Crash near me

Discussion in 'Hangar Talk' started by JOhnH, Jan 14, 2015.

  1. JOhnH

    JOhnH Touchdown! Greaser!

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    Spun Out
  2. sourdough44

    sourdough44 Cleared for Takeoff

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    Flying in dense fog at night often isn't a good idea. That's all the more true if operating VFR. RIP as best one can.
     
  3. RV10flyer

    RV10flyer Pattern Altitude

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    It should not have been a surprise. Here was the Tue afternoon AFD.

    "AVIATION...MVFR/IFR CIGS FOR MUCH OF PERIOD WITH LOCAL LIFR OVERNIGHT/EARLY WED MORNING IN MESSY/UNSETTLED WX PATTERN. PLENTIFUL MOISTURE TO PROMOTE FOG DEVELOPMENT OVERNIGHT/EARLY WED MORNING."
     
  4. tmyers

    tmyers En-Route

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    420 hours and not able to fly a 150 solo?
     
  5. brian]

    brian] Cleared for Takeoff

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    Yea, had a couple people die near me last year - one on the same grass strip. Easy to ignore when it is "over there". Hard to ignore when you've shared an overdone hamburger or two with the person.

    RIP..
     
  6. wsuffa

    wsuffa Touchdown! Greaser!

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    "not checked out in the plane"
     
  7. tmyers

    tmyers En-Route

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    That's possible but how much check out do you need to fly a 150. the numbers just don't make sense and why would she have had the keys.

    Thinking there is Paul Harvey side here, but we will likely never know.

    Condolences to her family and friends for their loss.
     
  8. rchamble

    rchamble Pre-Flight

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    I think this is the companies effort at thwarting liability lawsuits!!
     
  9. dell30rb

    dell30rb Final Approach

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    I don't think that should be a factor at all.

    Actually I was listed as a named pilot on a friend's 152 insurance some time back. The open pilot clause on that policy was very... open. "Anyone with a PP certificate or higher"
     
  10. Jay Honeck

    Jay Honeck Touchdown! Greaser!

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    Flying a plane she's not checked out in, at night, in dense fog?

    Um, there's more to this story.
     
  11. frfly172

    frfly172 Touchdown! Greaser!

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    Doesn't make sense,with over 400 hours,she should be able to handle a150. Sure there is more to the story.
     
  12. Hawker800

    Hawker800 Line Up and Wait

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    I've always known that GA has a less than perfect record, but not until joining this forum, did I realize how bad it is.
     
  13. JOhnH

    JOhnH Touchdown! Greaser!

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    What have you read on this forum that convinces you that GA is unsafe? Is it the fact that we talk about almost every accident and try to dissect what went wrong? How do you think that would work on a nationwide automobile forum.

    This accident says nothing about how safe or unsafe GA is. But it does say a lot about how people making bad decisions are unsafe, whether they are holding a yoke, a steering wheel, a rudder or a handgun.
     
  14. AdamZ

    AdamZ Administrator Management Council Member

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    Why? Just because she had 420 hours and an IR and flew bigger planes she could still suffer spatial disorientation. Doesn't matter whether its a Centurion or a 152.
     
  15. Vance Breese

    Vance Breese Line Up and Wait

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    Part of my preflight is to read the most recent NTSB reports.
    I often work hard to not just say; I would never do something that stupid. I want to learn from others mistakes so I can see when I am putting together the chain of decisions that lead to an aviation NTSB report.
    Living near the Pacific coast I have had to divert for fog more than once even on a 20 nautical mile flight.
    It is good that she knew enough to ask for help.
    It is a shame it didn’t work out.
    I have seen too many pilots imagine because they got away with something demonstrating poor aviation decision making that they are such good pilots that it was actually safe for them.
    With over 400 hours on the Florida coast I suspect she had encountered fog before and had it work out because she was lucky.
     
  16. Hawker800

    Hawker800 Line Up and Wait

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    Hmmm, don't remember saying it was unsafe. Just didn't realize there was so many accidents.
     
  17. txflyer

    txflyer En-Route

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    Fly it like you STOL it ♦
    RIP but ...

    [​IMG]
     
  18. N801BH

    N801BH Touchdown! Greaser! Gone West

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    Agreed.....

    Maybe suicide...:dunno:
     
  19. AdamZ

    AdamZ Administrator Management Council Member

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    Waaaa? Where do you get that. She confessed to ATC she was having problems navigating and was asking for directions to the nearest field.
     
  20. N801BH

    N801BH Touchdown! Greaser! Gone West

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    Stranger things have happened......:dunno:
     
  21. rbridges

    rbridges En-Route

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    that is so sad. I imagine it was a horrible feeling to realize you painted yourself into a corner and were unsure if you could get back to safety.
     
  22. dell30rb

    dell30rb Final Approach

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    Overall, light GA has a safety record on par with the safety record for motorcycle riding.

    That's not very good. But consider motorcycle riding for a minute. Most riders are wearing protective gear and riding conservatively, right? But you still see retards riding crotch rockets FAST while wearing shorts and a wife beater. I see that on a regular basis.

    Those retards are bringing the overall safety record way down for motorcyclists. Of the two riders, you would definitely agree the guy speeding on the crotch rocket with no protective gear is exponentially more likely to die in a motorcycle accident, that the guy wearing his gear and obeying the laws.

    The same thing happens with light GA. I won't go calling pilots retards, but ask any active CFI and they will tell you, there are a lot of rusty pilots flying out there. Some with very questionable decision making skills, and a general apathy towards improving their stick and rudder skills or weather knowledge. 95% of the regular POA members do not belong in this group

    If you look at most light plane crashes, probably 80% of them stem from a lack of currency or training. Read some NTSB reports and ask yourself if the pilot had been flying a part 25 airplane, with all its technology and performance advantages, would he still have crashed? The answer in most cases is YES.

    You still get some freak accidents once in awhile. But this particular crash does not sound like one of those.
     
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2015
  23. dell30rb

    dell30rb Final Approach

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    Not sure that was the case here. A 420 hour pilot who is time building likely has an instrument rating. Most 152's have a six pack and transponder. Climb, confess, comply. A controller could have given her vectors to a field with better weather, or had her do a radar approach. Lots of options

    Fly the plane
     
  24. N801BH

    N801BH Touchdown! Greaser! Gone West

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    Unless you don't want too...:dunno::confused:
     
  25. steingar

    steingar Taxi to Parking

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    To be fair, while sport and supersport motorcycles are far more likely to crash than their slower and more sedate brethren, they are only a small percentage of all motorcycles. Almost half of all motorcycle fatalities involve alcohol, and the fastest raising demographic for years has been men over 40 riding liter bikes, mostly cruisers.

    Moreover, the presence of a helmet (denigrated by the cruiser set but often worn by sport bike riders) rescues the chances of a fatality nearly a fold. My buddy's Harley doesn't even have a helmet lock, something present on every sport bike I've ever seen.
     
  26. JB1842

    JB1842 En-Route

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    Sounds like a great way cover a suicide to make sure the family doesnt have guilt over it, or to make sure there is no hassle with a life insurance payout. Act like you are needing help, but crash to kill yourself anyways.
     
  27. dell30rb

    dell30rb Final Approach

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    That was my point.
     
  28. steingar

    steingar Taxi to Parking

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    You had claimed they were bringing down the safety record, which while factually true (any crash worsens that particular statistic) it doesn't compare to the effect of alcohol.
     
  29. DFH65

    DFH65 Pattern Altitude

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    Something doesn't seem right here.

    So she wasn't checked out but had the keys??????????????

    Having said that if they have her log book that should give some more information like if she has flown this plane solo before.
     
  30. dell30rb

    dell30rb Final Approach

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    Perhaps she paid the money, got keys and a time/date to show up for her checkout.
     
  31. James331

    James331 Touchdown! Greaser!

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    Doubt she was flying very large planes with 400hrs.

    Still that's enough hours that this should not have happened
     
    Last edited: Jan 15, 2015
  32. Kiddo's Driver

    Kiddo's Driver Cleared for Takeoff

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    Because some insurance policies don't pay out on suicide. Call ATC saying you are confused...auger it into the sea...

    I'm not saying she did this. I'm just responding to AdamZ's comment nobody saying it was a suicide.

    Edit: Josh beat me to it!
     
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2015
  33. RotorDude

    RotorDude Pattern Altitude

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    It doesn't sound like suicide, but who knows.
    I'll have to admit that I have never heard a rated pilot, of any nationality, call "hello? hello?" on the radio.
    Definitely something weird going on for her to take off under those conditions with her skill level and language issues.
     
  34. evapilotaz

    evapilotaz Pattern Altitude

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    Why the reference crotch Riders are wife beaters several posts back?
     
  35. mrtyler

    mrtyler Filing Flight Plan

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    Random guess: many FBOs leave the keys in a lockbox or the office for after-hours access. There's nothing preventing a club member from taking out an aircraft in which she's not checked out.

    (...other than club rules, insurance company rules, common sense, good aeronautical decision making, and/or federal law)
     
  36. Henning

    Henning Ejection Handle Pulled

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    The one that gets me down here is the menopausal women on Harleys, the worst being petite 50 year old women on a dressed Electra Glide. If the bike falls on them, they are screwed even if they aren't pinned. You shouldn't ride a bike you can't pick up and get back on.:nono:
     
  37. Swampfox201

    Swampfox201 Line Up and Wait

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    The audio you posted sure doesn't sound like someone with 400 hours. Sounded more like a student pilot to me.
     
  38. rbridges

    rbridges En-Route

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    she sounded very unsure. Kinda surreal listening to it and knowing where it was heading.
     
  39. 48dodge

    48dodge Line Up and Wait

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    Wife beaters are a type of shirt. Ribbed A-shirts typically
     
  40. Stewartb

    Stewartb Final Approach

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    Fear affects different people differently. I don't judge accident pilots. I wasn't there. Stuff happens.