Cross country IFR over JFK. Tips?

mcdewey

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Mike
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I'm planning a trip from W29 (Bay Bridge, MD) to KWST (Westerly, RI) at the end of August. I plan on going IFR and the suggested routes take me over JFK. What's a good altitude to cross at? I'd rather go lower at least 5000. 7000 works, but 9000 would take too long.

Also, any tips on going thru that area? Obviously I have to be on my A game for radio work, but just looking for things that are unique to NYC for small GA aircraft.

And I searched POA for any previous discussions, but the search function couldn't find anything about JFK or NYC. Thanks!
 
I wasn’t on the JFK side of things, but I found approach very accommodating to fly into the Bravo during my NYC visit.
 
I fly from FL to KGON a couple times a year. It's pretty easy to get over JFK and 5K is a good altitude for them, pretty sure 7 will work as well, but I was told that higher won't get cleared. Expect to get re-routes on the way there. They'll be a mix of fixes and airways so have plenty of blank paper. The closer you get to JFK the faster the radio chatter will be. Listen carefully and talk as little as possible. I find the JFK controllers to be excellent, but they have little patience for being off your game. Once you pass KEEPM, you can usually get direct, but not always.

I find it to be a fun flight. I've actually joked with some of the controllers about the re-routes, but only when it's NOT busy.
 
I just flew over jfk at 6k this past weekend. It’s no different than any other fix/airport fly over. There just non stop atc instructions. Just use the first pause and be quick
 
I’d try ENO T224 CCC @ 5000. +5 minutes vs direct @ 120 kts.
 
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You can fly VFR over the top of the Bravo at 7500' comfortably if you stay along Long Island's south shore. Use flight following services (you'll never be denied).

I'd recommend staying above the Bravo as you will receive more vectoring inside the Bravo, along with more numerous rapid fire communications. Above it all at 7500', not so much. Every now and then (depending upon the runways in use at JFK) you'll receive a vector off shore approaching JFK (135.9), but then back on course shortly afterwards.

Pretty much you're on your own. NY ATC is very accommodating. Listen up for traffic advisories as JFK departures are called out, then climb through your altitude.

Keep your head on a swivel. And NEVER allow your altitude to drop below 7000'.
 
I've done SE VA to NH seacoast IFR many times. Every time I get directly over JFK at around 5,000' no matter what I file.
 
For that flight if IFR expect JFK V16 CCC at 5000 northbound, and return and 6000. It actually works well and is only problematic in the winter if you get icing at those altitudes.
Jon
 
I’d try ENO T224 CCC @ 5000. +5 minutes vs direct @ 120 kts.
Very nice! I'm currently watching FF and listening to LiveATC and they're vectoring arriving traffic to 4L and 4R along T224, joining just SSE of Sandy Hook. I suspect I'd get a different route if was flying there today.
 
For that flight if IFR expect JFK V16 CCC at 5000 northbound, and return and 6000. It actually works well and is only problematic in the winter if you get icing at those altitudes.
Jon
Also very nice! Would keep me out of what's currently happening at JFK (arrivals to 4L/4R on T224). Hoping there's no icing late August. :eek:
 
You can fly VFR over the top of the Bravo at 7500' comfortably if you stay along Long Island's south shore. Use flight following services (you'll never be denied).
Why not fly VFR at 7500 and listen to guard?
 
Why not fly VFR at 7500 and listen to guard?
There is so much traffic in the area that not participating in ATC services seems like a classic anti-authority dangerous attitude. IF you try for VFR advisories and can't ge them, that's one thing, but to deliberately fly over the busiest airspace in the world doesn't seem like the best idea to me.
Jon
 
If your going IFR , as long as your on your a game. The controllers will walk you through the Bravo with no hassle. I have gone through at 5and 7000 with no problem . I have also done 5500vfr with no problem. They usually have you cross over JFK then direct.
 
There is so much traffic in the area that not participating in ATC services seems like a classic anti-authority dangerous attitude.
Jon
How is complying with the rules anti-authority?
 
There is so much traffic in the area that not participating in ATC services seems like a classic anti-authority dangerous attitude. IF you try for VFR advisories and can't ge them, that's one thing, but to deliberately fly over the busiest airspace in the world doesn't seem like the best idea to me.
Jon

Oh please.. anti-authority? Like I said, talk to NY ATC, they're glad to accommodate VFR flight following requests for overflying the Bravo. Maybe during push times by not talking to anybody, when you can and should, would not be a good idea for anyone. However, filing and flying IFR when you don't need to, then thinking you're now being a safer pilot is silly.

Light aircraft flying IFR through the Bravo below 7000' in beautiful VMC conditions further loads the system up, for little reason. Wonder why in clear weather the radio chatter inside the Bravo is non-stop? Not so much while above. Arrivals are already below the Bravo and enter through the sides. Departures are called out, before they climb through the top. That cuts the volume of threatening aircraft by half.

IFR (IMO & experience) should be flown when you need it. No reason to mix it up with the airlines and commercial flights when in VMC weather conditions you can fly above the maelstrom.

Anybody getting refused Flight Following on a regular basis, anywhere? If so, maybe the ATC system in your region needs more controllers to handle IFR traffic in severe clear by those pilots thinking they're now "safe" with ATC formally obligated to separate them from other IFR flying in VMC conditions.

Looking outside with eyeballs is still considered an important part of flight safety (last I heard). It's easy to become complacent in your duty to look outside when tooling along IFR, good weather, or bad.
 
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Very nice! I'm currently watching FF and listening to LiveATC and they're vectoring arriving traffic to 4L and 4R along T224, joining just SSE of Sandy Hook. I suspect I'd get a different route if was flying there today.
V16 is T224
 
I'm planning a trip from W29 (Bay Bridge, MD) to KWST (Westerly, RI) at the end of August. I plan on going IFR and the suggested routes take me over JFK. What's a good altitude to cross at? I'd rather go lower at least 5000. 7000 works, but 9000 would take too long.
Did the trip to Westerly RI quite a few times from Frederick MD with flight following, usually being told direct south of Philly with the route over Newark and JFK at 5K.
 
There’s been some discussion why I’m flying IFR. Reasons:
1. I can get through if weather’s benign IMC.
2. Work directly with ATC for a safe flight
3. Practice working in the system in a busy place.
4. Bucket list item.

If weather’s too intense (TS, etc), I have refundable train tickets. So there’s no pressure.
 
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