been lost lately?

I was reviewing celestial navigation and Galilean moon's time last week and read a blurb that our armed forces don't even teach them anymore.
 
I'm confused. Did they hack the actual GPS satellite signal or the autopilot of the ship?

Yet another example of why knowing the basics and having situational awareness is important. Watch your compass perhaps?
 
CNav saved by a__ one time. Only trouble was, the navigator's "seat" was sling just behind my head..... takes a long time to hold steady and get the triangle drawn....
 
"Just to be clear, we're not telling the terrorist how to do it, we're just giving them a few ideas to add to their bag of tricks."

Great job FOX news:rolleyes2:
 
When asked "but what if there's no place to land?" my overalls-wearing CFI Oscar Duncan (not to be confused with his modern-day counterpart Tom Richards) replied "Son, they's always a place to land. Some of them is just better than others."
 
wabower said:
When asked "but what if there's no place to land?" my overalls-wearing CFI Oscar Duncan (not to be confused with his modern-day counterpart Tom Richards) replied "Son, they's always a place to land. Some of them is just better than others."
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Tom are you reading this? :)
 
Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe said:
Who needs terrorists when we have bankers?

http://www.forbes.com/sites/rickung...s-contents-then-refuses-to-pay-owners-losses/
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Norman said:
I hope the court rules for her and awards her the entire assets of the bank. Then justice would be served and other banks would be put on notice. The greed has to be stopped somewhere.
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That banker would be sitting in jail, along with his idiot employees. Breaking and entering. Theft. And anything else the local prosecutor could come up with. And THEN my lawyer would get a shot at the bank. The meanest, nastiest lawyer the local bar association could recommend. It wouldn't be pretty.
 
I'm far less concerned about terrorists than I am about stuff like tornadoes, car accidents, fires, lightning strikes... you know, stuff that is likely to happen to me or someone I care about. Seriously, look it up. You are more likely to be hit by lightning than harmed by terrorists.

I'm not saying terrorism isn't real and that we'll never get hit again- we almost certainly will. But, maybe given the statistical rarity of it we should re-think our priorities.

In regards to boats or airplanes on GPS. If you were supposed to be on a course generally going east and the GPS steered you off to the North... wouldn't you eventually notice the problem? And the idea of the ships being steered into each other... do they not look out the window? That just seems very unlikely. I could see being pushed just off course into choppy water or I suppose for an airplane dangerous weather but it just seems kind of far fetched.
 
"Son, they's always a place to land. Some of them is just better than others."
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Not many CFI's like that around anymore :). I can still hear mine sometimes: "Fly the d--m airplane!
 
wasn't this the plot of a Bond movie. If you nudge a ship of course over a few days one could place them into hostile waters and cause an international incident.

That said, since satellites have predictable paths, couldn't one just send a fleet of drones over the target with an ecm package to broad fake signals?
 
cowman said:
In regards to boats or airplanes on GPS. If you were supposed to be on a course generally going east and the GPS steered you off to the North... wouldn't you eventually notice the problem? And the idea of the ships being steered into each other... do they not look out the window? That just seems very unlikely. I could see being pushed just off course into choppy water or I suppose for an airplane dangerous weather but it just seems kind of far fetched.
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One would think.

But...
http://www.pilotsofamerica.com/forum/showthread.php?t=29092
 
Blatham489 said:
I'm confused. Did they hack the actual GPS satellite signal or the autopilot of the ship?

Yet another example of why knowing the basics and having situational awareness is important. Watch your compass perhaps?
Click to expand...
They "spoofed" the GPS signals the ship was receiving, i.e. they transmitted false GPS like signals that caused the ship's GPS receiver(s) to indicate incorrect positions.

While this is indeed possible the concept is far more complicated and preventable than the report would have you believe. First and foremost the "spoofer" has to know the ship's position fairly precisely initially or the ship will see a rather large "jump" in position that could easily be detected. Second it requires a fairly strong pseudo GPS signal to overwhelm the weaker transmissions from the GPS constellation and it wouldn't be difficult to locate the source of such transmissions if someone (the Navy?) wanted to. Third, the source would need to be located fairly close to the ship being spoofed since transmissions at GPS frequencies is very much a line of sight affair (might be less of a problem if the spoofer was airborne). Finally while the intended target might be blissfully unaware of the spoofing for some time unless they bothered to compare their position with other methods (radar, celestial, ded-reconning, inertial, etc), every other ship using GPS in the area would experience obvious GPS anomalies. Any ship within several miles would find themselves zapped from their current location to the spoofed location of the target and this would be hard to not notice unless the pilots of those ships were asleep. Once someone noticed the issue it should be easy to alert all ships in the area to use alternate means of navigation.

And as to "running one ship into another" the story is ignoring ship's radar which is the primary means of collision avoidance in the first place.

I strongly suspect that this "test" had the spoofing transmitter onboard the target ship and probably in close proximity to their GPS antennae.

Of course if the government hadn't been so eager to shut the LORAN system down there'd pretty much be no vulnerability at all. Another option would be to encrypt the GPS transmissions on the proposed 2nd GPS frequency for civilian use.
 
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