident cause, they invite themselves? Curious who makes the call - I know there are times when the FAA isn't allowed to participate in the investigation, other than to answer questions/provide data, since they may have culpability.
     
  22. James331

    James331 Ejection Handle Pulled

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    FAA is like Jehovah witnesses or inlaws, they kinda just invite themselves.
     
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  23. Sundancer

    Sundancer En-Route

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    A retired friend, from the NTSB, said there were occasions the FAA had to be told to butt out, until it was (or wasn't established) if FAA was contributory. Just anecdotal, didn't sound lie a routine thing.
     
  24. SoCal RV Flyer

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    ^Yes. Controversy aside, thank you for your service, TheTraveler.
     
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  25. hindsight2020

    hindsight2020 En-Route

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    You're welcome :D
     
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  26. PlasticCigar

    PlasticCigar Pre-takeoff checklist

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    Funny...all my posts were magically deleted. I guess I still have them in my email for when I get the subpoena...
     
  27. SkyDog58

    SkyDog58 Touchdown! Greaser!

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    That's odd. I don't recall any of your posts being offensive or inappropriate.
     
  28. PlasticCigar

    PlasticCigar Pre-takeoff checklist

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  29. Omalley1537

    Omalley1537 Line Up and Wait

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    Mine was too.
     
  30. FlySince9

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    and mine
     
  31. Dave Theisen

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    Probably should have deleted the whole thread.
     
  32. EppyGA

    EppyGA Touchdown! Greaser!

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    As was mine.
     
  33. James331

    James331 Ejection Handle Pulled

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    Well that got neutered
     
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  34. PlasticCigar

    PlasticCigar Pre-takeoff checklist

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    I think you win the prize for best word choice...

    I wonder who decided which posts were deleted and which were worthy enough to stay. Seems a little one sided now.
     
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