Basicmed findings

Yet the DOT (which oversees the FAA btw) trusts me enough to be driving an 80,000 pound rig doing 80 in the hammer lane passing your family in a minivan doing 50. Make that make sense.
so you admit in a public forum that you routinely violate operating regulations (as far as I know no state has a 80 mph speed limit for an 80000 pound rig) and you think the FAA has no reason to question your ability to control a vehicle in three dimensions at far greater rates than that?
 
so you admit in a public forum that you routinely violate operating regulations (as far as I know no state has a 80 mph speed limit for an 80000 pound rig) and you think the FAA has no reason to question your ability to control a vehicle in three dimensions at far greater rates than that?
South Dakota speed limit is 85
 
Well… the AME should start trusting REAL experts and actual practicing doctors.

Once in a while the AME might be an expert in the appropriate field (as in trusting the opthamalogical opinion of an ophthalmologist AME).

The faa should only be making sure the AME is current and qualified to be an AME. Quit deciding if someone they never met can do something they know little to nothing about, or meets standards that mean nothing to the medical world.

This shouldn’t be hard….
The FAA should take into account who the person actually is, what they do for a living, what their hobbies are, like get to know them somehow, do they volunteer in the community, do they have a family, do they coach their kids baseball, etc.

But no... all the FAA (OKC) cares about is your medical file. I'm not talking about the AMEs or the HIMS AMEs
 
South Dakota speed limit is 85
no, south dakota is 80 mph not 85. again, attention to details. also just as a side note truck tires are only rated for 75 mph. running above that would be a violation of FAR 91.13 if the FARs applied to the trucking industry.
 
no, south dakota is 80 mph not 85. again, attention to details. also just as a side note truck tires are only rated for 75 mph. running above that would be a violation of FAR 91.13 if the FARs applied to the trucking industry.
They're are speed limits in the US that are 85. Not sure if what states are, i think Texas might be.
 
The FAA should take into account who the person actually is, what they do for a living, what their hobbies are, like get to know them somehow, do they volunteer in the community, do they have a family, do they coach their kids baseball, etc.
Because the process isn’t overly-burdened enough?
 
The FAA should take into account who the person actually is, what they do for a living, what their hobbies are, like get to know them somehow, do they volunteer in the community, do they have a family, do they coach their kids baseball, etc.
That would certainly speed up the process.
 
Some people like to enact change. If you really think “the FAA really needs to get their head out of their a**es” why not come aboard set things straight? If working for a federal agency is beneath you, run for Congress.

Brad, I appreciate the work you do and this isn't directed at you, but sarcasm like this is beneath you, and with all due respect....

I spent an entire career implementing changes and improvements at Lockheed Martin. I do know ways of setting things straight in large organizations. I've built and led organizations, designed and fielded advanced hardware, have inventions and patents to my credit, wrote the company's engineering practices manual for analog electronics, trained hundreds of design engineers, led proposal teams that won over $2B in new business, became a chief engineer and established the company's chief engineer organization, and much much more. I'm retired now but I still do engineering work pro bono and serve as a volunteer leader in several charities.

I'm not an amateur when it comes to leadership and enacting change.

Bottom line - I've already made a solid contribution to the world, I've fought and won battles for many years, and now I'm going to enjoy the fruits of my labor. I've done my part and do not intend to enter a new career. Aeromed couldn't afford me anyway. It's not up to me to extract Aeromed's brains from their rectums, but yes it needs doing.

Aeromed needs more efficiency and modernized processes, not more people. Aeromed needs to learn delegation (can't they trust their own AMEs?!) and simplification. They need to look at the results of their own bloody data and see just how little impact the Class 3 has on safety.

Alas, entrenched bureaucracies never reform themselves. They only seek more money, more people, and bigger empires. The only way to change a bureaucracy is to change out the bureaucrats.

END OF RANT
 
If I correctly understand your contention, it's an example of survivorship bias since you're ignoring the gatekeeping function that both Basic Med and Class 3 medicals provide.
What about Sport Pilot? The only gatekeeping there is a driver's license. And SPs don't have medical incapacitation events any more than the others.
 
Some people like to complain. Some people like to enact change. If you really think “the FAA really needs to get their head out of their a**es” why not come aboard set things straight? If working for a federal agency is beneath you, run for Congress.
As one of the ever fewer people actually working and paying ever higher taxes, I am going to continue to complain that we never get what we pay for. How about all of these people and agencies actually do what they promised us.
And no, I don’t have to do their job, run for office, work haaarder, or pay more.
I’ve done enough.
I demand what I’ve been promised from the people already claiming (and being paid) to do it.
 
Surprise, surprise, the FAA doesn't understand medical topics.

Evidencing that there's not much difference between BASICMED and all other medicals should be reason to eliminate the medical requirement in favor of BASICMED for all instead.

MOSAIC is the right first step to get there....government gonna government, though.
 
I suppose everyone is welcome to their own opinion, but if you are comparing the medical requirements of driving a tractor trailer rig to a flying airplane, you are missing a lot of the medical knowledge associated with flying. Basic med works because the FAA has already weeded a lot of medical issues long before the pilot gets to basic med.

The FAA really doesn’t give a crap about you. They are protecting the unsuspecting passengers you load in the plane, the folks on the ground and the other pilots operating near you.

Having been in the flight instruction world a long time and worked with over 1000 students in both ground and flight instruction, the FAA is playing an important role weeding people out. I cringe when some people opt for light sport to avoid the FAA process. Many have medical conditions that are disqualifying in my experience.
How many of those medical conditions that are disqualifying fall into the realm of things like "I have sleep apnea" or "I have diabetes?"

Things that are deferred, but later after a TON of money proving that the FAA doesn't know what its talking about, ultimately result in issuance? That's where BASICMED comes in handy, and until the 3rd class medical (and possibly 2nd) are replaced by "Do you have a Driver's License?" the FAA has no business playing in the medical world AT ALL.
 
Yet the record shows no difference in the rate of accidents due to medical problems for sport pilots vs. pilots with a class 3 medical.
Not yet.

The people who argue the FAA should get out of the medical business have zero data about the number of sport students who never solo or finish the SP certificate because their medical issues prohibit them from meeting the standards.

Also an accident and an incident are not the same for reporting purposes.
 
Not yet.

The people who argue the FAA should get out of the medical business have zero data about the number of sport students who never solo or finish the SP certificate because their medical issues prohibit them from meeting the standards.

Also an accident and an incident are not the same for reporting purposes.
BASICMED has been around for over 10 years now - I know because I switched to BASICMED pretty much the day it was enacted.

Certainly, by 10 years, we'd see a difference in those numbers at least if BASICMED was ruining GA's safety record? 10 years is enough to also say that its about as effective as no medical at all.
 
As one of the ever fewer people actually working and paying ever higher taxes, I am going to continue to complain that we never get what we pay for. How about all of these people and agencies actually do what they promised us.
And no, I don’t have to do their job, run for office, work haaarder, or pay more.
I’ve done enough.
I demand what I’ve been promised from the people already claiming (and being paid) to do it.
I'd like to add something to this thread... if you go to an AME and get deferred, I think the FAA needs to pay for those extra services. The extra evaluations needed by specialists. And if they won't do that, they should allow the medicals to be covered under your health insurance.

They talk about people just giving up on becoming a pilot because of their ways and this also has alot to do with it. Dr. Susan Northrop has said that they're working on ways to decrease the backlog at the FAA, which also has to do with it, but for me to spend thousands of dollars on specialists out of pocket "hoping" that OKC will issue me a medical, that's a deal breaker for me.

So I'm asking the FAA (if they even read these) to either pay for all of it after the initial AME deferral, or allow these doctors to bill insurance for it.
 
I'd like to add something to this thread... if you go to an AME and get deferred, I think the FAA needs to pay for those extra services. The extra evaluations needed by specialists. And if they won't do that, they should allow the medicals to be covered under your health insurance.

They talk about people just giving up on becoming a pilot because of their ways and this also has alot to do with it. Dr. Susan Northrop has said that they're working on ways to decrease the backlog at the FAA, which also has to do with it, but for me to spend thousands of dollars on specialists out of pocket "hoping" that OKC will issue me a medical, that's a deal breaker for me.

So I'm asking the FAA (if they even read these) to either pay for all of it after the initial AME deferral, or allow these doctors to bill insurance for it.
While we’re at it, the FAA should pay for all of the remedial training and recheck(s) after a checkride bust, and pay maintenance for every POS airplane bought without an adequate prepurchase inspection, and…
 
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While we’re at it, the FAA should pay for all of the remedial training and recheck(s) after a checkride bust, and pay maintenance for every who POS airplane bought without an adequate prepurchase inspection, and…
I think they should set a cap for what a DPE can charge for checkrides, but for the prepurchase inspection... that's on you bud. Does the FAA require you to do a prepurchase inspection? Does it say anywhere that when you buy a plane, the FAA won't allow you to own it without the inspection?
 
I think they should set a cap for what a DPE can charge for checkrides,
So decrease DPE experience and availability…
but for the prepurchase inspection... that's on you bud. Does the FAA require you to do a prepurchase inspection? Does it say anywhere that when you buy a plane, the FAA won't allow you to own it without the inspection?
You don’t need a medical to own an airplane, either.
 
So decrease DPE experience and availability…

You don’t need a medical to own an airplane, either.
Designated Pilot Examiner (DPE) checkride costs typically range from $600 to $1,500+, with $800–$1,000 being common for Private Pilot checkrides.

And only 4 hours to do it in? Seems a little steep to me.
 
Designated Pilot Examiner (DPE) checkride costs typically range from $600 to $1,500+, with $800–$1,000 being common for Private Pilot checkrides.

And only 4 hours to do it in? Seems a little steep to me.
Unfortunately your opinion doesn’t change what would happen if the government controlled pricing.
 
I'd like to add something to this thread... if you go to an AME and get deferred, I think the FAA needs to pay for those extra services. The extra evaluations needed by specialists. And if they won't do that, they should allow the medicals to be covered under your health insurance.
I think that would require an act of Congress.
 
The people who argue the FAA should get out of the medical business have zero data about the number of sport students who never solo or finish the SP certificate because their medical issues prohibit them from meeting the standards.
If the assertion is that the reason sport pilots don't have more medically-related accidents than medical-certificate holders is that the performance standards one has to meet in order to complete SP training and pass the checkride are preventing people with relevant medical issues from getting an SP certificate, it sounds like the training and checkride standards are solving the problem.
 
How many of those medical conditions that are disqualifying fall into the realm of things like "I have sleep apnea" or "I have diabetes?"

Things that are deferred, but later after a TON of money proving that the FAA doesn't know what it’s talking about, ultimately result in issuance? That's where BASICMED comes in handy, and until the 3rd class medical (and possibly 2nd) are replaced by "Do you have a Driver's License?" the FAA has no business playing in the medical world AT ALL.

If the assertion is that the reason sport pilots don't have more medically-related accidents than medical-certificate holders is that the performance standards one has to meet in order to complete SP training and pass the checkride are preventing people with relevant medical issues from getting an SP certificate, it sounds like the training and checkride standards are solving the problem.
This has nothing to do specifically with sport pilots. I am specifically addressing any person who is certificated to fly an airplane with zero medical evaluation. In the situation of sport pilots, the medical evaluation is never for the pilots who also have the lowest level of flight training.

Folks act like they don’t have to share the traffic pattern or ramp areas with ALL the people they think have a right to fly if they want to. There are people who shouldn’t be PIC in an airplane due to medical issues. Statistically the percentage of flight hours for sport is currently very low.

If you think flying around people with a history of ADD (a mix inattention, poor focus, disorganization, procrastination, forgetfulness, impulsivity) is a good idea, your risk assessment and mine differ.
 
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If you think flying around people with a history of ADD (a mix inattention, poor focus, disorganization, procrastination, forgetfulness, impulsivity) is a good idea, your risk assessment and mine differ.
The statement I was replying to seemed to be implying that those medical conditions were preventing people who had them from completing flight training and passing a checkride, thereby preventing them from becoming pilots. If they are prevented from becoming pilots, then you will not be flying around them.
 
Statistically the percentage of flight hours for sport is currently very low.
That's irrelevant when the accident rate is expressed as accidents per flight hour. But there are a lot of Private or higher certificate holders (I am one of them) "exercising sport pilot privileges" without a medical. And no matter how hard you try to ignore the facts, they're NOT having medical related accidents at a higher rate than pilots with medicals. So please give it a rest. You can snobbishly choose to shun those lowly sport pilots who you think aren't your social equals, but it doesn't change the facts.
 
That's irrelevant when the accident rate is expressed as accidents per flight hour.
It's relevant because smaller sample sizes produce less statistically significant results. Especially when dealing with very infrequent events. This is just a comment on statistics, not the efficacy of sport pilot.
 
It's relevant because smaller sample sizes produce less statistically significant results. Especially when dealing with very infrequent events. This is just a comment on statistics, not the efficacy of sport pilot.
True, and I knew somebody would point that out. But even a small sample size will show some trend if there's a strong correlation... which does not seem to be the case here. With MOSAIC, we may have more data in a few years, and then one or the other camp may be able to say, "I told you so!"

My personal opinion is that even if sport pilot doubles the rate of medical related accidents (there is no indication that this is the case), such accidents are rare enough that it's worth paying that price for the reduction in government interference in the lives of non revenue airmen.
 
I don’t think anybody’s looking at the data, and I don’t think the data exists in the subgroup analysis of sport pilots versus other pilots, medical versus no medical. The often cited basic med study was a very small study, that was performed early after basic med implementation. Most of those pilots were recently transitioned from an active medical to basic med.

The absence of data powered to see a difference in a group doesn’t rule out there being a difference between groups. Until somebody does another larger study over a longer period of time. We don’t really have an answer on whether basic MED is posting the same results as AME medicals. Even if you wanted to do a study, it would be almost impossible because you can’t obtain the denominator of hours flown accurately enough to be useful.
 
It's relevant because smaller sample sizes produce less statistically significant results. Especially when dealing with very infrequent events. This is just a comment on statistics, not the efficacy of sport pilot.
In your estimate of sample size, are you including the holders of private and higher pilot certificates who are exercising sport pilot privileges without either BasicMed or a current medical certificate?

MOSAIC will presumably increase the number of noncommercial flights being flown with neither BasicMed nor a medical certificate, so if the sample size is inadequate, there is a possibility that statistical significance will eventually be achieved (if it hasn't already). Until then, insufficient data cannot prove that people exercising sport pilot privileges are either safe or unsafe. It can only prove that we don't know yet.
 
In your estimate of sample size, are you including the holders of private and higher pilot certificates who are exercising sport pilot privileges without either BasicMed or a current medical certificate?

MOSAIC will presumably increase the number of noncommercial flights being flown with neither BasicMed nor a medical certificate, so if the sample size is inadequate, there is a possibility that statistical significance will eventually be achieved (if it hasn't already). Until then, insufficient data cannot prove that people exercising sport pilot privileges are either safe or unsafe. It can only prove that we don't know yet.
Personally, i'd flip the logic, if the data doesn't actually show a problem, I won't spend my personal money to "solve" the scary could-be might-be problem. I also don't think taxpayers should be borrowing money to solve it either.
 
I don’t think anybody’s looking at the data, and I don’t think the data exists in the subgroup analysis of sport pilots versus other pilots, medical versus no medical. The often cited basic med study was a very small study, that was performed early after basic med implementation. Most of those pilots were recently transitioned from an active medical to basic med.

The absence of data powered to see a difference in a group doesn’t rule out there being a difference between groups. Until somebody does another larger study over a longer period of time. We don’t really have an answer on whether basic MED is posting the same results as AME medicals. Even if you wanted to do a study, it would be almost impossible because you can’t obtain the denominator of hours flown accurately enough to be useful.
That's right. There are many pilots on basic med who could be flying on an FAA medical. I am one. I had an FAA medical, got on basic med, and let my medical expire. But there's no reason to believe that I would not immediately get a medical if I applied for one. No one would expect basic med, or sport pilot for that matter, to increase the rate of incidents among pilots who qualify for an FAA medical. The more interesting question to me, is what is the rate of incidents among pilots who do not qualify for an FAA medical, but nevertheless can fly using basic med or sport
 
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