Dealing with the Landlord?

[overdrive148]

Hey guys, just moved to a new place and I have a problem:

- Moved in 6 months ago, fairly standard low/mid-rent apartment (for Oklahoma, anyway), not perfect

- Landlords changed

- Landlord does the final walkthrough and says that she will have to get "extra cleaning services" for my apartment, including carpet and other things.

-Lease said $50 carpet cleaning fee automatically deducted from deposit, landlord said that "well this one is going to cost about 90 dollars, and the other cleaning about 75"

-Lease allowed for one small dog and a pet deposit which was paid.

My question is, can the landlord just up and decide to go with a "deep cleaning" or whatever term she used even though the carpet in the place is in pretty good condition in relation to what it was when I first moved in?

One of the 3 bedrooms was basically a storage room and the dog -never- went in, on the first step in the room she commented that "this must have been the dog's room" (two doors down was where she spent most of her time).

I don't have any pictures offhand (might be some stored somewhere), I know I should've held onto them but this is ridiculous. I thing it's bogus that she can just up and decide to charge me more out of my deposit for things that are not my responsibility and in my opinion do not appear to be outside 'basic wear and tear".

Nolo says:

And in your case, the answer will depend on just how bad the carpet is and whether you can prove what its condition was when you moved in. Did you and the landlord do a walkthrough when you moved in? Did you fill out a move-in checklist to record damage that was pre-existing? If so, these things will help you in court.


Is the landlord charging you for carpet cleaning or replacement of the carpet? Unless you absolutely destroyed the carpet, a small claims court judge would no doubt say the landlord has no right to charge you for its full replacement cost (assuming you can prove its condition was not pristine when you moved in).

I don't want to really go to court over a couple hundred bucks as this is going towards but at the same time I hate being taken advantage of and I'd like to keep her hands off my money. I feel like this is going to end up as a he said she said contest and with the apartment in the condition it's in, what judge would look at the apartment and say that's pristine condition without proof it was the exact same in the first place?

There are no holes in the walls, no smudges, hell even no dog spots on the carpet, I cleaned those. The most damage is a line of carpet separated at a door frame because she got out of her crate and tried digging under the door. I have no idea what that'll cost but I doubt it will be all that much. I don't even mind paying that, it is damage and it was my fault, but as for a total expensive cleaning...

 

[overdrive148]

Actually, as it turns out, I had the video of my initial walkthrough after digging deep into messages on my phone. This is a still from the video of the hallway. Doesn't look spotless to me

 

[Gerhardt]

Good move on the video.

Check your local laws. When I was in college my girlfriend's (now wife's) landlord tried the same thing. For carpet cleaning. I photocopied and highlighted a portion of a city ordinance we have that allows tenants to collect 3x the amount that a landlord wrongfully tries to collect from a tenant. There was another portion that said that landlords can not charge tenants for routine maintenance, which, barring inordinate stains, carpet cleaning is.

 

[docmirror]

The person is not what's important, it's what your lease/rental agreement says. Read the contract terms on conditions and remediation carefully. If the landlord is being a pain, take notes, and make them put their demands in writing too. Don't go by word of mouth. I prefer to deal with tenants by text or email now. Less he-said/she-said. Saved me several times when I showed up with reams of printed emails from tenant.

Follow the contract. If the wording is vague, in most in most places the vagueness will be interpreted in favor of the tenant, where the landlord provided the contract.

 

[Henning]

In the end, if you paid a deposit, she has the ability to withhold for the carpet cleaning. In the end it's not worth worrying about.

 

[Henning]

Good move on the video.

Check your local laws. When I was in college my girlfriend's (now wife's) landlord tried the same thing. For carpet cleaning. I photocopied and highlighted a portion of a city ordinance we have that allows tenants to collect 3x the amount that a landlord wrongfully tries to collect from a tenant. There was another portion that said that landlords can not charge tenants for routine maintenance, which, barring inordinate stains, carpet cleaning is.

Carpet cleaning is not 'maintenance' it is 'housekeeping'. Carpet replacement is maintenance.

 

[jrollf]

Every place I ever rented always found `reasons` to keep my deposit. Even got told once they were keeping my cleaning deposit because carpet needed to be shampooed because it was `dirty`, two days after I had it professionally stream cleaned.

 

[Henning]

I just always figure the deposit as gone.

 

[James331]

I've always considered any landlord who doesn't replace the carpet and through paint up before a new tenate moves is a slumlord.

IMO new carpet and paint is part of doing business.

I just always figure the deposit as gone.

Most places I've rented have first and last, or a deposit which is more or less the same amount, I just tell them when I'm moving out, and use my last or deposit as credit, if that makes sense.

Like the OP appears, I'm also a clean guy, don't punch holes in walls or anything silly.

 

[docmirror]

I've always considered any landlord who doesn't replace the carpet and through paint up before a new tenate moves is a slumlord.

IMO new carpet and paint is part of doing business.


Most places I've rented have first and last, or a deposit which is more or less the same amount, I just tell them when I'm moving out, and use my last or deposit as credit, if that makes sense.

Like the OP appears, I'm also a clean guy, don't punch holes in walls or anything silly.

Plenty of tenants don't want new paint or carpet if the current stuff is in decent shape. There's a lot of variability and saying something 'always' needs to be done, and if not someone is a slumlord kind of leaves a bad taste.

I've been a landlord for > 25 years, I've seen and heard it all. I just rerented a house to a active duty marine and wife and 2 kids. The carpet in the house is less than 5 years old, and the prev tenant was an elderly couple with a adult child living with them. The carpets were steam cleaned when they moved out and were in perfect condition. I had the two bedrooms repainted, some touchups on trim and it was ready to go.

Also, some states prohibit collecting first, and last plus a deposit. In those states, the rules on deposits are very clear. I advise tenants in the clearest terms that a deposit is not to be used for rent in your last month. Of course, 2 or 3 or 6 years later they send a notice they are moving out, and no rent that month. So - I'm forced to go down and file against them, and then serve them, and then I usually get a check, and then I have to deduct the legal costs from their deposit, and of course they blame me because they told me they were moving out, and wouldn't be paying rent, and blah-blah-blah. Just follow the ****** contract. It's really simple. If it's not in the contract, you are in violation.

If at the end of the tenancy, you aren't happy with the outcome, take them to court. Even in TX muni/small courts are slanted toward the tenant in all but the most egregious cases. I've been there several times, and luckily so far only lost one where I didn't bother to appear, cuz the appearance costs were more than they sued me for. If you expect new carpet and paint, you better be prepared to pay top, top rental dollar. In the situations I've done that, those homes required the most work when the tenants moved out.

 

[Richard]

My one and only tenet dispute was when I as tenet was ready to move into a new place. Due to conflicting schedules and that the landlord lived several hundred miles away it was a couple of weeks between reading the contract and the actual signing.

On the day of intended signing I met with him on the property. He provided the contract and immediately I saw the terms had been changed. I would not sign until further discussion had taken place. He refused. He already had my $150 earnest money and refused to refund it.

I took him to small claims. That was fun watching him sweat and act highly agitated. I knew I would not prevail but I felt I had won because he had chosen to appear over a measly buck fifty. He confirmed my feelings when after the judge's finding for the defendant he bellowed in court that I apparently have no regard for what it cost him to make a special trip to court. Heck yeah I had no regard for that cheat.

Sometimes the sum is too small to make the effort. The OP may fight this on principal but monetarily he stands little to gain. I have the feeling that this is basically a blow to his ego, that he thinks it unjust to be so accused. In this case it is to his credit to endure the beating while wrongfully accused.

 

[Geico266]

I've always considered any landlord who doesn't replace the carpet and through paint up before a new tenate moves is a slumlord.

IMO new carpet and paint is part of doing business.

I've always thought of tenants that can't clean, mark up the walls, don't have a vacuum, and allow their pets (not on the lease) to crap all over the carpets as deadbeats.

Do you really think carpet should only last as long as one tenant does? Why? Carpet should last 10-15 years, even in a rental. My tenants MUST have the carpets professionally cleaned once a year. It is in the lease.

 

[Geico266]

Every place I ever rented always found `reasons` to keep my deposit. Even got told once they were keeping my cleaning deposit because carpet needed to be shampooed because it was `dirty`, two days after I had it professionally stream cleaned.

They can try to keep it, but you should stand your ground and demand an accounting of the deposit. Depending on your state landlords can be "fined" 3Xs the amount they wrongly keep. A demand letter from the tenant should get their attention. Here the law requires me to mail an accounting of the deposit within 14 days after move out.

I've literally taken hundreds of cases to small claims court. I have never lost a case.

 

[Henning]

I've always considered any landlord who doesn't replace the carpet and through paint up before a new tenate moves is a slumlord.

IMO new carpet and paint is part of doing business.





Most places I've rented have first and last, or a deposit which is more or less the same amount, I just tell them when I'm moving out, and use my last or deposit as credit, if that makes sense.

Like the OP appears, I'm also a clean guy, don't punch holes in walls or anything silly.

I do the same thing. In California they used to charge first, last, & security, but that became illegal. You could max out at 2 months on move in.

 

[ElPaso Pilot]

I've always considered any landlord who doesn't replace the carpet and through paint up before a new tenate moves is a slumlord.

IMO new carpet and paint is part of doing business.

Pfffft. Slumlord.

More power to you as you pay for that brand new carpet pro-rated right into your rent.

Not everyone can (or wants) to pay for that overhead.

 

[dell30rb]

If I ever have to deal with renting again, I am taking pictures and a detailed written report of the initial walk through. Pictures and report will be signed and dated by the landlord and i'm holding on to them.

Friend of mine just had to deal with a similar problem. He rented a house that was in decent overall shape, but the hardwood floor finish was worn in high-traffic areas and was obviously in need of refinishing. I helped him move in, my comment was "well I guess you don't have to worry about the dog scratching the floors, they're already ****ed up!"

One year later, he moves out and the landlord decides to keep $650 of his security deposit because the floors needed to be refinished, "because of the dog".

My friend was extra ****ed. As he had a professional relationship with this landlord prior to renting the house, and went above and beyond to make sure he kept the house and yard in good shape while he lived there. Additionally, he found the landlord a tenant (another friend of mine) who was able to move in right when he moved out, probably saving the landlord the expense of having the house un-occupied.

In the end it was not worth fighting for the $650, past sending the landlord a written complaint. Which she ignored.

What goes around comes around. Of course this issue was communicated to the tenant who was going to move in, they bailed, the house has been unoccupied for 3 months now. Additionally their professional relationship was severed. My friend is a recruiter and the landlord a person who does short term contract work, he had placed her in two jobs previously.

 

[Henning]

Meh, I just make them earn the deposit. Kinda like when the car rental company tags on all the insurance without asking.

 

[James331]

Pfffft. Slumlord.

More power to you as you pay for that brand new carpet pro-rated right into your rent.

Not everyone can (or wants) to pay for that overhead.

Yeah I'm not paying more than market value just because you maintain your property, you don't get a cookie for doing your job.

Frankly when you're charging me the same in rent as a mortgage and insurance costs, yeah I expect stuff to work and be fresh, don't like it I'll rent from someone else, and guess who will rent your chit hole, someone who will mark up the walls and never clean, makijg your slum even worse.

If I am still happy in this town after another year I'll just buy a place, renting is a joke with most landlords.

 

[docmirror]

Yeah I'm not paying more than market value just because you maintain your property, you don't get a cookie for doing your job.

Frankly when you're charging me the same in rent as a mortgage and insurance costs, yeah I expect stuff to work and be fresh, don't like it I'll rent from someone else, and guess who will rent your chit hole, someone who will mark up the walls and never clean, makijg your slum even worse.

If I am still happy in this town after another year I'll just buy a place, renting is a joke with most landlords.

My mortgage and other costs have nothing to do with what I rent to the public for. I've been upside down on some, I rent places now that are fully paid off. This is another theme that tenants seem to be stuck on, landlords should provide housing to people based on what they owe? So my 4bdrm, 2.5 bath 1900' home in SoCal should rent for $375/month because I've owned it a long time, and it's paid off? You get to financially benefit with low rent because I was smart enough invest my hard earned money 25 years ago?

pfft, go rent somewhere else. That house rents for $2700/month, and it's been vacant for about 45 days over the past 6 years. Maybe I'll put new carpet in after the current tenant moves out, and raise it to $2900.

 

[ElPaso Pilot]

My mortgage and other costs have nothing to do with what I rent to the public for. I've been upside down on some, I rent places now that are fully paid off. This is another theme that tenants seem to be stuck on, landlords should provide housing to people based on what they owe? So my 4bdrm, 2.5 bath 1900' home in SoCal should rent for $375/month because I've owned it a long time, and it's paid off? You get to financially benefit with low rent because I was smart enough invest my hard earned money 25 years ago?

pfft, go rent somewhere else. That house rents for $2700/month, and it's been vacant for about 45 days over the past 6 years. Maybe I'll put new carpet in after the current tenant moves out, and raise it to $2900.

LOL. Reminds me of the folks who have never brought a new product through a development cycle and to market, yet love to vent that the latest hot selling iGizmo whatever is a POS, and that Gates/Jobs should have called them for advice.

Been on both sides of the Renter/Landlord equation. Obviously some here haven't. I've seen tenants behave far worse than the suckiest landlord I've ever dealt with, but that's part of the business.

 

[docmirror]

Been on both sides of the Renter/Landlord equation. Obviously some here haven't. I've seen tenants behave far worse than the suckiest landlord I've ever dealt with, but that's part of the business.

So far my worst tenant left mom behind. Literally. In a silver urn. On the top of the garage fridge. Three months later, after leaving the place a mess, and stiffing me for about $450, I got a sheepish call, asking for mom to be returned. I sent it COD $450 due...

 

[overdrive148]

Good discussion so far!

I mean, the lady had even taken a liking to me and said I couldn't leave and asked me not to (in a joking manner), because I was a good tenant and didn't swear at her and I remembered her name and addressed her professionally and in a timely manner. I didn't destroy the apartment and I continually brought up issues in advance so they wouldn't be piled up at the end.

Basically, when I moved in, the hood over the oven wasn't working, the showerhead/faucet assemblies in both bathrooms were siliconed and loose from the wall, I was missing handles off closets after they painted, the place wasn't terrific - at the time it was because of where we had been staying before. I brought up the issues for the first landlord and I got the "we'll get to it within a week or two" and it never happened. Then they switched over, I asked about the A/C, it got recharged within 5 days. I brought up the other stuff but gave them leeway because I won't die without closet handles, I just made her well aware of the problems. And she told me yesterday that she wouldn't go "hard on me" during the inspection because she knew there was a lot wrong with the apartment.

And then she drops the cleaning on me. The "pet smell" isn't my problem if you allow pets in the apartment in the first place, it is expected. A standard cleaning should take care of that, and that was set aside in the lease for a $50 standard deduction for carpet cleaning, which I believed was fair. But now we're gonna need a deep cleaning! Excuse me? Have you seen some of the other apartments? Light pet stains (after I worked all day cleaning and packing mind you) and an odor of people living there is not an excuse to just super clean the place when it wasn't much better when I moved in.

The first thing she did was walk up to the hood over the oven and slide her finger under the lip, I said I cleaned to the best of my ability on the surfaces that were "dirty" (carpet counters drawers fridge etc etc) and she immediately said something about my ability not being "enough".

I don't know how to approach this. I have a key still that my GF was using (that I told her that I cut with permission from the previous landlord) and that I'd return it this weekend (she marked down all keys returned for me anyway). I was thinking I could go take pics and match it with the video if she tried anything but I think that'd be trespassing considering I turned my stuff in already. But if I don't do it soon then I can't really come after her after it's cleaned can I?

Also how much do you guys think a torn line of carpet between a door frame would cost to replace? She said she'd have to get a quote even though the seam in my room was clearly replaced in times past. I have a feeling that she's going to send me the scraps of the deposit back and say "well I spent all of it" before I get a chance to see the bill from the carpet fixing and the rest to make sure she didn't take ME to the cleaners.

I also just gave her a call and asked for a copy of the lease. She started laughing and said she'd have to find it and that I could stop by Saturday and get it. I wonder if she even has it on file after the change? She said my deposit was 250 and I'm 90% certain it was 500.

(Yeah, I couldn't find my copy of the lease during the move and I don't know where the receipts are, that's stupid on my part and it won't be happening again)

 

[James331]

My mortgage and other costs have nothing to do with what I rent to the public for. I've been upside down on some, I rent places now that are fully paid off. This is another theme that tenants seem to be stuck on, landlords should provide housing to people based on what they owe? So my 4bdrm, 2.5 bath 1900' home in SoCal should rent for $375/month because I've owned it a long time, and it's paid off? You get to financially benefit with low rent because I was smart enough invest my hard earned money 25 years ago?

pfft, go rent somewhere else. That house rents for $2700/month, and it's been vacant for about 45 days over the past 6 years. Maybe I'll put new carpet in after the current tenant moves out, and raise it to $2900.

Again no one cares about YOUR mortgage, I don't really care if my landlord is upside down, got a kill deal, is paid off, doesn't matter, didnt ask and not interested.

What I said was, when you're charging the same in rent as what you could buy a comparable or better home for, stuff better be fresh and in order.

 

[overdrive148]

Good move on the video.

Check your local laws. When I was in college my girlfriend's (now wife's) landlord tried the same thing. For carpet cleaning. I photocopied and highlighted a portion of a city ordinance we have that allows tenants to collect 3x the amount that a landlord wrongfully tries to collect from a tenant. There was another portion that said that landlords can not charge tenants for routine maintenance, which, barring inordinate stains, carpet cleaning is.

They can try to keep it, but you should stand your ground and demand an accounting of the deposit. Depending on your state landlords can be "fined" 3Xs the amount they wrongly keep. A demand letter from the tenant should get their attention. Here the law requires me to mail an accounting of the deposit within 14 days after move out.

Where would I find this information? I was in Shawnee, OK. Google-fu doesn't appear to be strong enough unless I'm looking for the whole state of OK's laws?

...That house rents for $2700/month, and it's been vacant for about 45 days over the past 6 years...

What I said was, when you're charging the same in rent as what you could buy a comparable or better home for, stuff better be fresh and in order.

Also, the rent on this place is like $680/mo. 3 bedroom 2 bath. Not sure if it matters.

The first place I rented in Shawnee was the first place I'd ever rented and I didn't know that cockroaches were a standard item and that the ones that were painted over on the doors and walls were a normal thing. Or that the guy in the apartment across the hall liked to start and work on his dirtbike early in the morning inside his living room. That was 400/mo, gas electric and water bills.

The gas company tried to screw me over and gave me bills of like 100-150 bucks a month for a 1 bedroom apartment. Not having experience before, I thought it was really expensive stuff and didn't use any for an entire month (microwave only and very low heat), bill came back more expensive. Turns out the meter hadn't been working since I got there and they were "estimating" my bill off the previous tenants. And judging by the crayon markings in the doors and the stickers, I'd say a family of 3-4 lived there before. I had to supervisor up 4 times before someone listened, one of them told me that I'd never get this problem resolved no matter who I talked to. They turned my gas off without warning and there was a gas leak and there was code violations that the landlord didn't do anything about and then I just said to hell with that place and those landlords and left. Not before birds started coming out of my wall though.

Now I know better!

 

[docmirror]

Again no one cares about YOUR mortgage, I don't really care if my landlord is upside down, got a kill deal, is paid off, doesn't matter, didnt ask and not interested.

What I said was, when you're charging the same in rent as what you could buy a comparable or better home for, stuff better be fresh and in order.

Yeah, go ahead. See if you can find a zero down, free mortgage, no fees, move in ready house to buy for my rent cost. I'll stand over here and wait.

To buy the house in SoCal I rent for $2700/month would cost you about $100k in down payment, plus loan costs, and then, you're mortgage cost alone would be close to my rent. Doesn't include prop taxes, insurance, maint, etc.

Got $100k laying around? Excellent credit? $145k annual salary?

Welcome to renting.

 

[FORANE]

What I said was, when you're charging the same in rent as what you could buy a comparable or better home for, stuff better be fresh and in order.

The market has a way of sorting this out. If you don't like the place then it is simply a matter of not renting it and looking for another rental or buying your own place. If I cannot find a tenant at for the rent I am asking, then I will be forced to remodel, reduce the rate, include incentives, etc. No different than selling an airplane - you don't like it then don't buy it. I own apartments. If I replaced the carpet every time a tenant moved out I would not be able to rent the place for the rent I would have to charge to break even.

 

[bflynn]

I've always considered any landlord who doesn't replace the carpet and through paint up before a new tenate moves is a slumlord.

IMO new carpet and paint is part of doing business.

So a landlord should fork over 5k for new carpet after six months because you didn't stay for very long? You do realize that IF you can find a landlord that actually does that, you're paying for it in your rent...don't you?

For the OP, if you're going to keep a dog, you have to be responsible for the damage, just like a cat owner or a smoker. Your animal causes odors that you have no clue about because you've become nose blind to it. A cleaning after you move out is reasonable and expected. Be grateful that's probably all that's required.

If you want to avoid this in the future, get a pre-move out inspection, signed by both of you. You get a list of the items the landlord is concerned about. You fix those and then if they don't give you back your deposit, they'd have to have a good reason why not - for example, hidden damage that wasn't visible on the walkthrough.

 

[docmirror]

Good discussion so far!

I mean, the lady had even taken a liking to me and said I couldn't leave and asked me not to (in a joking manner), because I was a good tenant and didn't swear at her and I remembered her name and addressed her professionally and in a timely manner. I didn't destroy the apartment and I continually brought up issues in advance so they wouldn't be piled up at the end.

Basically, when I moved in, the hood over the oven wasn't working, the showerhead/faucet assemblies in both bathrooms were siliconed and loose from the wall, I was missing handles off closets after they painted, the place wasn't terrific - at the time it was because of where we had been staying before. I brought up the issues for the first landlord and I got the "we'll get to it within a week or two" and it never happened. Then they switched over, I asked about the A/C, it got recharged within 5 days. I brought up the other stuff but gave them leeway because I won't die without closet handles, I just made her well aware of the problems. And she told me yesterday that she wouldn't go "hard on me" during the inspection because she knew there was a lot wrong with the apartment.

And then she drops the cleaning on me. The "pet smell" isn't my problem if you allow pets in the apartment in the first place, it is expected. A standard cleaning should take care of that, and that was set aside in the lease for a $50 standard deduction for carpet cleaning, which I believed was fair. But now we're gonna need a deep cleaning! Excuse me? Have you seen some of the other apartments? Light pet stains (after I worked all day cleaning and packing mind you) and an odor of people living there is not an excuse to just super clean the place when it wasn't much better when I moved in.

The first thing she did was walk up to the hood over the oven and slide her finger under the lip, I said I cleaned to the best of my ability on the surfaces that were "dirty" (carpet counters drawers fridge etc etc) and she immediately said something about my ability not being "enough".

I don't know how to approach this. I have a key still that my GF was using (that I told her that I cut with permission from the previous landlord) and that I'd return it this weekend (she marked down all keys returned for me anyway). I was thinking I could go take pics and match it with the video if she tried anything but I think that'd be trespassing considering I turned my stuff in already. But if I don't do it soon then I can't really come after her after it's cleaned can I?

Also how much do you guys think a torn line of carpet between a door frame would cost to replace? She said she'd have to get a quote even though the seam in my room was clearly replaced in times past. I have a feeling that she's going to send me the scraps of the deposit back and say "well I spent all of it" before I get a chance to see the bill from the carpet fixing and the rest to make sure she didn't take ME to the cleaners.

I also just gave her a call and asked for a copy of the lease. She started laughing and said she'd have to find it and that I could stop by Saturday and get it. I wonder if she even has it on file after the change? She said my deposit was 250 and I'm 90% certain it was 500.

(Yeah, I couldn't find my copy of the lease during the move and I don't know where the receipts are, that's stupid on my part and it won't be happening again)

Well, it sounds like you are in a crap place, with a crap landlord. Not sure how you're going to come to terms, but it's going to be a hassle.

One thing you did wrong was accept the place with all defects and move in. You should make a list of defects found on move in, document it, send it to the landlord and ask them to acknowledge receipt in writing. Most cell phones will take short video, so you can video stuff like this easy when you first move in.

Next, pets and apartments don't mix well. Houses are better, but apartments and a dog is going to get ugly. Which makes me understand why the landlord is insisting on better carpet cleaning. We all know what happens and there's no getting away from it.

You got a copy of the lease when you moved in, and asking her for it is another indication that you just didn't care what went on. If she said she wouldn't go hard on you because she knew of the defects in the place, make note of that statement if you want to go to small claims. That right there plus the fact she wasn't the manager when you rented will get you your deposit back in full if you want to go the extra mile. Despite your damage to the carpet, and not demanding that stuff be fixed when you moved in.

Low rent - is just that, low rent. Find a better place and pay more, or buy, or live with the added cost of being in a crappy place with crappy managers. I can also tell you from experience that finding a good on-site property manager is not easy either. Most of them are just as lazy as the tenants they manage.

 

[overdrive148]

Well, it sounds like you are in a crap place, with a crap landlord. Not sure how you're going to come to terms, but it's going to be a hassle.

One thing you did wrong was accept the place with all defects and move in. You should make a list of defects found on move in, document it, send it to the landlord and ask them to acknowledge receipt in writing. Most cell phones will take short video, so you can video stuff like this easy when you first move in.

Yeah, realizing now that it was pretty stupid to accept the place with the defects. I did submit a form listing things wrong with the apartment but they were not as in-depth and mentioned nothing about carpet (mostly due to being way better condition than any place so far). Actually did manage to snag video of a quick walkthrough and find it again after going through a few thousand messages on my phone. In-writing is how I'm going to handle stuff from now on.

Next, pets and apartments don't mix well. Houses are better, but apartments and a dog is going to get ugly. Which makes me understand why the landlord is insisting on better carpet cleaning. We all know what happens and there's no getting away from it.

True, but pet deposit and a cleaning fee added in the lease automatically for having one was what I thought were the terms of having a dog. Paying more for it and paying for the cleanup after it, which I agree with anyway. Even after I went through all the carpet and removed the majority of the stains myself that were pet related. The damage to the carpet is of course my fault as well, and I have no problem with her getting it fixed through my deposit. I've actually never had a pet to deal with in a lease and that was the first place I'd done it before so I thought it was common fare.

You got a copy of the lease when you moved in, and asking her for it is another indication that you just didn't care what went on. If she said she wouldn't go hard on you because she knew of the defects in the place, make note of that statement if you want to go to small claims. That right there plus the fact she wasn't the manager when you rented will get you your deposit back in full if you want to go the extra mile. Despite your damage to the carpet, and not demanding that stuff be fixed when you moved in.

I'm mostly asking for a lease to double check the deposit amount and read the terms again. I should've put it somewhere better and held onto it but again, learning that now. She did indeed say that on the phone the day before the inspection but I can't prove it. The monetary loss isn't what I'm the most upset about, it's the fact she's trying to saddle me with the problems that already existed. Which is my fault as well, for accepting the place and letting that happen.

Low rent - is just that, low rent. Find a better place and pay more, or buy, or live with the added cost of being in a crappy place with crappy managers. I can also tell you from experience that finding a good on-site property manager is not easy either. Most of them are just as lazy as the tenants they manage.

Working on it. Moved to a higher rent place about 45m away and the apartments were built in the last two years. Already taken pics of everything and made a very extensive list of things wrong with the place (that I wouldn't have before) to cover. It's a learning experience, I guess. Thanks for the input.

Keystrokes

 

[Geico266]

Yeah I'm not paying more than market value just because you maintain your property, you don't get a cookie for doing your job.

Frankly when you're charging me the same in rent as a mortgage and insurance costs, yeah I expect stuff to work and be fresh, don't like it I'll rent from someone else, and guess who will rent your chit hole, someone who will mark up the walls and never clean, makijg your slum even worse.

If I am still happy in this town after another year I'll just buy a place, renting is a joke with most landlords.

I pull credit reports on all prospective tenants, and call references.

Don't rent the place if you don't like it. Pretty simple. Telling a landlord what to do, when to replace carpet, and when to paint is pretty arrogant. I don't tell you when to wash your car.

If the tenant damages the place and the costs of repair exceeds the security deposit I take them to small claims court and get a judgment. Then the fun begins collecting it. I'm pretty good at it now. Ruins their credit for years.

 

[docmirror]

Keystrokes

No prob. Better luck in the future. What I can advise moving forward, is to document everything from the start, and just follow the letter of the contract. Be kind to your landlord, and you'll usually find they will be kind to you. As for having a pet, you're never going to fix the carpet problem, so it's one of the factors of owning a pet, get used to it.

 

[James331]

I pull credit reports on all prospective tenants, and call references.

Don't rent the place if you don't like it. Pretty simple. Telling a landlord what to do, when to replace carpet, and when to paint is pretty arrogant. I don't tell you when to wash your car.

If the tenant damages the place and the costs of repair exceeds the security deposit I take them to small claims court and get a judgment. Then the fun begins collecting it. I'm pretty good at it now. Ruins their credit for years.

Exactly.

I'll ask though, "are you painting and fixing it before you rent to me"

I've also seen places that needed new carpet, paint, knobs etc a decade ago, guy wanted references, and a deposit, I asked for what? End of that one.

As for buying, I'm not dumb enough to move to CA, lived there for a while, I don't speak Spanish and I have no doubt Id end up shooting a theif after a yesr or two, only place I've lived where I expected stuff to get stolen every year.

Up here, I could easily swing a place, heck could buy outright if I really wanted to.


And for whoever said 5k for carpet... Does that come with a industrial sized tub of KY?

 

[ElPaso Pilot]

Going to be blunt here.

Good discussion so far!

And then she drops the cleaning on me. The "pet smell" isn't my problem if you allow pets in the apartment in the first place, it is expected.

No, the "pet smell" is not expected. It is expected that you leave the place just as you found it, less normal wear and tear. "Pet smell" is not normal wear and tear. Would you move into an apartment that smelled like someone else's wet dog or cat urine?

A standard cleaning should take care of that, and that was set aside in the lease for a $50 standard deduction for carpet cleaning, which I believed was fair. But now we're gonna need a deep cleaning! Excuse me? Have you seen some of the other apartments? Light pet stains (after I worked all day cleaning and packing mind you) and an odor of people living there is not an excuse to just super clean the place when it wasn't much better when I moved in.

$50 won't get a professional carpet cleaner to even drive out to look at your 3 bdr apt.

And, you sound like you're in grade school when you say .... "but look at HIS carpet! HE messed his up worse than I did!" Not even relevant to the discussion.

True, but pet deposit and a cleaning fee added in the lease automatically for having one was what I thought were the terms of having a dog. Paying more for it and paying for the cleanup after it, which I agree with anyway. Even after I went through all the carpet and removed the majority of the stains myself that were pet related. T

So, besides the stink, you handed the landlord back her keys -- noting that your dog left new uncleaned pet stains (were they food, pee, or crap?) in the carpet that Fido already tore up and you didn't fix first? Again, would you move into that place like that?

Also how much do you guys think a torn line of carpet between a door frame would cost to replace? She said she'd have to get a quote even though the seam in my room was clearly replaced in times past. I have a feeling that she's going to send me the scraps of the deposit back and say "well I spent all of it" before I get a chance to see the bill from the carpet fixing and the rest to make sure she didn't take ME to the cleaners.

As you should have done first, and then had them fix the stuff you did. This is your landlord, not your mother. Why should she bargain shop for lowest quotes so she can clean up after you?

I also just gave her a call and asked for a copy of the lease. She started laughing and said she'd have to find it and that I could stop by Saturday and get it. I wonder if she even has it on file after the change? She said my deposit was 250 and I'm 90% certain it was 500.

Ugh. So you don't have your basic documentation either? Looks like mom needs to keep your lease as well...

Yeah, realizing now that it was pretty stupid to accept the place with the defects. I did submit a form listing things wrong with the apartment but they were not as in-depth and mentioned nothing about carpet.

It's not stupid to accept with defects, if you have them properly documented AND KEEP THE DOCUMENTS. You are renting a 3 bdr, 2 bth apt. for $680/mo. It's not going to be in brand new condition.

I'm mostly asking for a lease to double check the deposit amount and read the terms again. I should've put it somewhere better and held onto it but again, learning that now. She did indeed say that on the phone the day before the inspection but I can't prove it. The monetary loss isn't what I'm the most upset about, it's the fact she's trying to saddle me with the problems that already existed. Which is my fault as well, for accepting the place and letting that happen.

Put yourself in her shoes. She bought the place, and now has to rent it to someone else, and pay the bills. She has no idea what it looked like when you moved in. All she has is someone with an apartment that smells like someone's dog, stains on the carpet, and torn up seams from the dog trying to dig a hole under the door. Not to mention a tenant who has nothing in writing, including his lease and deposit. No wonder she laughed.

It's going to cost her a pretty penny to make this place clean again ... and you can't document what was already there and what was new.

This would likely have been a brief conversation if you had your ducks in a row when she showed up for the exit walk through.

Working on it. Moved to a higher rent place about 45m away and the apartments were built in the last two years. Already taken pics of everything and made a very extensive list of things wrong with the place (that I wouldn't have before) to cover. It's a learning experience, I guess. Thanks for the input.

That's a good start.

This time keep your documentation and leave the place like you left it. Then you can make sure both you and your landlord are whole when you leave.

This is valuable experience for you, since someday you may be a business owner or landlord yourself -- and know that it is your former self you will be watching out for!

 

[Fearless Tower]

I've always considered any landlord who doesn't replace the carpet and through paint up before a new tenate moves is a slumlord.

IMO new carpet and paint is part of doing business

Yeah, right.

That is most definitely NOT the norm.

 

[Fearless Tower]

Again no one cares about YOUR mortgage, I don't really care if my landlord is upside down, got a kill deal, is paid off, doesn't matter, didnt ask and not interested.

Oh, you will when the landlord defaults and you have to pack your crap and find a new place to live on short notice...

 

[Fearless Tower]

Been on both sides of the Renter/Landlord equation. Obviously some here haven't. I've seen tenants behave far worse than the suckiest landlord I've ever dealt with, but that's part of the business.

Ain't that the truth.

 

[overdrive148]

Going to be blunt here.
*snip*

Thanks for the perspective.

I meant that I was figuring that the "pet smell" was something that was expected and accepted for the rental agreement on the condition of allowing pets - not that it's left behind when I'm gone, but that it is taken care of with the cleaning fee that's in the lease. I hadn't ever seen one before (then again, only rented for a couple years now, 3 different landlords). I thought that the 50 dollar cleaning fee written in the lease was there because of the pet (like the pet deposit). I don't know if they got professional cleaners to do the cleaning, but the apartment when I moved in didn't appear to be done professionally.

True that I wouldn't move into an apartment that had someone else's dog smell. I just thought the reason for that fee in the lease was to make up for the fact we had a dog (nonrefundable fee according to the lease). My reasoning was if the apartment is going to be getting a cleaning fee no matter what I do, why does it have to be spotless? I cleaned the vast majority of the spots and none were really visible by looking at the carpet. The carpet ended up looking about the same consistency as it had before, is what I meant - no dog spots. Or any other spots that we created.

And yeah, I accept that it's my fault for not keeping the lease on hand. Something I have to learn to do. I didn't expect the apartment in brand new condition, I just expected that the condition I got it in was going to be the one I left it in (minus the pet odor that I admittedly might have gone nose-blind to as stated before). I believed the mandatory fees were in place for the dog is all.

On the walkthrough she was surprised that we had a ceiling fan in the house (many apartments under their ownership). It was weird because she didn't even know what was in ours in the first place much less overall and I thought that she couldn't possibly try to saddle me with footing the bill for things when she didn't know the condition of the place to begin with.

And yeah, more to learn, more to deal with, and a better way to handle relations. This time around, I took pics and video of the new place, commented on everything down to the adhesive on the vinyl squares, and put in repair requests for the major stuff up front. I have a copy of the lease and I'm keeping the receipts. I appreciate your point of view.

I asked the landlords to replace the lightbulb above my front door and they handed me one.

 

[ElPaso Pilot]

And for whoever said 5k for carpet... Does that come with a industrial sized tub of KY?

My, oh, my. Are you for real?

http://www.homewyse.com/services/cost_to_install_carpet.html

Call it $4.00 / sq. ft. installed for round numbers, somewhere in the middle between high and low estimates.

Let's see. $5000 total equals $4.00 per square ft. X 1250 square feet of carpet, eh?

Sounds about right for a 3 bedroom apartment?

You bet, a landlord will pull that up and throw it away for every new tenant -- so you don't call them a slumlord.

What world are you living in?

 

[chartbundle]

Ahh renting. The place I rent had the fence fall down almost a year ago. They finally fixed it a couple weeks ago and then mailed me a letter saying they had to raise the rent 8% because 'reasons'. Luckily I've already been looking to buy something so it's just going to be good timing that they raise the rent and I move out.

 

[James331]

You can buy carpet for under a buck a sqft.

http://t.homedepot.com/b/Flooring-Carpet-Carpet-Tile-Carpet/N-5yc1vZbzsm

I've carpeted more than a few rooms, ain't rock surgery.

But yeah, if you have someone living in a house for 4 years or something you can through some new carpet in and take a roller to the walls, if that's too much work maybe you shouldn't be renting out to people.