Cessna 441 Down, 6 Fatalities, Near Youngstown OH Airport, 6/29/25

Kenny Phillips

Kenny Phillips

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Kenny Phillips
Some are reporting a "smoking hole".
Edit 2: Wrong link, I was looking for an updated one, apparently there was a crash there a year ago as well (that I don't remember, though I used to live near there.)
www.wfmj.com

Six killed in Howland Township plane crash identified

The NTSB confirmed in its statement that the plane involved in the crash was a Cessna 441 airplane.
www.wfmj.com www.wfmj.com
 
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The article (from Monday, July 22nd 2024, 10:33 AM EDT) gives a different ID for the plane;

"Khawam was the President and CEO of Uandmycar.com, the owner of the Beechcraft BE-60."

I'd also note that the September date (9/29/25) is also incorrect.

:dunno:
 
Ok, so if a year old, info should be out. I’ll rule out the weather, it looked nice, light winds.
 
Any ideas of cause?
Control lock possible?
 
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Without any adjustment to the fuel controller?

It is a long time ago, but the combustion turbine generators we had were the same turbines as the original 747's. When we changed from jet A to a different, cheaper version of kerosene, I thought that GE sent technicians to reset the fuel control system.

That was when 747's were the newest Boeings.
 
ADSB data has them only getting up to 110 kts after 7000' ground roll and only climbing a few hundred feet while in a left turn.
 
geezer said:
Without any adjustment to the fuel controller?
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No adjustment needed. Avgas use in a turbine usually falls under "emergency fuel" usage and comes with some sort of limitation based on hours or gallons between overhaul periods. From strictly a fuel type point, it would not cause this type of failure. Turbine fuel in a recip then yes it would.
 
morleyz said:
ADSB data has them only getting up to 110 kts after 7000' ground roll and only climbing a few hundred feet while in a left turn.
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Huh, thats really wild. The 441 goes like stink, I have taken one out of a 2400’ strip before. Probably the best performing turboprop I’ve ever flown. My boss ferried one 2000lbs over gross (on a ferry permit) once with a ferry tank, he says it was in the air in about 4000’…..
 
Don't know about "suddenly crashed" when the plane took 7000 feet of runway and only zooming out of ground effect for a few hundred feet. More like a terribly slow feeling flight to a tragic conclusion ahead, waving goodbye as they passed the no-go point on the runway. But sudden isn't the first mental image.
 
Its been forever since ive flown the 441 but perhaps didn't get the props forward off taxi. The prop lever was basically taxi or full tilt boogie with the option to pull them back to like 96% in flight. I cant remember if it would be enough to get to that speed though. 441 is a monster so you should recognize that instantly though.
 
skyking3286 said:
Don't know about "suddenly crashed" when the plane took 7000 feet of runway and only zooming out of ground effect for a few hundred feet. More like a terribly slow feeling flight to a tragic conclusion ahead, waving goodbye as they passed the no-go point on the runway. But sudden isn't the first mental image.
Click to expand...

Depends on perspective, I guess. May not have been all that sudden to the pilot, but to a family member that had to be told their loved one died? That's pretty sudden.
 
morleyz said:
ADSB data has them only getting up to 110 kts after 7000' ground roll and only climbing a few hundred feet while in a left turn.
Click to expand...
That's a weird one. 7000 feet ground roll? That's absolutely an abort situation, unless the pilot foolishly decided to solve a problem discovered on the roll, like the Gulfstream with the control lock in. In that case, the pilot died of embarrassment. :(
 
falconkidding said:
Its been forever since ive flown the 441 but perhaps didn't get the props forward off taxi. The prop lever was basically taxi or full tilt boogie with the option to pull them back to like 96% in flight. I cant remember if it would be enough to get to that speed though. 441 is a monster so you should recognize that instantly though.
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Unless that was one of the most incompetent pilots in history, I can’t imagine someone not moving the speed levers forward. I don’t even think it would be able to get up to takeoff speed, but maybe it could. It’s a hell of a different sound too.
 
flyingcheesehead said:
That's a weird one. 7000 feet ground roll? That's absolutely an abort situation, unless the pilot foolishly decided to solve a problem discovered on the roll, like the Gulfstream with the control lock in. In that case, the pilot died of embarrassment. :(
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Let's recall the claims Air India did an intersection takeoff because ADSB data dropped off while the aircraft was taxiing on the runway.

Even if that's what happened, the reported speed indicates something was terribly wrong.
 
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