Damned designers...

Hiperbiper

Hiperbiper

Line Up and Wait
Joined
Feb 1, 2007
Messages
633
Location
Shreveport La.
Display Name
Chris Carlson
Home Airfield
KDTN
As I have just spent 1 hour under a Piper Lance panel tracking down a problem with the panel lights my frustraions are as follows:

Damn the injuneer who designed the Piper double stacked CB panel.
Damn the knucklehead who used a transistor in a lighting circuit when a reostat would work fine.
Damn the no-count-low-brow moron who put the afore mentioned transistors on top of the box that contains 7 rocker switches with a 1/4" gap between it and the bottom of the radio stack.


OK, I feel much better!:goofy:

Anyone out there have a certain bit of aircraft design that has caused them to want to find the designer(s) and beat the snot outta' them?


Chris (soon to be A&P)
 
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Don'tcha just love working behind the instrument panel of a piper?
 
Just wait, that Lance is a walk in the park. This winter marks my 35th year of maintaining GA and corporate aircraft.
 
Just try working on an Aztec.
 
Tom-D said:
Don'tcha just love working behind the instrument panel of a piper?
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I just turn those airplanes away. You know, the ones that you have to bust your back to work on anything in the cabin.


Life is too short.
 
bnt83 said:
I just turn those airplanes away. You know, the ones that you have to bust your back to work on anything in the cabin.


Life is too short.
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On my 170 I can slide the seat back, set in front of it. turn and lay down head forward and place my hand on anything under there.
 
Want to make it worse? Build the plane yourself, THEN when you are laying on your back troubleshooting a loose wire somewhere, you are cursing YOURSELF for putting that d*mn wire so d*mn far up in the d*mn wad of wires.

Or at least that's what I've heard... I've never done that myself, of course...... :D :D ;)
 
Tom-D said:
On my 170 I can slide the seat back, set in front of it. turn and lay down head forward and place my hand on anything under there.
Click to expand...


I tortured myself on a 150B a lot, a bit of 172 stuff, pile of work on an A36.

David asked about me working his mooney and my eyes rolled :lol:.

Another one was fishing for an annual inspection this weekend and I kindly informed them that I really don't do them but for a few good friends (and nice easy to work airplanes), and then they said "Tomahawk 2 years out of annual" while looking at me in my wheelchair:goofy:
 
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Tom-D said:
The fuel selector on the Aztec is one job I can't do. I wear a small glove, but I can't get my hand in there.
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Then there's the 40 hour job of changing the hydraulic power pack, which goes out about every 10k hours. I sold it at 9,970 TTAF.

CJones said:
Want to make it worse? Build the plane yourself, THEN when you are laying on your back troubleshooting a loose wire somewhere, you are cursing YOURSELF for putting that d*mn wire so d*mn far up in the d*mn wad of wires.

Or at least that's what I've heard... I've never done that myself, of course...... :D :D ;)
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RVs are perfect, meaning that their builders could never screw something like a wiring harness up. Right? :D
 
Ted DuPuis said:
RVs are perfect, meaning that their builders could never screw something like a wiring harness up. Right? :D
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Exactly. RVs don't have 'screw-ups'.... They have 'features'... :D
 
CJones said:
Exactly. RVs don't have 'screw-ups'.... They have 'features'... :D
Click to expand...

Funny, I used that exact description at work the other day! :D
 
Helped a friend with the landing gear locks and interlocks on his Cardinal RG landing gear. Made me ashamed to be an engineer.
 
CJones said:
Want to make it worse? Build the plane yourself, THEN when you are laying on your back troubleshooting a loose wire somewhere, you are cursing YOURSELF for putting that d*mn wire so d*mn far up in the d*mn wad of wires.

Or at least that's what I've heard... I've never done that myself, of course...... :D :D ;)
Click to expand...
I'm finding there can be great joy in KNOWING what's in there and how it's setup and when something stupid makes you want to kick somebody's ass, the ass is easy to find.
Ted DuPuis said:
RVs are perfect, meaning that their builders could never screw something like a wiring harness up. Right? :D
Click to expand...
Right.
Heaven is detailed documentation, wire labels and a big RV ('10).
I imagine Hell being located behind the panel of a purchased tandem seat RV with minimal documentation and lots of original wiring ideas.
 
R&R the mags/generator/alternator/tach drive, on a Mooney M20

It's easiest to pull the engine. R&R what needs it, place the engine on a test stand run it before you put it back.
 
Tom-D said:
R&R the mags/generator/alternator/tach drive, on a Mooney M20

It's easiest to pull the engine. R&R what needs it, place the engine on a test stand run it before you put it back.
Click to expand...

I agree, working on the Mooney accessories is probably one of my least favorite jobs.

Working on the accessories on the old E series Continentals in Bonanzas is a real treat too. More specifically, the vacuum pump, generator, and fuel pump aren't much fun to try and remove and replace.
 
I would rather work with the Mooney than the aft end of a Machen converted 700 P Aerostar. It's a bad time!

An Aerostar shop was complaining about how hard it was to work on the aft end of a Mirage engine. I guess it's all in what you're use to working on.
 
Hiperbiper said:
As I have just spent 1 hour under a Piper Lance panel tracking down a problem with the panel lights my frustraions are as follows:


*%$ the knucklehead who used a transistor in a lighting circuit when a reostat would work fine.
*&%! the no-count-low-brow moron who put the afore mentioned transistors on top of the box that contains 7 rocker switches with a 1/4" gap between it and the bottom of the radio stack.
Click to expand...

I'll take transistors any day over those old rheostats. But it would be nice if they'd make them accessible.

Dan
 
Ted DuPuis said:
RVs are perfect, meaning that their builders could never screw something like a wiring harness up. Right? :D
Click to expand...

I didn't make a single boo-boo in wiring mine, but have spent plenty of time cramped up in the footwell doing upgrades. Add the darkness (still can't find a perfect under-panel light), the issue that you're doing a lot of work by braille, and the fact that if you drop something, it always ends up somewhere you can't reach, and it makes for an enjoyable Saturday. ;-)
 
Bill Watson said:
Heaven is detailed documentation, wire labels and a big RV ('10).
I imagine Hell being located behind the panel of a purchased tandem seat RV with minimal documentation and lots of original wiring ideas.
Click to expand...

It does make life interesting, but I love the challenge of making it right, and better. ;)

If I only had 2 elbows! :idea: :lol:

That is what his nice about tip up canopies. The panel can be accessed from the top while standing on your feet. :D
 
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Tom-D said:
R&R the mags/generator/alternator/tach drive, on a Mooney M20

It's easiest to pull the engine. R&R what needs it, place the engine on a test stand run it before you put it back.
Click to expand...


:vomit:
 
Bill Watson said:
...
Heaven is detailed documentation, wire labels and a big RV ('10).
I imagine Hell being located behind the panel of a purchased tandem seat RV with minimal documentation and lots of original wiring ideas.
Click to expand...

Doing behind-the-panel work on my friends RV8 is a walk in the park due to being able to remove darn near the whole panel by removing 12 screws...however, anything in the switch panel by the pilots right knee sucks big time.
A guy on the field has a Swift that has electrical gremlins all thru it. After looking at it I'm having flashbacks of being wadded up in a ball under (inside?) the panel of a Grumman 2 seater:hairraise:. It looks to have about the same "space".

What's that old saying? "Be careful what you wish for, you might get it!"

Chris aka "Spark"
 
I love crawling all the way back in a Cessna fuselage and buck rivets. (bring your ears)
 
There's a reason I went with an all-glass panel in my RV - I can pull my two primary 10" displays sitting in the seat and reach in there and work pretty easily. Quite a few RV owners have cut access panels in the forward top skin (aft of the firewall) for better access to that area from the front side, that's always an option as long as you keep in mind that the skin is stressed on that airplane and carries structural load. You need to make your access panel and mount rings strong enough to take that load if you choose to put access panels up there.
 
airguy said:
Quite a few RV owners have cut access panels in the forward top skin (aft of the firewall) for better access to that area from the front side,.
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That's one thing I will give beech credit for, panels in the fire wall to gain access to the rear of the instrument panel, but there is no other way so…..
 
For a GOOD design, look at the Socata TB series aircraft. To get at the back of the instruments you remove two screws & washers (5 & 6 in the drawing) and push a release under the panel (9 on the drawing) and the whole panel rotates out and down. (It rotates on hinges shown as number 8 on the drawing.) If you need more room you can remove a 1 foot by 8 inch access panel directly in front of the windshield. It is not perfect, but it sure is easier than anything else I've ever seen.

Jim
 

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Nothing quite matches the ease of a DA-20 pannel. 9 screws and the glare shield comes off and everything is right there.
 
Behind the panel on a Cherokee for me is with seats on the ground, pillows on the rudder peddals, and radio stack out, along with a couple of instruments. then it's not too bad. :D
 
Yep, Dammed Designers, make a Sub D connector so small you can't tell if it has all it's pins.
 
They ought to have to work for at least 10 years in the field repairing stuff designed by other engineers prior to getting their degree.
 
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