CAP anyone?

[SkyHog]

Was considering joining the Civil Air Patrol. Seems that it would be a blast, and if there is ever any missions to fly that I can jump on, it would be kind of cool to use my PPL to help others.

Anyone here a member of CAP and can comment?

 

[wbarnhill]

You're looking for Carol She tells me that with a PPL, CAP can be a very good thing for someone wanting an instrument rating... and cheap flight time hehe. But yeah, I have plans to join up after I get my PPL as well. Hopefully I'll have the time to devote to it then. Great organization and they go great things for the community.

/Former cadet

 

[BillG]

Look into the Coast Guard Aux, too. That looked like a pretty good deal too, but I didn't have the time and the right mental attitude (couldn't deal with all the red tape and paperwork!)

Bill

 

[EdFred]

Was considering joining the Civil Air Patrol. Seems that it would be a blast, and if there is ever any missions to fly that I can jump on, it would be kind of cool to use my PPL to help others.

Anyone here a member of CAP and can comment?

You will need 175 hours of PIC time before you can fly for the CAP.

 

[Carol]

Was considering joining the Civil Air Patrol. Seems that it would be a blast, and if there is ever any missions to fly that I can jump on, it would be kind of cool to use my PPL to help others.

Anyone here a member of CAP and can comment?

Some people like it, some don't. I have found it really comes down the the squadron and the folks in it.

Here's a link to get you started with information http://www.cap.gov/

If have found that the best squadrons seem the be the *composite* squadrons meaning there are cadets and seniors (the classification of all members over the age of 18) in the squadron. Our squadron is fairly active and has a very good cadet commander. We have the glider program for the state and on a good weather weekend cadets come from other parts of the state for cadet orientation flights. Most of the squadrons in the state do powered Cadet-O flights too. We have a Blanik glider and a Maule MT-7 to tow it with. Every other month we also have a 172 attached to the squadron.

In addition we have several pilots who are mission pilots and are called upon to fly search and rescue operations. Thank goodness many of these are unintentional ELT activations but we are prepared to do and have done actual SAR.

As I said, it really depends on the people at your local level. I personally don't go in for getting all duded up in a uniform and saluting people (not that there is anything wrong with that) but then I have no military background and I am a middle-aged broad. I do enjoy the camaraderie of the glider and powered pilot group.

There's a job for everyone whether or not you fly. I am a transport pilot but am also the Finance Officer for the squadron. You don't have to be a pilot to be involved. Ground teams are a critical component of any SAR operation. Radio communications skills are highly prized.

Once you have been a member for a year you can seek further training if you are already a private pilot. If your squadron has an airplane attached to it and you have a CFI in your squadron (or a nearby squadron) you can work on your instrument rating or commercial certificate. The CFI is prohibited from charging for training. The airplane cost is considerably lower than most FBOs or flight schools. Don't expect to join just for that reason. CAP is wise to that. While they encourage further training they want more from you than just that.

Good luck. As with anything else your mileage may vary.

 

[Dave Siciliano]

I tried CAP and Coast Guard Aux. Both places had very nice, dedicated folks but just didn't fit me.

CAP met every Tuesday evening. I had a standing conflict with my business. I could get there maybe once a month and there was just no way for me to keep up with what happened inbetween. Folks with kids in the unit spent a lot of time there. Once a month on the weekend too. I just didn't have that kind of time. Was in two years and wasn't able to become a mission commander. I thought this was strange because I had been one in the active duty military, was flying as much or more than anyone else in the squadron and am commercial instrument. They had folks teaching classes that were learning things for the first time I had performed in combat conditions. They kept changing the requirements and I was taking the same training over and over from folks without a lot of experience: I have no tolerance for that and time is my most valuable resourse.

Coast Guard wanted me to use my plane to circle over Lake Texoma and look for stranded boaters on the weekend. I was willing to dedicate my time and use my plane some, but was thinking in terms of something more related to security of our nation than weekend boaters with engine breakdowns.

Met some wonderful folks I'm still friends with, but don't like to be in things where my time isn't usefully spent. Lots of paperwork. Lots of procedures. Lots of classes you had to take. Lots of standing around and waiting. They also needed a lot of things and weren't shy about asking you to do things for "the unit". If you have a lot of things they need, you'll be giving a "lot" to the unit or will certainly be asked to repeatedly. Didn't mind some, but didn't feel I should have to justify why I couldn't spend the entire weekend handing out hot dogs or why I couldn't fly cadets all day on the weekend. Perhaps I had too much active duty time. We had it deeply ingrained in us not to wear the uniform to raise money or for personal gain. Being in uniform and trying to peddle things just didn't go well with me.

I just kinda faded away. Could reconsider in the future; it can be a very substantial time commitment.

It's very rewarding for some folks and I loved flying the cadets on orientation flights. Everyone was dedicated to the kids, which was wonderful. It's very dependent on who leads the squadron and very social.

Best,

Dave

 

[Lance F]

Like Dave I kind of faded away from CAP. I very much enjoyed flying cadets on orientation flights. However, I'm not ex-military and this culture kind of struck me as a little phoney. Everything is referred to with its acronym. If you don't have your decoder ring nothing makes sense. This can be very difficult to the beginner in CAP and always came across as pompous to me. There are countless forms that have to be completed to do about anything. Sometimes getting reimbursed for gas used for the orientation flights was difficult - even after completing the many forms. Wearing an approved uniform everytime you fly, or do anything else, was a bit of a pain too. If you are into a military style organization CAP can be great. If you just like to jump in a plane and fly...forget it.

 

[Dave Krall CFII]

It's a great organization generally and I and everybody I know supports the CAP... except for when they decided any aircraft with grass and dirt stains was to be watched and suspect for drug running. That rubbed the backcountry pilot's fur the wrong way a few years before 911 but fortunately I've not heard anything like that since.

I thought seriously about joining, but after all the FAA paperwork of tests & ratings for myself & students, the thought of even more forms on a regular basis from another outfit was enough to make me get in an aeroplane and fly away as fast as I could !

 

[gismo]

I think you'll find that CAP can be good if you've got a lot of spare time to give, but not otherwise.

 

[Gary Sortor]

. . . was thinking in terms of something more related to security of our nation than weekend boaters with engine breakdowns.

Interesting comment. Perhaps, a new organization dedicated to national security in cooperation with the Homeland Security folks would interest a lot of pilots with aircraft. Write your congressman!

 

[Dave Siciliano]

Interesting comment. Perhaps, a new organization dedicated to national security in cooperation with the Homeland Security folks would interest a lot of pilots with aircraft. Write your congressman!

=======================================================

I've asked around a little. Coast Guard has a more interesting mission in the Houston/Galvaston area. The largest bodys of water here around Dallas are lakes.

Best,

Dave

 

[Carol]

I believe if you look into the technologies being introduced into the CAP realm you will find that that capability is already present. I have low level CAP overflights periodically. Low enough for me to read the insignia on the vertical fin. I'm sure they've made notes regarding my unorthodox residential dwelling in the middle of the woods. Them and the unmarked black helos that circle the area every few months. I'm thinking about painting a big "H" in a circle in my backyard.

http://www.airportbusiness.com/article/article.jsp?id=1345&siteSection=5

http://www.voicesofsept11.org/homeland_security/030905.htm

http://www.ntimc.org/newswire.php?story_id=2307&print_page=true


I feel so much more secure knowing they are looking out for me (like that old poster of Granny in an AF helmet with the caption "Sleep well tonight, your AF is on duty").

Yeh, that's the part about CAP that I *don't* like. And I won't participate either. Giving young people their orientation to aviation is one thing. Search and rescue serves a good purpose. Dressing up and playing "spy in the sky" is something else altogether.

 

[poadeleted3]

"In what civil libertarians are sure to consider a violation of the Posse Comitatus Act, which prohibits the military from acting working domestically to assist law enforcement, the Civil Air Patrol, has been enlisted to conduct "homeland security surveillance" in the United States, according to press releases issued by the United States Air Force. "

I guess it bears pointing out that Posse Comitatus doesn't apply to the Civil Air Patrol, since they are a civilian, not military, organization.

The links you posted illustrate quite well why I am no longer the fan of CAP I was when a member long ago. They have transformed themselves into an organization dedicated to spying on the US citizenry as opposed to being helpful to it. In the long run, such organizations are a threat to our freedoms, not a help to it. These feelings are why I'm not a member now, and won't let my kid be one.

Just my opinion.

 

[Carol]

"In what civil libertarians are sure to consider a violation of the Posse Comitatus Act, which prohibits the military from acting working domestically to assist law enforcement, the Civil Air Patrol, has been enlisted to conduct "homeland security surveillance" in the United States, according to press releases issued by the United States Air Force. "

I guess it bears pointing out that Posse Comitatus doesn't apply to the Civil Air Patrol, since they are a civilian, not military, organization.

The links you posted illustrate quite well why I am no longer the fan of CAP I was when a member long ago. They have transformed themselves into an organization dedicated to spying on the US citizenry as opposed to being helpful to it. In the long run, such organizations are a threat to our freedoms, not a help to it. These feelings are why I'm not a member now, and won't let my kid be one.

Just my opinion.

I think it *does* apply, Joe, since the CAP is considered Air Force Auxiliary and although the aircraft are owned by CAP, the SAR missions and many training missions are Air Force funded.

I agree with you, by the way, on the direction CAP has gone. They are still helpful in many ways though.

 

[Maverick]

I was an overly active member of the Civil Air Patrol for 10 years. I spent 5 years as the commander of a cadet squadron and had a great group of young people. Our unit was named squadron of the year in Michigan 3 out of those five years and we were a national squadron of merit (number two in the nation) one of those years. I was so proud of those cadets because it was their efforts that made our unit such a success.

I was actively involved with several practice SAR and Disaster relief missions and a couple of actual missions. I also went out on several ELT searches. It was kinda fun walking up to the front door of someone's house at 2:30 am, ringing the door bell and asking "Excuse me but do you by any chance have an ELT in home". Funny thing is those were the most common scenarios in my memory. The only ELT search I participated in was when a local doctor crashed his P-51 Mustang in a farmers field. The SAR SAT picked it up the following day and I was once again out at 2:30 am with a DF receiver walking trough the field with a Sheriff's deputy looking for the ELT. It was buried in a plowed furrow with only about half the antenna sticking out.

I also spent two years as a group commander over seeing 7 squadrons and another two years as the director of cadet programs for Michigan Wing. During my time with CAP I met a lot of people, some very very good people and others that probably should not have been members. The thing to remember is that it's an all volunteer organization and the local units are only as good as the people in them. Sometimes it's a very rewarding activity and other times it can be extremely frustrating. During my time as a group commander I had to deal with a few rather bizarre situations.

I would highly recommend the Civil Air Patrol if you are looking for something to do and if you have something to bring to the party. In the end it's for you to decide whether or not you are suited to the organization or whether the organization is suitable for you.

My involvement ended when I started a business that took all of my time. But for me it's a part of my life I will never forget and I have plenty of very fond memories and those certainly outweigh any of the not so good ones.

Jean