Caffeine Addiction

Greg Bockelman

Greg Bockelman

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Greg Bockelman
I have a Mountain Dew habit. Most people would call in an addiction and if I was truly honest with myself, I would too. I am somewhere north of a six pack and somewhat less than a twelve pack.

Having said that, I have weaned myself off of it three or four times in the past. Past the headache stage, off for several weeks or months. But the thing is, I never really noticed any difference in the way I feel. The only time the caffeine apparently affects me is if I had some just before I go to bed. So I always go back because it is my favorite drink. I like the flavor, etcetera etcetera.

If I am going to kick the habit for good, I need a substitute. My next favorite thing is Hawaiian Punch Fruit Punch, or Juicy Red. But I am afraid I am trading one issue with the caffeine for another with the artificial sweetener.

So question one. What is worse, the caffeine or the artificial sweetener?

The recommendation is to have at least 8 eight ounce glasses of water a day. Half a gallon.

Question two. Probably more than one question on the same subject.

Does the glass of water have to be JUST water? What can be substituted for the water? What about my artificially sweetened Hawaiian Punch?

Typically, I am not a huge "just" water drinker.

What say you all?
 
I'm pretty sure that it doesn't have to be water. The MDs will correct me, but I would think it's about hydration more so than anything else. Personally, I substitute OJ for most of that water. There's some issues with that (like lots of sugar maybe?), but I find it to be way easier to drink half a gallon of OJ than water...
 
Not a big water drinker either. Fish **** in it. I mix diet sodas (many of which come without caffeine) with gatorade, cool aid, and the occasional herbal tea. Speaking of herbal teas, they can be iced and or sweetened.
 
Greg Bockelman said:
<...>
So question one. What is worse, the caffeine or the artificial sweetener?

The recommendation is to have at least 8 eight ounce glasses of water a day. Half a gallon.

Question two. Probably more than one question on the same subject.

Does the glass of water have to be JUST water? What can be substituted for the water? What about my artificially sweetened Hawaiian Punch?
<...>
What say you all?
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Well, you did ask, eh?

And, yes, I ain't no doctor - just some dumb old mechanical engineer...

But.

What's the objective of the water? The problem with substituting is that a lot of the substitutes (coffee, Mt. Dew, Beer) tend to be diuretics and you are less "hydrated". Dunno about the Hawaiian Punch.

Artificial sweeteners vs. caffeine?

Which is better, getting punched in the stomach or punched in the nose? Neither is what you want.

I've talked to a number of different people who had chronic problems (headaches, joint pain) that disappeared when they gave up artificial sweeteners.
 
WOW. Talk about hard to edit.

Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe said:
What's the objective of the water? The problem with substituting is that a lot of the substitutes (coffee, Mt. Dew, Beer) tend to be diuretics and you are less "hydrated". Dunno about the Hawaiian Punch.
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Yeah. Knew that.

I've talked to a number of different people who had chronic problems (headaches, joint pain) that disappeared when they gave up artificial sweeteners.
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Hmm. Have to consider that. But I can't do it all at once. One step at a time.
 
You can look at adding Crystal Lite to your water...I do and it tastes great!
 
Stay away from Aspertame/Nutrasweet and go with drinks sweetened with Splenda.

If I drink more than a few drinks with asepertame my brain short-circuits and I have a bad day.

Any Diet Rite and Arizona Teas are great. You will have trouble finding those in some mini-marts but just go to the next one. (Some don't have diet anything anyway.)

I buy the gallon bottles of Diet Arizona Green and Peach Tea and De-caf Green Tea at Walgreens for $2.99 - sometimes on special for 2/$5. Walgreens also has the 20 oz cans for 99 cents..
 
Greg:

I have cut waaaaay back on the coffee (used to drink 6-8 cups/day), and pretty much stopped with the soft drinks too. Now, I keep a big, honkin' cup of water by my desk, and take a swig from that, and it really is better.

At home, I alternate between iced tea (Celia always has a jug of home-brewed, sweetened a bit with Splenda, best artificial sweetener there is now), and grapefruit juice mixed 50/50 with club soda.

You will absolutely feel better when you're weaned off of excessive caffeine. I have about a cup and a half in the morning, and that's it. Don't miss it.
 
I know that I should likewise cut back on caffeine and artificial sweeteners. I have taken to drinking more water (I'm finishing off my first liter of the day now), but am not really keen on the taste. Probably an unsweetened herbal tea would be the best flavored alternative. A half gallon of orange juice or the like is going to have so many calories it isn't even funny.

And as for fish using water as a toilet Michael, every single one of these alternatives is composed largely of water. Hate to break it to you! :)
 
I may have one diet coke in a day, or some unsweetened ice tea, but once i'm home, it's cold water. I felt a LOT better when I went off sweetened drinks, and for whatever reason I can drink lots of iced tea and not get the caffeine heebie-jeebies if I go cold turkey.
 
gprellwitz said:
And as for fish using water as a toilet Michael, every single one of these alternatives is composed largely of water. Hate to break it to you! :)
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Actually, I was referring to fish using their reproductive organs in it. An old quote from W.C. Fields.
 
I ended up quitting a pretty bad Coke (a cola) habit about a year and a half ago. My company started doing a free drink program, so I was getting ~a dozen 16+ oz cups of Coke a day! It was so extremely bad...

I ended up doing water (Oregon has very clean tap water, and the fountain near my desk is extremely good water), so maybe filtered water will help! It is particularly good if cold.

The Crystal Light mentioned above is quite good tasting. They have a lemonade one that is extremely tasty.

A hint that no one has mentioned: There ARE times when you want the extra 'jolt' of caffeine. Instead of grabbing one of those, you are better off grabbing an Apple! An apple will keep you up, particularly granny smiths. In addition, they are better for you.
 
Hi, My name is Keith and I'm a Diet Coke® addict.

Caffeine is probably the culprit. Not having it makes my head hurt and I get grumpy (er).
Once, down in Colombia (South America that is) I got really bad headaches even though I had all the free Diet Coke® I wanted. The locals then clued me in that even the silver canned Diet Coke® still had no caffeine in it. Duh! (Smacks head in realization of addiction)
 
I always though caffeine was the fifth food group. I used to drink two or three pots of coffee a day -- and I make strong coffee. Now I just have a cup in the morning and maybe one in the afternoon.

However, I'm pretty much addicted to Arizona Diet Green Tea these days. I probably drink upwards of a gallon a day of it on hot summer days, which probably is too much of a good thing. I'm more worried about the sweetener than the tea itself (or the caffeine in the tea).

But actually, I prefer iced green tea with no sweetener at all. I wish more companies would market totally unsweetened drinks. At home, it's easy enough to make a gallon of green tea and chill it, but it's kind of a drag to schlep a gallon jug to work.

-Rich
 
What is going to get you is the sugar. Soft drinks, fruit punch, fruit juice...all have a large amount of sugar (NINE teaspoons of sugar in a 12oz can of Cola). This is going to lead to insulin resistance, metabolic syndrome, possibly pancreatitis and diabetes. You were just not designed to process that much sugar daily. Some data suggests that sugar also fuels the inflammatory processes in the body that cause things like heart disease. It just cannot end well.

According to my reading, the problem with aspartame/Nutrasweet is that it causes the same insulin response that sugar does, without giving you actual glucose for the insulin to process. That leads to similar issues as sugar. Splenda might be somewhat better in that it does not cause this response, but it does contain chlorine and the jury's out as to what long term exposure to Splenda might do to you.

Caffeine is not as big a deal in comparison, IMO. You are getting the equivalent of a few cups of coffee a day, which many people tolerate with no issues.

Sorry, but start drinking real water. If you do it for three months, then drink a Mountain Dew, it will taste like drinking syrup...it will literally nauseate you to drink a whole 20oz bottle. Water is the thing your body wants.

Good Luck!
 
water - squeeze a lemon or lime into it to change it up a bit. The new Stevia sweetner has (so far) not shown me any ill effects
 
Ya know,...laboratory studies have shown that caffeinated mice run through mazes faster than mice that haven't used caffeine. Researchers have said those results indicate that caffeinated mice are smarter than un-caffeinated mice.

I used these study results to great advantage in graduate school. Yes, graduate school can be considered the intellectual equivalent of running through a maze.

Now that I'm long finished with school, I've found the caffeine is no longer necessary. YMWV.

:D
 
mikea said:
I buy the gallon bottles of Diet Arizona Green and Peach Tea and De-caf Green Tea at Walgreens for $2.99 - sometimes on special for 2/$5. Walgreens also has the 20 oz cans for 99 cents..
Click to expand...

Gotta watch the tea intake, it can lead to kidney stone formation.


Trapper John
 
go with drinks sweetened with Splenda.
Click to expand...

May I add an important note?
Make sure your body can tolerate Splenda, first.
On the ground, near a bathroom.
Ie don't start quaffing them mid Pacific at FL370.
 
SCCutler said:
sweetened a bit with Splenda, best artificial sweetener there is now)
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I was about to say no it's not. Then I got to thinking about what "artificial" sweetener refers to. My oppinion is there is no good "artificial" sweetner even Splenda. The best Sugar "alternative" sweetner is Aguave Juice. It can be found in at a healh food store or the "organic" isles of many chain grocery stores. It's all natural and doesn't spike the blood sugar levels. Easy to use as a drink sweetner but needs a slight reduction in other liquids if used in cooking/baking. I've said goodbye to sugar at home after finding this. I use sugar when out because I'm just not going to cary a bottle of this around to sweeten my coffee. (keep some at my desk at work tho)
 
bullwinkle said:
<SNIP>
<SNIP> Splenda might be somewhat better in that it does not cause this response, but it does contain chlorine and the jury's out as to what long term exposure to Splenda might do to you.

<SNIP>
Good Luck!
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Mr. Bullwinkle- A nit here-what's the big deal with the chlorine? We have it almost everyday in our table salt.

I agree with your comment about the long-term exposure, but not simply because it has chlorine.

The sucralose molecule simply isn't something our bodies process naturally (and it is because regular sugar has three hydroxyl groups replaced by something else, chlorine in this case, to make the sucralose). Those substitutions make it very sweet, so it is cut down with other compounds, and make the compound indigestable. We may not fully understand the entire metabolism of sucralose so it may not be something one should consume everyday over a long term.

I suspect this is where you were going, but I initially parsed the comment as something a journalist writing a scare story might write.
 
bullwinkle said:
According to my reading, the problem with aspartame/Nutrasweet is that it causes the same insulin response that sugar does, without giving you actual glucose for the insulin to process. That leads to similar issues as sugar.
Click to expand...

I'm afraid I have to do the utterly obnoxious I need a citation thing. Aspartame is the methyl ester of a dipeptide. I don't see a physiological mechanism underlying an ability to increase insulin levels (beyond the increase one would get with a dipeptide, which is far less than similar concentrations of simple saccharides).
 
steingar said:
I'm afraid I have to do the utterly obnoxious I need a citation thing. Aspartame is the methyl ester of a dipeptide. I don't see a physiological mechanism underlying an ability to increase insulin levels (beyond the increase one would get with a dipeptide, which is far less than similar concentrations of simple saccharides).
Click to expand...

The accusation is that aspartame is a serotonin promoter, aka, the-exact-opposite-of-Prozac. If they think Accutane was causing suicides....
 
Greg Bockelman said:
WOW. Talk about hard to edit.



Yeah. Knew that.



Hmm. Have to consider that. But I can't do it all at once. One step at a time.
Click to expand...

I am stupidly addicted to soda. I was drinking over a 6pack a day of Dr. Pepper, before I decided to go diet. I lost 15 pounds the first month of going Diet.

But the problem is that it is only a temporary stop gap, as I am now addicted to diet sodas, and I know that's not good for me either.

I tried Kool Aid, but it didn't really work. If you find anything, Greg, let me know.
 
SkyHog said:
I tried Kool Aid, but it didn't really work. If you find anything, Greg, let me know.
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Well, as in anything addictive, will power is a big part of it. My plan is to go to caffeine free diet MD since I am already doing diet. (have been for 25 years). Then go to the Hawaiian Punch, sugar free, and then... ? Dunno. Either water or ... Dunno.
 
jesse said:
I usually can't either..but I've found Mary See's sweet tea to be an effective liquid to sober up and wake up hang-over free.
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Jesse, I think that's more a reflection on being around Mary, than the tea she makes.
 
Ok folks, you want a really good tasting drink alternative that anyone would be hard pressed to find anything wrong with? I've got it.

Buy unsweetened carbonated water like canada dry in cans, preferably lemon-lime. Mix one can with about 1/3 cup (more or less to taste) of pure pomegranate juice. Squeeze in a slice of lime if you have an extra 5 seconds. Cold or on ice.

It's freeking awesome and you can drink LOTS of it. There is hardly any sugar or calories in it and it tastes like you are guzzling 7up.

Try it. I'm surprised someone isn't selling it yet.

And by the way, high quality locally roasted fresh ground de-caffe coffee with a touch of honey in it, hot or iced, aint too bad for you either.
 
I'm drinking a Diet 7-Up as I type this...

I can't say that I'm addicted to any kind of drink since I drink all kinds. I try not to drink caffeine after late afternoon unless I need to stay up late but I don't miss it when I don't have it. I also limit it if I'm not going be near a bathroom since it is a diuretic for me. If I drink coffee I'll usually try for decaf even in the morning but regular doesn't bother me. Strangely I like sugar (and cream) in my coffee but I can't stand sugared soda. It's way too sweet. I find fruit juice too sweet also unless it's just a hint of taste. I probably shouldn't drink so much artificially sweetened stuff but I haven't noticed that it affects me at all.
 
Trapper John said:
Gotta watch the tea intake, it can lead to kidney stone formation.
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Tea in moderation is fine... - however, milk and other heavy calcium drinks can cause calcified stones. Green tea is very good for you.

I've developed a taste for the Vitamin Water products. Some are vey sweet, some not. They're not carbonated.

In trying to be careful about my weight, I've discovered that the artificial sweeteners can have the same weight-gain effect as sugar. So I avoid them when possible.
 
I guess we're lucky here in the midwest, since the water here actually tastes quite good. I try to stay away as much as possible from soda, but will succumb to having a 20 ouncer from time to time. Seriously what's wrong with just tap water?

Although adding some barley malt, hops, and yeast makes water a lot tastier :D
 
Greg Bockelman said:
Well, as in anything addictive, will power is a big part of it. My plan is to go to caffeine free diet MD since I am already doing diet. ...
Click to expand...

Diet caffiene free Mountain Dew? What is the point of that? Is it for those who like the taste of horse p?
 
steingar said:
I'm afraid I have to do the utterly obnoxious I need a citation thing. Aspartame is the methyl ester of a dipeptide. I don't see a physiological mechanism underlying an ability to increase insulin levels (beyond the increase one would get with a dipeptide, which is far less than similar concentrations of simple saccharides).
Click to expand...

I should be equally obnoxious and tell you to do your own research, since you probably won't believe mine anyway. But I'm in a nice mood, so here's just one of many:

From Diabetes Care, the Journal of the Diabetes Association
 
Cap'n Jack said:
Mr. Bullwinkle- A nit here-what's the big deal with the chlorine? We have it almost everyday in our table salt.

I agree with your comment about the long-term exposure, but not simply because it has chlorine.

The sucralose molecule simply isn't something our bodies process naturally (and it is because regular sugar has three hydroxyl groups replaced by something else, chlorine in this case, to make the sucralose). Those substitutions make it very sweet, so it is cut down with other compounds, and make the compound indigestable. We may not fully understand the entire metabolism of sucralose so it may not be something one should consume everyday over a long term.

I suspect this is where you were going, but I initially parsed the comment as something a journalist writing a scare story might write.
Click to expand...

There's nothing wrong with chlorine per se, but in the form as it exists in Splenda, the full metabolism is unclear, as you say. Chlorine is a highly reactive element, and there's not really a way to know what it might be doing in the body without complete metabolic pathway information.

I use it occasionally myself. I'm just pointing out it's not without any risk.
 
bullwinkle said:
There's nothing wrong with chlorine per se, but in the form as it exists in Splenda, the full metabolism is unclear, as you say. Chlorine is a highly reactive element, and there's not really a way to know what it might be doing in the body without complete metabolic pathway information.

I use it occasionally myself. I'm just pointing out it's not without any risk.
Click to expand...

As an element, yes, chlorine is reactive. Out of it's elemental form, chlorine may or may not be active- depending on that other elements it is compounded with.

Chlorine isn't reactive in those particular covalent bonds in sucralose.

Please note that chlorine is present in sea salt and table salt- should we be worried about consuming these in appropriate amounts?

The metabolism I'd be concerned about is where the chlorine causes a protein someplace to confuse sucralose with another, similar, molecule and become active when it should be off, or alternatively turn off when it should be on, in a pathway of which we are unaware. Right now the chlorines in place of the hydroxyl groups simply prevent sucralose from being metabolized as a sugar.
 
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