Bad week for Q400s: LAX, 7/25/2018

please tell me that united guppy cancelled and FOD inspected that engine....
 
Why in the hell was the baggage train even going there in the first place?
 
I wonder who will get dinged on this. Dash 8 pilots couldn't have known about the cart. Can't see them getting in any trouble. Looks like it's in a non-movement area, but large airports usually have ramp controllers. Is the tug driver even talking to anyone?
 
Fearless Tower said:
Why in the hell was the baggage train even going there in the first place?
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Had to go someplace. He was on the ramp access road as marked by the zipper lines and was going across to the other access road. The basic rules are that aircraft have the right of way and then proceed with caution. If an aircraft is stopped past the access road as the Q400 was, following aircraft will typically hold short of it as the 737 did. Then ground vehicles can proceed across, again with caution. The tug driver probably didn’t anticipate the Q400 powering up to taxi just then or didn’t realize that its prop blast could be as strong as it was. Operating in that environment requires some knowledge along with alertness and judgment. The people doing the job frequently aren’t the brightest that society has to offer.
 
Really just a case of bad timing. The Q400 powered up just as the driver decided to drive thru. Neither could have anticipated the others actions.
 
Fearless Tower said:
Why in the hell was the baggage train even going there in the first place?
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To the other side

arnoha said:
I wonder who will get dinged on this. Dash 8 pilots couldn't have known about the cart. Can't see them getting in any trouble. Looks like it's in a non-movement area, but large airports usually have ramp controllers. Is the tug driver even talking to anyone?
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Tug driver is responsible.
Most large airports have ramp control Most also have designated lanes of travel for service vehicles that are not controlled. Ground vehicles give way to airplanes and everyone just plays nice... most of the time.

Most likely tug wasn’t talking to anyone nor required to do so.
 
arnoha said:
Dash 8 pilots couldn't have known about the cart. Can't see them getting in any trouble. Looks like it's in a non-movement area, but large airports usually have ramp controllers. Is the tug driver even talking to anyone?
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You're right that the Dash pilots aren't to blame here, but it also wasn't a non-movement area (the Dash and 737 were sitting on taxiway C). Regardless, the tug likely isn't talking to anyone - he's got special rules to give way to the airplanes and lanes to follow, but he does his thing independent of what Ground (or Ramp, if this were a ramp area) does. As Tarheel just said above - everyone usually plays nice. It was just a poor decision by the tug driver to drive behind the Dash - he might not have thought the prop wash would have been as strong as it was. Oops! :)

Some airports can get a little crazy with all the vehicles moving around as you're taxiing - LAX is definitely one of them. Luggage carts, catering trucks, passenger busses - it can get nuts. I used to fly with a guy that'd say, "It's like we're taxiing around in a ****ing Mad Max movie!"
 
kayoh190 said:
You're right that the Dash pilots aren't to blame here, but it also wasn't a non-movement area (the Dash and 737 were sitting on taxiway C). Regardless, the tug likely isn't talking to anyone - he's got special rules to give way to the airplanes and lanes to follow, but he does his thing independent of what Ground (or Ramp, if this were a ramp area) does. As Tarheel just said above - everyone usually plays nice. It was just a poor decision by the tug driver to drive behind the Dash - he might not have thought the prop wash would have been as strong as it was. Oops! :)

Some airports can get a little crazy with all the vehicles moving around as you're taxiing - LAX is definitely one of them. Luggage carts, catering trucks, passenger busses - it can get nuts. I used to fly with a guy that'd say, "It's like we're taxiing around in a ****ing Mad Max movie!"
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OK, I said non-movement because I was looking for the movement transition line, but if the entire ramp is a movement area (guess it would be if there's a ramp controller), such a line wouldn't be there. My bad.

Thanks for the clarification on how that works.

I noticed the other containers didn't budge. Are they just set on the trailer or are they supposed to be affixed better than that? Maybe the tug's oops wasn't choosing to cross, but rather failing to check how secure the load was.
 
I don't know, but want to ask.

It may not be a right-of-way problem for the tug driver, but shouldn't those compartments be latched down during transport? Sometimes the "high wind" will be from mother nature, not from the prop wash.

Just askin'
 
Has to be the fault of the ramp person. Trickle down theory.
 
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