CFI Hiring After DUI — Why Is No One Talking About It?

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danek123

Filing Flight Plan
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I often see posts like, “My buddy just got hired at [major airline] with a DUI,” but I rarely see anything about how those same people actually built their time post-DUI, especially during the CFI phase.

Is it because getting hired as a CFI with a DUI is usually easier and less scrutinized than airline hiring? Do most flight schools skip formal background checks, especially if you trained there? Or is this part of the journey just overlooked because it didn’t create a big hurdle for most?

I’d really appreciate any insight, is this step genuinely not a roadblock, or are people just not talking about it?
 
HIMS was developed to let working airline pilots continue to fly after alcohol incidents and subsequently expanded. Between having more money at stake to start with and having support from things like the union, the airline pilots go through the process. CFIs and other wannabees often just fade away.

Nobody tends to run background checks of that sort in the industry at any level. In some states you're actually enjoined from doing so. In most situations, if you got your medical, they don't care.
 
flyingron said:
CFIs and other wannabees often just fade away.
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This is a very likely situation. A newly minted young pilot who has to go through the HIMS hoops to gain or regain certification is far more likely to say, “screw it!” and aim for another career.
 
Generally speaking, up until recently, flight schools were so desperate for CFIs that as long as they had a medical they had a job offer. On POA we’ve had scores of folks at the beginning of their training trying to figure out the pathway to get a medical with DUI(s). Instructing is generally not a problem; getting the initial hire with a part 121 operator is. I suspect the less desirable pilots with DUI histories either languish in the ranks of lifer CFIs or eventually take jobs that are more tolerant of pilots with a less than squeaky clean history.
 
....or, more darkly, some pilots decide they like their beer better than they like the air...

If you can get to the 121 carriers they care less because they have mechanisms in place to deal with such matters. However, hostorically, in TIGHT hiring environments, they might move such candidates to the the tail end of the stack, anticipating more expenses in the future form those candidates, than from the others.

In corporate environments, the OMEGA (an insurance) program would definitely make such a person's employment more expensive to the operator.
 
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So basically, just like our legal system. Euphemism for the criminalization of (relative) poverty.

Beyond that, im agnostic to the topic. i already take exception to the fact piston flight training pays so poorly and is a privilege extended at such a low entry bar, with very little in the way of personal skill differentiation.

As others have highlighted before, it's indeed a lower opportunity cost to lie to keep your medical on the cheap when your pay is low, vis a vis doing so in high faluting 121 bus driving. But if the point of accepting the low pay is to get to the latter income level in the first place, the scrutiny of getting thru the 121 door eventually catches up to you when you DO have more to lose. So it becomes a catch 22, so most people give up (aka "quitting while you're ahead")

On a personal level i want them out of the teaching occupation, but i know that wage depression will always be the economic reality until ab initio moves us all to the sim building (and sim jobs will then pay less too), but I concede it is a dynamic that will never change, so its best to pick a different way to make a living. Not the first or last example of "we are the reason we can't have nice things.."
 
Lindberg said:
What? DUIs are criminal. And have nothing to do with poverty.
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Not that, legal occupational remediation as a function of socioeconomic status. But you knew that and are probably just trying to be argumentative. Feel free to continue to do so; I won't debate that sidequest further as I already said I'm agnostic to the topic beyond wishing CFI work was held in higher regard.
 
StraightnLevel said:
Unfortunately, instructional careers of all sorts are undervalued in our society. CFIs are just one specific example of a much larger problem set.
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indeed, and you have said a mouthful. The other day we kinda got into it at work, as the newest IPT COA somehow led to the utterance that "people in your position [instructors in garrison] shouldn't wear the uniform". The inference being, only people in deployable billets should earn a military retirement and enjoy service benefits.

And that was coming from peer commissioned officers mind you. Honestly it's a testament of how professional we are; outside the base gate such open personal contempt 'be fighting words. I get more courtesy/benefit-o-doubt from Antifa protestors who visceraly hate me under guilt-by-association proxy, than some of my so-called brothers-in-arms. Wild stuff, this contempt for educators in this Country.

It also reminded me of the time I had to leave a chief instructor/associate professor "dual-offer" from LA Tech on the table for exactly the same stuff, 17 years ago. Didn't pencil out vis a vis flying a nuclear bomber on de facto E-5 money (Reservist O-1 on spotty orders), even in the low-inflation lost decade. Maslow and all that jazz.
 
TCABM said:
Somebody has no idea how the sausage is made. Expected from LPA; likely spoken by an iron major.
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on the bolded: That's a K-kill 1x threat, Pk=1. :thumbsup:

Ironic too, given I was one until recently (and not because of non-promotion, pin ons are progamamatically more complicated in the Reserves), and I'd never utter such classist nonsense.
 
flyingron said:
HIMS was developed to let working airline pilots continue to fly after alcohol incidents and subsequently expanded. Between having more money at stake to start with and having support from things like the union, the airline pilots go through the process. CFIs and other wannabees often just fade away.

Nobody tends to run background checks of that sort in the industry at any level. In some states you're actually enjoined from doing so. In most situations, if you got your medical, they don't care.
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When you refer to industry, are you referring to the flight school industry? Do you think that idea would apply to 141 schools?
 
bbchien said:
....or, more darkly, some pilots decide they like their beer better than they like the air...

If you can get to the 121 carriers they care less because they have mechanisms in place to deal with such matters. However, hostorically, in TIGHT hiring environments, they might move such candidates to the the tail end of the stack, anticipating more expenses in the future form those candidates, than from the others.

In corporate environments, the OMEGA (an insurance) program would definitely make such a person's employment more expensive to the operator.
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Do you think a single DUI would result in prohibitively high insurance rates that might prevent schools from hiring someone?
 
midlifeflyer said:
This is a very likely situation. A newly minted young pilot who has to go through the HIMS hoops to gain or regain certification is far more likely to say, “screw it!” and aim for another career.
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Right, but I'm generally speaking about people who have already gotten through HIMs and maintain an unrestricted 1st class.
 
Traditionally, flight schools are small businesses that don't have 20-page applications or background checks. I don't know how things are now with the CFI surplus but prior to COVID I think most didn't ask if you had a DUI or not.
 
dmspilot said:
Traditionally, flight schools are small businesses that don't have 20-page applications or background checks. I don't know how things are now with the CFI surplus but prior to COVID I think most didn't ask if you had a DUI or not.
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I suspect that may be in the process of changing with simple drivers record and credit checks.
 
The corrosion of the value of education is a meaty topic. My dm's (how quaint) are open if anyone has a fresh beer. Beyond accident analysis and occasional bike-talk I'm finding the nose-down full throttle race to gainsay/Godwin in the open forum a bit tiring.
 
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