Average age of Car/Truck fleet reaches all time high of 11.4 years

I find myself driving the Prius like a granny because of the display. It shows the EV mode(elec) in green, the engine power mode in darker green and when you step on it to get on the fwy, it goes into the red POWER zone. Of course, the red power zone translates to anything over 1/3 throttle, so acceleration is less than stellar. However, when you stomp down on it, the CVT trans will spool it up and go, but I think the 0-60 is measured in hours, not seconds.
 
No surprise in the Chicago area, but C4C was the biggest joke. I went to dealer 1 with a 1997 Chrysler Town & Country and a trans about to munch some asphalt. Didn't have the car we wanted but said we could come back. Over to dealer 2. Didn't have what we wanted at all. Dealer 1 next day - sorry, no more C4C because we don't want to deal with the paperwork (2 days before the end). Seal the deal at dealer 2. 5 days later, 3 days post expiration, C4C finally stops accepting submissions, and dealer 2 says "We couldn't get the paperwork through. Give us $4500 or the car back." Car went back. Gave the Chrysler to family and they have been running it since, went back to dealer one and they split the difference with us on the C4C discount.

Moral of the story? Well a few, but the one I will write is I am never buying new again. There are too many nice used cars to that I still want to drive, to drop the 50% plus depreciation on a new one.

Current cars
2009 Mini Cooper S (we have joint custody with the dealer mx bay)
2006 Infiniti FX35 (we will drive it until the frame rusts through some more)
 
woo hooo . . .found one. Found a guy who wants a 1965 Mustang and has a 1964 F100 thats been resto'd . . . . trade straight across!
 
denverpilot said:
Do it. I want a ride. I'll even help push when it breaks down. ;)

Why two Wranglers? His and hers? Or do you have one set up for rock crawling?
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Mari made me an offer that I couldn't refuse ... remember last year when Kimberley was looking for a car and Mari said "I have one that I'm not using - thinking about selling it." ... So ... the '95 got relegated to kids' spare, maybe a crawler conversion, maybe a .... yeah, dunno ... but hey, a guy can NEVER have too many Jeeps! :)
 
In 2005, we bought a Saab 93 convertible. It's mosty a summer car but with stupid CT gas prices it was time to park the Rover. The saab has become the daily driver.

It just turned 63K last week and has required almost no maintenance! Tires last year and just did rear brakes a few months ago. Thats it besides oil changes! Extremely reliable and we see about 29-30 MPG highway.
 
I have 2 identical 130k mile, 1997, white, Dodge Grand Caravans that I use for business with an Auto Wrap advertising one them. Don't drive them much as they barely get 18 mpg. If the economy were stronger I would like to upgrade them to Escape, Scion or other delivery type boxy billboard type cars that get 28-33 mpg and are within 5 years old and less than 40k miles.

2002 Toyota Echo, 200k miles, that I use for deliveries. wish to upgrade to lower miles, automatic transmission: Corolla or Camry.
2005 Saturn Ion, 140k miles wish to update it to a 2008 or newer Camry.

I keep cars till they are used up as I am thrifty-cheap. But I was reaching my upgrade cycle when the bad economy hit and I just have not fully recovered yet.
 
gkainz said:
Mari made me an offer that I couldn't refuse ... remember last year when Kimberley was looking for a car and Mari said "I have one that I'm not using - thinking about selling it." ... So ... the '95 got relegated to kids' spare, maybe a crawler conversion, maybe a .... yeah, dunno ... but hey, a guy can NEVER have too many Jeeps! :)
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Haha, glad it is getting some use. If you hadn't bought it the Jeep would have sat in my garage for another year... resting. But my remaining vehicle isn't close to 11.4 years old.
 
I normally keep vehicles about 10 yrs.
My last two trucks I traded at the 10yr point.
My current rides, 2007 Tundra and 2001 Saturn.
I keep trying to trade the wife's Saturn wagon, but she can't find anything she likes.
 
Sadly the C4C program was a disaster from the beginning! The rules were confusing, EVERYTHING was subject to audit, although I never heard of anyone being audited. The website that dealers were required to use and the government spend millions on, didn't work, it was overloaded from day one. My sales manager came into the office at 2 AM to enter information on the 4th or 5th day, because it was the only time we could get on the website without it crashing.:mad2::mad2: We were very careful to follow the very complicated rules, but I know of several dealers that just made it up as they went and sold more cars than we did, but I wasn't going to take that chance. Most of the cars we traded in were not worth anywhere near the $3500 or $4500 that the C4C paid for them. Most were junkers, the disposal was a joke, lots of guys sold parts off of them, we were supposed to credit the customer anything over a certain amount if we got more than $XX for the scrap. Lots of rules that lots of folks followed and lots of folks didn't, bottom line is we sold a few cars that we might not have sold until the following months. :dunno:
And we were giving the customers $4500 in most cases and not knowing if we were going to get reimbursed!! That's a big risk on a Ford Focus with an $800 margin! :eek:
masloki said:
No surprise in the Chicago area, but C4C was the biggest joke. I went to dealer 1 with a 1997 Chrysler Town & Country and a trans about to munch some asphalt. Didn't have the car we wanted but said we could come back. Over to dealer 2. Didn't have what we wanted at all. Dealer 1 next day - sorry, no more C4C because we don't want to deal with the paperwork (2 days before the end). Seal the deal at dealer 2. 5 days later, 3 days post expiration, C4C finally stops accepting submissions, and dealer 2 says "We couldn't get the paperwork through. Give us $4500 or the car back." Car went back. Gave the Chrysler to family and they have been running it since, went back to dealer one and they split the difference with us on the C4C discount.

Moral of the story? Well a few, but the one I will write is I am never buying new again. There are too many nice used cars to that I still want to drive, to drop the 50% plus depreciation on a new one.

Current cars
2009 Mini Cooper S (we have joint custody with the dealer mx bay)
2006 Infiniti FX35 (we will drive it until the frame rusts through some more)
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N747JB said:
Sadly the C4C program was a disaster from the beginning! The rules were confusing, EVERYTHING was subject to audit, although I never heard of anyone being audited. The website that dealers were required to use and the government spend millions on, didn't work, it was overloaded from day one. My sales manager came into the office at 2 AM to enter information on the 4th or 5th day, because it was the only time we could get on the website without it crashing.:mad2::mad2: We were very careful to follow the very complicated rules, but I know of several dealers that just made it up as they went and sold more cars than we did, but I wasn't going to take that chance. Most of the cars we traded in were not worth anywhere near the $3500 or $4500 that the C4C paid for them. Most were junkers, the disposal was a joke, lots of guys sold parts off of them, we were supposed to credit the customer anything over a certain amount if we got more than $XX for the scrap. Lots of rules that lots of folks followed and lots of folks didn't, bottom line is we sold a few cars that we might not have sold until the following months. :dunno:
And we were giving the customers $4500 in most cases and not knowing if we were going to get reimbursed!! That's a big risk on a Ford Focus with an $800 margin! :eek:
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And these are the same people who came up with the ideas to overhaul our healthcare system…:yikes:
 
I'm getting close to having my oldest car in Feb 2014 when my 2006 Mariner Hybrid will be about 8.25 years old. I've been thinking about getting a new car, but have held off. I'm not sure I'll be buying a new car in 2014 or not. I probably can get more than the 56,000 miles it has now, eh?

My 2005 Honda Shadow is just over 8 years old, with all of 14,000 miles on it. I won't be buying a new motorcycle anytime soon (two guesses why).
 
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Like an airplane I think an auto will last as long as maintenance is provided, (except in those areas where they salt the roads in winter). I have a 97 F150 4X4 with a 6 banger and a standard tranny in it that runs like a top at 93k. We also have a 07 Escape which my wife calls her "get the crap out from town car" or her "leave it at the airport because no one would steal it" car. Our mid-life crises support vehicle is a 2011 Maserati Gran Cabrio.
 
Until this year I've always had the 'hand me downs'. Even my kids had newer cars than I did.

Our average car lasts us between 12-15 yrs. The problem we ran into was we didn't stagger a couple of them too well. So we now have two that are less than 4 yrs old, and the other two are around 10.
 
BillTIZ said:
I normally keep vehicles about 10 yrs.
My last two trucks I traded at the 10yr point.
My current rides, 2007 Tundra and 2001 Saturn.
I keep trying to trade the wife's Saturn wagon, but she can't find anything she likes.
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Send her this... Heh heh...

sage7uhe.jpg
 
I remember two deals about C4C.

1) Take perfectly good cars off the road, run sand through the engines, and sell new cars instead along with a taxpayer funded re-ward.

2) Take dead POS cars off the driveways, run sand through the engines, and sell new cars instead along with a taxpayer funded re-ward.

I think that cut the number of used cars down for the re-sale market. That ended up driving up the cost of used cars to where, depending on what you want, it doesn't cost much more to step up to a new car. AggieMike and a couple others are still dealing with the consequences, for better or worse. Fortunately, we bought a couple of used cars just before that program ended up driving up the prices.
 
JimG. said:
And these are the same people who came up with the ideas to overhaul our healthcare system…:yikes:
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:thumbsup: That thought has crossed my mind more than once.

It's gonna take a such a significant amount of time for the healthcare deal to get worked out (if at all) that I wonder if it will even survive the next election.
 
@ Nate: I like what that form says at the very bottom.

------------------------

Post 54 got me thinking of something I wish our American Culture did with our cars as SOP.

As pilots and (good) airplane owners, we do our best to maintain our aircraft and do a very key item: we keep records of what was done and when.

So I pose this question to the gallery: If we as a culture would do the same with our cars and trucks, would we find it both easier to find a buyer because we can prove that proper maintenance was done, and we might obtain a better selling price because we prove the proper maintenance was done.
 
AggieMike88 said:
:thumbsup: That thought has crossed my mind more than once.

It's gonna take a such a significant amount of time for the healthcare deal to get worked out (if at all) that I wonder if it will even survive the next election.
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I keep shaking my head at the Republican strategy of trying to postpone and not fund it.

And use it as a threat to get a budget deal and the ensuing government shutdown that will hurt them more than it will hurt Democrats in the public's eyes

The only way in my mind to get rid of it, is to implement it and let the American voters who voted for all those responsible for it feel the pain (along with all of us who didn't) and say “enough” and turn on their guys
 
Speaking of C4C - we bought the Mercedes vehicles we own right before. . . Jan 2009. The Convertible CLK 500 has every option imaginable - had 45k miles when we bought off lease plus it had another 30 months and 75k miles CPO warranty - vehicle was $26k out the door. Remember - this was Jan 2009 - the economy was in the toilet. We traded in a 2000 Saab for the privilege and I brought the dealer a $20k check - it was an awesome transaction in terms of value. Sticker was $73k -

I just priced the car out at KBB/Edmunds and Black Book and its about $26k - with 73k miles on it. How is that possible? Has the supply of used been cut back that far?
 
We've got
94 Infiniti J 30 (Angie's, currently broken down, likely going away within the year)
04 Saturn Ion Redline (in-progress race car, currently my daily driver)
05 Dodge Magnum (my baby, plan to keep forever, currently Angie's daily until I get her Infiniti back on the road)
 
Matthew said:
I remember two deals about C4C.

1) Take perfectly good cars off the road, run sand through the engines, and sell new cars instead along with a taxpayer funded re-ward.

2) Take dead POS cars off the driveways, run sand through the engines, and sell new cars instead along with a taxpayer funded re-ward.

I think that cut the number of used cars down for the re-sale market. That ended up driving up the cost of used cars to where, depending on what you want, it doesn't cost much more to step up to a new car. AggieMike and a couple others are still dealing with the consequences, for better or worse. Fortunately, we bought a couple of used cars just before that program ended up driving up the prices.
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What people don't consider is there is a large industry in Rebuilt motors... Businesses like Jasper Engines and all the other PER = Production Engine Rebuilders lost ALOT of usable cores since the C4C rules dictated destruction of the motors..... DUMB, DUMB, DUMB...

And as the other poster said.......... These same IDIOTS are running ObamaCare..:eek::mad2::mad:
 
Guess we are out of touch with the norm:

2012 VW Golf TDI
2012 Honda Accord Coupe
1977 Yamaha 650 (in hibernation for a while)

Gary
 
Oldest to newest:

1993 Ford E-350 based Class C motorhome
1995 Ford E-150 7-passenger conversion van (our hotel's courtesy vehicle for pilot guests to use)
2001 Lexus 300ES
2004 Toyota Matrix
2007 Ford F-150 4x4 Pickup
2008 Suzuki GSX-650F

Whoops, that last one is a motorsickle...

Factor in two airplanes, and my carbon footprint is ENORMOUS. :D
 
Jay Honeck said:
Oldest to newest:

1993 Ford E-350 based Class C motorhome
1995 Ford E-150 7-passenger conversion van (our hotel's courtesy vehicle for pilot guests to use)
2001 Lexus 300ES
2004 Toyota Matrix
2007 Ford F-150 4x4 Pickup
2008 Suzuki GSX-650F

Whoops, that last one is a motorsickle...

Factor in two airplanes, and my carbon footprint is ENORMOUS. :D
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The purple grape ?????:dunno::confused:
 
12 Honda Odyssey. 13K
08 Tundra. 58K
74 Chevy LUV no clue on mileage, currently has a 454 Small block in it
93 Mitsubishi 3000gt SL. 75K
09 Fleetwood class a Motorhome, 21K
 
2000 Kia Sportage
2001 Saturn SC1

I like older cars. I like keeping them running. I like getting grease under my fingernails. I like not having payments. I like paying low insurance rates. I like being able to drill as many holes in them, mount as many antennae on them, and install as many mods to them as I like, without having to worry about resale value or (worse yet) leasing companies. I like old cars.

That being said, I'm going to keep the Saturn as close to stock as possible because they're not making them anymore. Not that I think it's exactly a "classic" nor will ever have significant "collector value," but it does represent a closed chapter in U.S. automobile history, and there is a bit of a cult following developing.

C4C was an abomination, in my opinion.

My dad hates used cars. He always makes fun of my cars. Hey, that's fine. He has a nice Buick that he's starting to have to put money into, and that irks him; so I predict another great used car deal in my future.

The odd thing is that he won't let me do any repairs for him, even though he really can't afford to pay the mechanic to do them. He absolutely trusts my mechanical abilities -- he's especially amazed that I own a code reader and know how to use it -- and even calls me to double-check what his mechanic tells him, but he won't let me nor anyone else other than his mechanic touch his cars. Most recently it's an impending fuel pump replacement that his mechanic told him's going to cost about $600.00. I'm pretty sure I can do it for $133.00 for the pump and a few hours of time, or less time if none of the flange screws are rusted away.

But old men can be stubborn in their ways. I keep offering anyway. He seems to appreciate the offers.

-Rich
 
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N801BH said:
What people don't consider is there is a large industry in Rebuilt motors... Businesses like Jasper Engines and all the other PER = Production Engine Rebuilders lost ALOT of usable cores since the C4C rules dictated destruction of the motors..... DUMB, DUMB, DUMB...
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Not just the rebuilders as you state. Engines are the main money bringer from a recycled part (not rebuilt) perspective.

For the last 365 days, the top 10 part types and % of total revenue are:

Engine ----------- 30.57%
Transmission ----- 10.52%
Wheel ----------- 04.61%
Rear Axle Assy --- 03.39%
Lid/Gate --------- 02.33%
R Front Door ----- 01.96%
Hood ------------ 01.39%
Front Bumper ---- 01.33%
L Rear Door ------ 01.28%

So you can see that while C4C brought me lots of cars that produced some decent part sales, the program requirement of destroying the engines took away a HUGE chunk of potential revenue for me, and lots of sellable motors that might have helped Joe American keep his car running and be able to report to work to earn his taxes and earn money to fuel his small corner of the economy.

(It's fascinating how fast the curve flattens out after the 6th part, isn't it? When I'm working auctions to buy cars, I'm actually only evaluating 12 part types since that brings about 75% of my revenue. The remaining gets lumped together as "fluff")

The association I referenced in Post 1 expended great effort to get the programmed changed to permit engines to be sold. But had to concede when the alternative was going to be "straight to crusher" preventing any parts from being sold.

@John: Your stories about your manager trying to deal with the system reminds me of the hassles our local did and what I was required to do... Gawd it was total FUBAR.


And I gotta poke fun at you Californians here... It was one of the California Sentors (Boxter) who was a champion of the program. Can't you Left Coast guys keep a tighter rein on your congress critters???
 
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AggieMike88 said:
.....It was one of the California Sentors (Boxter) who was a champion of the program. Can't you Left Coast guys keep a tighter rein on your congress critters???
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Boxer and her cronies would NOT know common sense if it hit her in the side of the head at supersonic speed...:no::nonod::mad2:
 
I am willing to pay any other State to take Boxer. Please, please take her now.

I am surprised that body parts don't sell more, learn something new daily.

And Ben, I will put one hundred dollar bill on the dash of my LUV, if you can grab it within 5 seconds after I let the trans brake off you can keep it.:yikes:
 
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Skylane81E said:
We've got
94 Infiniti J 30 (Angie's, currently broken down, likely going away within the year)
04 Saturn Ion Redline (in-progress race car, currently my daily driver)
05 Dodge Magnum (my baby, plan to keep forever, currently Angie's daily until I get her Infiniti back on the road)
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One of my friends has a J30 of similar vintage. It's pushing about 300k now on its 3rd engine and transmission. The VG30DE was a good motor, but a lot of owners seemed to never change the oil in them and they didn't like it.

He also has a Q45 that just got a 5-speed put in...
 
Why would anyone buy new anyways?

My 08' vette is damn dear identical as the new one at the dealer, I pad less the half the sicker of the new model and if i wanted I could tell folks it's a new one and 99 percent of folks wouldn't know any diffrent ;)

03' Wrangler, was going to get the new JK body style, but I wanted the straight 6, not the minivan V6.


I hardly drive 10k a year, divided between two garaged vehicles, I really don't put any wear on them... why would I downgrade to a "new" vehicle??
 
This program was in 2009 I think? Most of those cars that were traded and scrapped would be long dead by now. We took in 33 cars IIRC, and with a couple of exceptions, they were sleds, $500-1500.00 cars, so the program didn't kill a lot of real good cars.;) the shortage of used cars is caused by the lack of new cars sold from 2007-2010! People kept their old cars longer and wore them out, now half the trade ins we get are junkers, 200K miles, body damage that was never fixed as the insurance check paid the mortgage etc.:dunno: But, at least they are paid for when the come in!:D

Matthew said:
I remember two deals about C4C.

1) Take perfectly good cars off the road, run sand through the engines, and sell new cars instead along with a taxpayer funded re-ward.

2) Take dead POS cars off the driveways, run sand through the engines, and sell new cars instead along with a taxpayer funded re-ward.

I think that cut the number of used cars down for the re-sale market. That ended up driving up the cost of used cars to where, depending on what you want, it doesn't cost much more to step up to a new car. AggieMike and a couple others are still dealing with the consequences, for better or worse. Fortunately, we bought a couple of used cars just before that program ended up driving up the prices.
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N747JB said:
This program was in 2009 I think?
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Yes, latter part of 2009.

Most of those cars that were traded and scrapped would be long dead by now.
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Part of the program was that the recyclers taking the cars from the dealerships had a very short time from the date of transfer to allow them to sit. We weren't supposed to let them "live" beyond 180 days.

For some, especially the ones that took in a very large number (know of one fellow that took in over 1500) that was a challenge since our systems are not set up to take such a massive influx.

As John alluded to, my contacts at the dealers also indicted that the influx of new business in such a short time period really harmed their business in the following 24 months. All the potential new car buyers showed up all at once versus the usual trickle.
 
AggieMike88 said:
Yes, latter part of 2009.



Part of the program was that the recyclers taking the cars from the dealerships had a very short time from the date of transfer to allow them to sit. We weren't supposed to let them "live" beyond 180 days.

For some, especially the ones that took in a very large number (know of one fellow that took in over 1500) that was a challenge since our systems are not set up to take such a massive influx.

As John alluded to, my contacts at the dealers also indicted that the influx of new business in such a short time period really harmed their business in the following 24 months. All the potential new car buyers showed up all at once versus the usual trickle.
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And $3 billion of borrowed money disappeared without doing anything for the economy
 
1991 Oldsmobile Custom Cruiser (my favorite car)
1976 Cadillac Fleetwood Eldorado Cabriolet
2003 Volkswagen Jetta 1.8t
2003 Chevrolet Suburban
2008 BMW 535i
2012 Ford Mustang
 
Out of curiosity, which one does Tommy ask to drive when he has a date?
 
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