Beech Crashes on Railroad tracks

Sad news. I'm starting to think all crashes lately are not survivable. That is a topic for another thread.

My condolences to family and friends of the decease.
 
evapilotaz said:
Sad news. I'm starting to think all crashes lately are not survivable. That is a topic for another thread.
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You have to remember most of what you hear about comes from the media and the non fatals don't get as much coverage (if they get any at all). Plenty of survivable accidents out there.
 
evapilotaz said:
Sad news. I'm starting to think all crashes lately are not survivable. That is a topic for another thread.

My condolences to family and friends of the decease.
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Sad news.

If they had landed at the airport with an engine out it wouldn't have been newsworthy... so there's always a natural negative bias in what gets reported.
 
RIP,

It seems like these engine outs are starting to happen more frequently. I remember going to a maintenance school for an orientation just to see what fixing an airplane entails. I also went to see if they have a pilot program. I met some of the people that graduated from the school and NO WAY would I trust them fixing my airplane or annuals, (I might've mentioned this before). I know it's more expensive but I will pay for the best. YOUR Donkey is on the line, not theirs!


With that said, things break all the time even if 100% working in the past. What can we do as pilots to prevent things like this from happening?

Fearless Tower said:
You have to remember most of what you hear about comes from the media and the non fatals don't get as much coverage (if they get any at all). Plenty of survivable accidents out there.
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:yeahthat:
 
FloridaPilot said:
RIP,

It seems like these engine outs are starting to happen more frequently. I remember going to a maintenance school for an orientation just to see what fixing an airplane entails. I also went to see if they have a pilot program. I met some of the people that graduated from the school and NO WAY would I trust them fixing my airplane or annuals, (I might've mentioned this before). I know it's more expensive but I will pay for the best. YOUR Donkey is on the line, not theirs!


With that said, things break all the time even if 100% working in the past. What can we do as pilots to prevent things like this from happening?



:yeahthat:
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We don't really know what happened here so won't speculate about that.

But more generally engines rarely are working totally fine and then just quit. There are often signs of illness leading up to a serious issue. Paying attention to any hint of something not being right and having it checked out right away is always the best way to go.
 
There was a (so far) non-fatal by KHEF today. Bad day for GA.
 
FloridaPilot said:
It seems like these engine outs are starting to happen more frequently.
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Things are seldom as they seem. They really have to be measured to be evaluated. It is a studied phenomenon in psychology known as
availability bias. Basically, we perceive something as frequent based on how memorable it is, not how frequent it is. For example, people surveyed think they are more likely to die from terrorism than from all forms of violence combined. Not logical, but the brain isn't.
 
Not a good day for GA ,may the pilot rest in peace.
 
airbrain said:
Things are seldom as they seem. They really have to be measured to be evaluated. It is a studied phenomenon in psychology known as
availability bias. Basically, we perceive something as frequent based on how memorable it is, not how frequent it is. For example, people surveyed think they are more likely to die from terrorism than from all forms of violence combined. Not logical, but the brain isn't.
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Since 2000 74 people have died in the U.S. Due to terrorism. 150,000 by guns during same period.
 
Jimmy cooper said:
Since 2000 74 people have died in the U.S. Due to terrorism. 150,000 by guns during same period.
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and nearly half a million due to medical malpractice. Based on your line of reasoning, getting rid of doctors should be our priority
 
Jimmy cooper said:
Since 2000 74 people have died in the U.S. Due to terrorism. 150,000 by guns during same period.
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I don't think your stats are correct. There was a rather well publicized event in NYC on 9/11/2001 that killed a few more than 74.:nono:

Also, 60% of gun deaths are suicide.
 
96gs917 said:
I don't think your stats are correct. There was a rather well publicized event in NYC on 9/11/2001 that killed a few more than 74.:nono:
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Come on! Why let actual real numbers get in the way of making a point with made up statistics?
 
Looking at the satellite image of the area the railroad tracks were probably the only viable option in that immediate area. Everything else is factories, offices and tons of houses. Apparently they were trying to get to Republic for an emergency landing and if they had gotten a bit closer there's the Bethpage State Park golf courses as a potential out too. Looks like the pilot did a good job of keeping people on the ground safe in what was clearly a bad situation.
 
Jimmy cooper said:
Since 2000 74 people have died in the U.S. Due to terrorism. 150,000 by guns during same period.
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You need to do a fact check. :rofl::rofl::rofl:

It is illegal to carry a weapon in the commission of a crime so the criminals are the ones breaking the laws not legal gun owners. Yet, Master Jimmy wants to punish law abiding citizens. :dunno:

Since 2000 there have been 1,500,000 people killed or seriously injured by vehicles. Shouldn't we ban them Jimmy?
 
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Jimmy cooper said:
Since 2000 74 people have died in the U.S. Due to terrorism. 150,000 by guns during same period.
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So the guns shot the people by themselves? No criminals involved, huh?
 
SkyDog58 said:
Come on! Why let actual real numbers get in the way of making a point with made up statistics?
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96% of the people will believe anything you say if you attach a statistic to it.
 
Jimmy cooper said:
Since 2000 74 people have died in the U.S. Due to terrorism. 150,000 by guns during same period.
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What does this have to do with the accident? We have a number of people here that try to turn every thread into a political argument and plenty of others who jump in afterwards.
 
Jimmy cooper said:
Since 2000 74 people have died in the U.S. Due to terrorism. 150,000 by guns during same period.
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-This-is-why-we-can39t-have-nice-things-meme-8961.jpg
 
Dang.... I wonder how many better landing sites he glided over on the way to that spot?

(I went and looked at google earth and to answer my own question, maybe not many. :()
 
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noobJohn said:
Dang.... I wonder how many better landing sites he glided over on the way to that spot?

(I went and looked at google earth and to answer my own question, maybe not many. :()
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I listened to some of the LiveATC archive. Quite frankly, I turned it off because it got difficult as ATC repeatedly described a strip that no longer exists.

Based on the vectors to LGA, JFK, and the alignment with the old Bethpage strip, the accident aircraft would have been over Westbury when he declared. Best option nearby might have been right under him (https://goo.gl/maps/yK5yT). The problem with the bad info on Bethpage is that things get much more congested to the south than they are to the north. While there's not too much open space per se, there are several golf courses north of the LIE/Northern State Pkwy combination.

ETA: I don't think that report of a 9 mile glide is accurate. The first mention of Bethpage on the tape is when the pilot was 5 miles away. The point where the Bonanza came to rest, just short of the former Bethpage runway threshold, is only 6-7 mi from a trianglated point based on ATC's initial vectors to LGA & JFK.
 
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Damn, he had Eisenhower Park just a little south of him... Big empty parking lots at Nassau Coliseum, too.
 
rocketflyer84 said:
Looking at the satellite image of the area the railroad tracks were probably the only viable option in that immediate area. Everything else is factories, offices and tons of houses. Apparently they were trying to get to Republic for an emergency landing and if they had gotten a bit closer there's the Bethpage State Park golf courses as a potential out too. Looks like the pilot did a good job of keeping people on the ground safe in what was clearly a bad situation.
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Yes he did, but I wonder. The debris field appears to be fairly compact. I wonder if loss of control was part of the scenario? :dunno:
 
Rcmutz said:
The debris field appears to be fairly compact. I wonder if loss of control was part of the scenario
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The Newsday article says the plane collided with a crossing gate 15-20' above ground. That could certainly have tipped the flight path downward.
 
DJTorrente said:
Based on the vectors to LGA, JFK, and the alignment with the old Bethpage strip, the accident aircraft would have been over Westbury when he declared.
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Yup, plenty of good landing areas in that vicinity. Or he could have ditched in the LI Sound. Heading into the congested area around Bethpage is the worst thing he could have done (although it would have made sense if there had actually been a runway there).
 
DJTorrente said:
I listened to some of the LiveATC archive. Quite frankly, I turned it off because it got difficult as ATC repeatedly described a strip that no longer exists.

Based on the vectors to LGA, JFK, and the alignment with the old Bethpage strip, the accident aircraft would have been over Westbury when he declared. Best option nearby might have been right under him (https://goo.gl/maps/yK5yT). The problem with the bad info on Bethpage is that things get much more congested to the south than they are to the north. While there's not too much open space per se, there are several golf courses north of the LIE/Northern State Pkwy combination.

ETA: I don't think that report of a 9 mile glide is accurate. The first mention of Bethpage on the tape is when the pilot was 5 miles away. The point where the Bonanza came to rest, just short of the former Bethpage runway threshold, is only 6-7 mi from a trianglated point based on ATC's initial vectors to LGA & JFK.
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HOLY crap.......:eek:........

The lawyers will have a field day with this case...:rolleyes:
 
acrophile said:
The Newsday article says the plane collided with a crossing gate 15-20' above ground. That could certainly have tipped the flight path downward.
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That is much more than just a crossing gate. It is a cantilever signal bridge made of some pretty sturdy steel. That explains the wing being ripped off.
 
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